Hydroboost problems

[BlackMetal]

Finished my install.

Pedal presses to the floor with zero effort. Barely returns. Brake light on the dash.

Bench bled the MC per the instructions from Dorman, it didn't come with the fittings for looping hose back into the fluid, instead just plugs, and said work the master cylinder until it became difficult to move it 1/8" of an inch, which I did patiently over a half hour letting any bubbles settle out.

I already did check the spring loaded valve in the pump that gave some people problems during their installs, mine is definitely not seized because as I unscrewed the fitting from the top of the pump it practically shot out at me.

Oh yeah last symptom:

 

[jdpolzin]

Did you bleed each individual wheel?

 

[BlackMetal]

I will do that later tonight but I find it hard to believe I got THAT much air in the system from quickly swapping the master cylinders. I'd expect a spongy pedal, not a pedal that goes through the floorboard.

Other people report being able to drive/test it before even bleeding at the wheels, so I was expecting to have some pedal feel at least.

 

[jdpolzin]

Yeah i would bleed the whole system. RR, LR, RF, LF

 

[EB1STGN]

Finished my install.

Pedal presses to the floor with zero effort. Barely returns. Brake light on the dash.

These all sound like air in the system. How well does the steering work? Are you sure you got all the air out of the steering? Just making sure you are getting power assist.

 

[BlackMetal]

Finished my install.

Pedal presses to the floor with zero effort. Barely returns. Brake light on the dash.

These all sound like air in the system. How well does the steering work? Are you sure you got all the air out of the steering? Just making sure you are getting power assist.

Steering seems good, turned the wheel a bunch and adjusted the fluid level. Impossible to tell if I'm getting power assist when the pedal feels like this. That's my main concern, that it's not working.

 

[Blazer406]

I had to bench bleed with some hard line bent around and poked back into the reservoir...the larger fitting was a PITA to find.... ended up just buying a piece of 5/16 brake line....and a fitting that would fit the 9/16" fine threads..... then cut the hard line (the 18" long one I bought)...and put the new 9/16 fitting on....didn't have to re-flare... cause I just used the end that was already flared after I removed the one that came off the line.

FWIW....I am sure the air in your brake system is giving you the trouble...

It is going to be a major pain at this point to bleed it......

Your streak continues....... :frown:

 

[BlackMetal]

Yeah I thought about picking up the $8 Help kit with all the different bleeder fittings and the two lengths of hose, but I trusted the Cardone instructions that said the plugs would bleed it well enough.

 

[Blazer406]

I took one look at those plugs... and said... "What in the hell am I going to do with that?"......I did spend about 2 hours hunting at different parts houses before I gathered enough stuff to bench bleed the m/c.....

It took about 5+ full stroke pumps before I got all the air out.....

Keep plugging away....

You know how to eat an elephant?

Answer: One bite at a time

You'll get it... just don't give up.....

 

[BlackMetal]

What do you recommend I do? Pull the master and try again? Or just bleed at the wheels? All I can do is gravity bleed, don't have any vacuum tools.

 

[Blazer406]

What do you recommend I do? Pull the master and try again? Or just bleed at the wheels? All I can do is gravity bleed, don't have any vacuum tools.

I'd bench bleed it with real hard lines like I did.... or get you an assistant....and start bleeding the conventional way..... with pump hold release bleeder... tighten bleeder.... release pedal..... takes 2 people..... start at the farthest wheel away from the m/c and work back to the closest.... gonna take awhile....and patience.

Doing the bench bleeding correctly could save you a chunk of bleeding time... but isn't completely necessary IMHO..... especially since you have possibly pumped air into the brake lines....

 

[jdpolzin]

I'd bench bleed it with real hard lines like I did.... or get you an assistant....and start bleeding the conventional way..... with pump hold release bleeder... tighten bleeder.... release pedal..... takes 2 people..... start at the farthest wheel away from the m/c and work back to the closest.... gonna take awhile....and patience.

