Got a carb turbo torn apart and

[usetaboost]

So I'm guessing you are across from the ND/SD border?? If so that's quite a ways! I am 4 hours away from wilmur if that makes any sense to you, right next to the south east tip of SD.

 

[b4black]

right about that time they introduced Gas-a-hol. It was short lived. Did a lot of carb replacements and fuel pumps.

Gasahol was not short lived. It just got a new name. Gasohol is E10 and I bet you are using it now.

Cars without computers can't adjust themselves fo the leaner mixture of E10, so there were issues in the 70's. New cars can handle this fine. On an older carb car, you just have to richen up the jets a little.

Running E85 is technically illegal in a non-FFV car, but I have never heard of anyone getting in trouble for it. It has ~30% less energy, so you will use about 30% more fuel. You will not save money using E85.

Compared to race gas, it's makes sense. Set the engine up right and E85 will work.

 

[b4black]

If you are not going to run the ESC box, then replace the knock sensor with a newer module and use the ESC module for that sensor. Then you can hook a gauge like Casper's and watch knock. No ECM needed. It won't retard timing, but it will let you know you are hurting the motor.

 

[MNcarbturbo]

So I'm guessing you are across from the ND/SD border?? If so that's quite a ways! I am 4 hours away from wilmur if that makes any sense to you, right next to the south east tip of SD.

Your about 6+ hours from me. I am about 100 miles north of the ND SD boarder. Id need to be pretty desprate for help with a 6 hour drive! Hahaha!

 

[MNcarbturbo]

If you are not going to run the ESC box, then replace the knock sensor with a newer module and use the ESC module for that sensor. Then you can hook a gauge like Casper's and watch knock. No ECM needed. It won't retard timing, but it will let you know you are hurting the motor.

So If I understand right, I cant run the ESC box as a knock retarder and a knock guage at the same time? I'd really like the ESC box to function because Id kinda like to use this as a street motor. How much would not running the ECM as a retarder effect streetability?

 

[usetaboost]

retards that drive 6 hours to hang out with retards is retarded

Make it simple: GO GET THE ESC BOX FROM THE MONTE!

You can hook up a knock guage to this setup so you can see how retarded you are:biggrin:

 

[charlief1]

Play nice Useta, he's a virgin after all. lol

 

[usetaboost]

Oh hell I'm just kidding, you guys know all I do is BS in half my posts, that's why it's so high!! Hold on let me add a few more smileys in there :smile: :biggrin:

That's better . He's doing what I shoulda done with my 87 limited that I SHOULDA kept and would've kept if I knew TURBONUT-JOB85 had an entire carb turbo setup just 3.5 hours away from me I congratulate him on not being a sheep and putting another belly button under the hood

Did you guys know you can only use 10 smileys per post?

 

[MNcarbturbo]

You callin me a retard!! Ive never been so insulted! Hahaha!!!

Thanks for the help so far, leaned a lot in a short time!

Well the cutlass that im putting the 3.8 in currently has an olds 455 in there. Dad still buys my food so I didnt fight him when he said I cant keep the 455 in there. Plus a tubo V6 is SOOOO much cooler than a yellow 455. Yes, the 455 is yellow. Bit more of a challenge, but the reward should be greater in the end.

 

[usetaboost]

That's ok. You can get the car to run just as fast DOn't tell him though

 

[MNcarbturbo]

Well after an awesome 48degree day Sunday I have a bare block. Hope to get it to the machine shop sometime this week. Found out a lot! 2 of the aluminum cylinders have melted and one has a big hole in the side. That cylinder shot shards into the oil pump which pumped little aluminum pieces into the rod berrings. Must have got the motor hot or something. So that means new pistons! This is getting expensive! Should I go with replacment cast aluminum ones or forged ones? Summit had the cast ones at $11 and the forged at $50. I'd like to spend more than $11 on pistons if the old ones melted. But, $300 plus the rebuild kit gets expensive. Is there a middle ground? Also, where does the wire from the ESM box go to the distributor? All I see are the power cord and a vacuum module.

 

[charlief1]

Well after an awesome 48degree day Sunday I have a bare block. Hope to get it to the machine shop sometime this week. Found out a lot! 2 of the aluminum cylinders have melted and one has a big hole in the side. That cylinder shot shards into the oil pump which pumped little aluminum pieces into the rod berrings. Must have got the motor hot or something. So that means new pistons! This is getting expensive! Should I go with replacment cast aluminum ones or forged ones? Summit had the cast ones at $11 and the forged at $50. I'd like to spend more than $11 on pistons if the old ones melted. But, $300 plus the rebuild kit gets expensive. Is there a middle ground? Also, where does the wire from the ESM box go to the distributor? All I see are the power cord and a vacuum module.

I see you're new at this. Go for forged for a turbo if you want it to live longer. Are you saying that one of the cylinders in the block has a hole in it or are the pistons melted? If you want an "ounch" my pistons have to be custom made and cost close to $600 just for the pistons. How much have you spent on the engine so far as a reference. You might be better off looking for a good core at a junk yard before you go to the trouble of taking it to the machine shop. Can you post some pics?

 

[MNcarbturbo]

I see you're new at this. Go for forged for a turbo if you want it to live longer. Are you saying that one of the cylinders in the block has a hole in it or are the pistons melted? If you want an "ounch" my pistons have to be custom made and cost close to $600 just for the pistons. How much have you spent on the engine so far as a reference. You might be better off looking for a good core at a junk yard before you go to the trouble of taking it to the machine shop. Can you post some pics?

Me being vuage strikes again! Yes, 2 of the cylinders have melted, and one had melted all the way down the side of the piston so it lost compression obviously. The block looks fine, just a little aluminum melted to the side on the block. I only spent $250 for the motor trans and all the accesories so I guess Im still doing fine. My budget is around 800 so I have 550 to spend on the rebuild kit and pistons. Ill be getting pictures pretty soon here. Forgot to get them yesterday. Before I haul it to the machine shop Ill have to remember too.

 

[charlief1]

LOL the aluminum things are called pistons and the cylinders are holes in the block. LOL Sorry I just had to. I think you mean the pistons melted onto the cylinder walls, right? As far as pistons you can get cast but make SURE they're for turbo application not normally asperated.

 

[usetaboost]

You don't need forged pistons for a carb'd turbo motor Hell the 87 motors didn't have forged and those have seen 10 second passes. IF you are on a budget with only 800 bucks, I would get the rebuild kit for the engine, make sure you give them the right vin code (turbo). But see if you can get the stock cam swapped for an 87 gn cam. Next before you take things to the machine shop I would get a set of 2 dot rods. DO you need them? No. But its a cheap upgrade in the strength department. IF they say your crank is no good its ok to use an n/a crank. I've read posts about those going in 11s and no breaking, I'm sure they can handle 200hp. That's cool you got the esc box

 

[Freddie's Buick]

I see you're new at this. Go for forged for a turbo if you want it to live longer......

In my humble opinion, forged pistons are overkill. Get the Hypereutectic aluminum pistons. They're less expensive and can handle anything up to 300 HP and above. The Higher torque turbo apllications building 500+ horsepower are safer with forged. If that's your goal then go for 'em.

 

[MNcarbturbo]

Let me be a little more clear. 2 of the pistons are slightly melted. Not horrible, but I certainly woulnt use them. One of the pistons has melted all the way down the side, and the other one stopped at the compression rings. One cylinder has a little aluminum on the wall, but it should be machinable. The pistons came out of the block fine, they arnt melted in or anything.
Thanks for the advice on pistons. Are the GN rebuild kits and pistons the same as these motors? Or are they different.

 

[usetaboost]

Just get the kit for the 1980 monte TURBO and you should be fine. I think the vin code is 3. Use the felpro gaskets. Don't use the crappy rope seals, use the neoprene seals. You can use RTV for joining the oilpan gaskets and suck but if you want extra insurance you can use RIGHT STUFF. It's ok to use the cheapo cork that comes with the kit, just don't overtighten them. You guys can make fun of me all you want but I use a torque wrench on nearly EVERYTHING when I do the rebuilds. Except for maybe the valve cover gaskets.

When you removed all the head bolts and rocker arms/pushrods, did you keep them all in the same order?

You can reuse all the main, rod, head bolts but if you want that extra insurance you can buy new. I would at least buy ARP head bolts. Get them for a stage 1, those should be the correct bolts. It is your choice beings you are on a budget.

Again, keep in mind you will need to get ALL your tuneup stuff, track down the correct pcv valve, get intake gaskets, exhaust gaskets, upper plenum gaskets, and other items.


And you may want to see which wastegate you have. THere's an oddball year in there and I guess it slowed the spool up a slight bit.

 

[MNcarbturbo]

Sounds good! I didnt keep the pushrods, rockerarms or headbolts in order but I did keep the lifters in order. Dad has rebuilt many motors so I trust him. Motor must have had a ton of miles on or something because the timing chain was very loose and the rockers were loose. Was the loose rockers a GM thing from the factory or are they wore out? The motor is now at the machine shop. Wont get done for a week or so though. Can't wait to see it back!

 

[charlief1]

You should be able to get everything from PAW and they'll allow (for a few bucks extra) to substitute a different cam. Give them a call.