Doing the bench bleeding correctly could save you a chunk of bleeding time... but isn't completely necessary IMHO..... especially since you have possibly pumped air into the brake lines....

I did it the old fashion way with two people. Did it once and it worked great! Just took a little time but much less time than running around to the parts store rounding up materials. I like to do that anyways to get all the old fluid out of the lines.

 

[Blazer406]

I did it the old fashion way with two people. Did it once and it worked great! Just took a little time but much less time than running around to the parts store rounding up materials. I like to do that anyways to get all the old fluid out of the lines.

Great point Jeremy.... and I am going to do mine eventually.... for that very reason....need the old fluid out....

Another point....if you are using a junkyard master cylinder like I was... it took about 3 reservoirs full of fluid... bench bleeding before I got clean fluid pumping back and forth..... the junkyard m/c is far from clean.....

 

[BlackMetal]

Alright maybe I will try to get a second person to help me out. Thanks jdpolzin and blazer.

 

[Blazer406]

Alright maybe I will try to get a second person to help me out. Thanks jdpolzin and blazer.

No problem.

I will say I have had considerably less trouble bleeding brake systems when I bench bled using brake lines bent over and the ends submerged in brake fluid back into the reservoir.....

 

[buttonfly]

No problem.

I will say I have had considerably less trouble bleeding brake systems when I bench bled using brake lines bent over and the ends submerged in brake fluid back into the reservoir.....

I agree I did the same thing. I bent a couple of hard lines, then put clear tubing off of the ends of the lines so I could see if I was working the air out. Then I did a full bleed. Worked out great, and that is simply the best mod I have made in a long time. J

 

[Blazer406]

I agree I did the same thing. I bent a couple of hard lines, then put clear tubing off of the ends of the lines so I could see if I was working the air out. Then I did a full bleed. Worked out great, and that is simply the best mod I have made in a long time. J

On mine... I did a good bench bleed... and installed the m/c on the hb.... and hooked the lines up.... the first hit of the pedal....I had brakes about 1-2 in down on the pedal travel...... I drove the car 30-40 miles and still haven't got around to bleeding the brakes yet at each wheel.

I know BlackMetal doesn't want to hear that since he is having the issues....so sorry....

 

[BlackMetal]

I know BlackMetal doesn't want to hear that since he is having the issues....so sorry....

Well I officially regret that I didn't buy the bleeder fitting kit. Since I was trying to do this on a budget, $8 here and $12 was starting to add up, and I figured if Cardone said the bleeder plugs would work, I'd trust it. Now I wish I had spent the $8.

I guess I will try to bleed at the wheels today.

 

[BlackMetal]

Well just wasted an afternoon and missed a job interview as bleeding the brakes did nothing. Pumped and held the brake pedal with a pry bar wedged in the front seat, got good streams of fluid from all four wheels. Bleed each wheel 5 or 6 times. Pedal still goes to the floor and brake light is still illuminated on the dash. Had to use a brick to stop the car when pulling back in the garage.

Anyone want to tell me what's really going on here?

 

[Blazer406]

Well just wasted an afternoon and missed a job interview as bleeding the brakes did nothing. Pumped and held the brake pedal with a pry bar wedged in the front seat, got good streams of fluid from all four wheels. Bleed each wheel 5 or 6 times. Pedal still goes to the floor and brake light is still illuminated on the dash. Had to use a brick to stop the car when pulling back in the garage.

Anyone want to tell me what's really going on here?

I don't know on the brake light.... all the wiring from the PM isn't used.... so there is no connection there.... IMHO... the brake light should never illuminate now... unless there is a sensor on the e-brake..... or the brake switch on the back of the pedal is somehow shorted.

Also.... IMHO.... the prybar wedged isn't going to cut it....you must get some help.... and I still would recommend bench bleeding the m/c.

Any history on the m/c? Is it possible you have a bad one? If bad... I would think it would leak out the back of the m/c.... and run out onto the frame rail... if one of the piston seals were bad....

Keep us posted...