My idle is ALL jacked up

[Turbo6Smackdown]

For my car to run right, I have to MAX OUT the fuel in the translator just to keep it running. This car likes high 12's for AFRs to smooth its idle out. At any rate, I'm sick of running like this. It's a band aid for some else. I wanted to reset my tps/iac but the procedures make ZERO sense. NONE of that can be done without letting the tuner know where the idle air adjustment screw should start off at. Adjustment of the tps is worthless without knowing this. .42 now can be .38 if I mess with the screw. You gotta say where you want the screw first, so that I can adjust around it. Not sure if the reset procedures knew that that that screw moves the throttle arm, and that the same arm is stuck to the tps lol. .42 on the TPS is WAYYYYYY different if the screw is maxed out, in the middle, or all the way in. It may say .42, but it's totally different.
Where is the screw to be first before I start all of this?
I ask because in order for the car to stay started with the low load 800 rpm fuel at zero (where it should be) I have to push the idle rpms up to over 1200 or it will stall.
When my translator was maxed at 62% added fuel to the 800 rpm range, it idled great. But every time throughout the week the idle would get leaner and leaner each day, by like .5 AFR or so. But there's nothing I can do about it as idle fuel's maxed out. There's no more room for adjustment

 

[Raeban]

The screw adjusts the IAC counts and you have to reset the TPS to be back in range after adjusting the IAC

 

[v6turbo87]

The screw adjusts the minimum air rate by setting the gap of the throttle blade. The ECM adjust the IAC count to attain the programmed idle RPM. The minimum air rate is set with the IAC unplugged-that is if it is done correctly per the factory service manual.

 

[Turbo6Smackdown]

I even did TurboDave231's really thorough reset procedure and nothing.
"
Loop status should not matter to get the minimum air rate correct. You do need to get the engine full warmed up. To set minimum air rate:

1. Warm the engine to full operating temps
2. Turn engine off and then turn the key back to ON
3. With the IAC connected, jumper pins A and B at the ALDL.
4. Wait 30 seconds and unplug the IAC
5. Remove the jumper at the ALDL
6. Start the engine
7. Adjust engine RPM to 500-550 in Drive using the throttle stop screw on the throttle body.
8. Shut the engine off and plug the IAC back in.
9. Restart the engine
10. Set TPS to .40-.44 volt or whatever your chip manufacturer specifies

At full operating temps, the IAC counts on a scanmaster or scan tool should be somewhere in the 20-40 count range at idle. The IAC counts go up as you open the throttle (throttle follower function)

If you have a vacuum leak, you may not be able to obtain a low enough idle speed during the above procedure. Air is entering the intake manifold and not going through the throttle body."

Nothing. It just is not getting the fuel. I did everything and it idles around 19 AFR, barely staying started. The fuel trims in this car are just JACKED up. Bad. I have ALL the fuel maxed at low load 800 rpm, and MOST of it pulled for every other rpm band just to keep it out of the low 9's on part accel and ful wot. I've NEVER seen this before lol.

 

[TurboDave]

I even did TurboDave231's really thorough reset procedure and nothing.
"
Loop status should not matter to get the minimum air rate correct. You do need to get the engine full warmed up. To set minimum air rate:

1. Warm the engine to full operating temps
2. Turn engine off and then turn the key back to ON
3. With the IAC connected, jumper pins A and B at the ALDL.
4. Wait 30 seconds and unplug the IAC
5. Remove the jumper at the ALDL
6. Start the engine
7. Adjust engine RPM to 500-550 in Drive using the throttle stop screw on the throttle body.
8. Shut the engine off and plug the IAC back in.
9. Restart the engine
10. Set TPS to .40-.44 volt or whatever your chip manufacturer specifies

At full operating temps, the IAC counts on a scanmaster or scan tool should be somewhere in the 20-40 count range at idle. The IAC counts go up as you open the throttle (throttle follower function)

If you have a vacuum leak, you may not be able to obtain a low enough idle speed during the above procedure. Air is entering the intake manifold and not going through the throttle body."

Nothing. It just is not getting the fuel. I did everything and it idles around 19 AFR, barely staying started. The fuel trims in this car are just JACKED up. Bad. I have ALL the fuel maxed at low load 800 rpm, and MOST of it pulled for every other rpm band just to keep it out of the low 9's on part accel and ful wot. I've NEVER seen this before lol.

I've never known that particular procedure to do anything but get people in a lot of trouble. It's a very old procedure that was taken from the factory manuals. Any time you start disconnecting this and jumpering that, bad things usually happen.
I much prefer another procedure that has always worked for me. Requires a little more back and forth adjustment, but uses the minimum air bleed screw for what it's designed for, not for setting a particular rpm.

First, get the tps close to where it should be. You'll be using the scanmaster for all these adjustments. To get the screw close to a good starting point, set it so it's only showing one or two threads on the side oposite the screw head. Not the IAC reading on scanmaster. You'll be shooting for a value around 20 or so.

If you need to raise the number, you're going to "unscrew" the screw out. Do this only HALF turns at a time. You may hear the idle change a little but come back as the ECM changes the IAC number to compensate. Check TPS, if it gets too far away from .40, readjust. Then turn screw some more if needed, back and forth between IAC and TPS to get values where you want them.

If you need to lower the number, you're going to "screw" the screw in. Do this only HALF turns at a time. You may hear the idle change a little but come back as the ECM changes the IAC number to compensate. Check TPS, if it gets too far away from .40, readjust. Then turn screw some more if needed, back and forth between IAC and TPS to get values where you want them.

Hope this all makes sense.

Your engine isn't radical enough to have to require the idle AFR's in the 12's to run right. You've got something else going on there. There's no reason it shouldn't idle just fine in the mid 13's at least.

 

[Turbo6Smackdown]

But it doesn't... I'm actually pretty good at messing with IACs and TPSs, but it won't work. I tried it yesterday just to see what was up, but that didn't fix it. I'm not sure it's a tps/iac thing. It's simply not getting the fuel. I even set the iac then started screwing the FPR screw in deeper and deeper just to see what would happen. I got it almost maxed out, and the only thing that happened was that the idle speed went up a smidge, but was still idleing at like 17 or so AFR. It's a tune/broken hard part/broken sensor thing. I just can't find it lol. I gotta say though, my car does love a mid to high 12 AFR idle though. It's not like stock but at least the engine doesn't rattle all over the place like it does at 13 or higher AFRs lol.

 

[whitehot1]

Might try posting in this forum to see if someone is close by that may give you a hand with this problem.

http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/forums/new-england-area.44/

 

[Turbo6Smackdown]

I'm not in New England. That's just for security purposes. I'm actually really close to a few SUPER smart Buick people, but because of that, understandably, they have no spare time lol.

 

[John Larkin]

Do your plugs look lean? They should be snow white at 17.0 AFR, maybe even cooked.

Maybe the injectors are clogged? If you're getting plenty of fuel pressure that's all I can think of. I originally suggested blowing out the lines. Maybe you should do that anyhow, especially the fuel rail.

 

[whitehot1]

I didn't think to ask you if you were on the FBI's 10 most wanted list and if you were into hiding before suggesting you find someone in your region to help you.

If not them, then they must be some ruff people for you not to be able to even list what part of the country you live in.

I set my IAC/TPS like TurboDave described above but i make 1/4 turns instead of 1/2 turns.

 

[Turbo6Smackdown]

Do your plugs look lean? They should be snow white at 17.0 AFR, maybe even cooked.

Maybe the injectors are clogged? If you're getting plenty of fuel pressure that's all I can think of. I originally suggested blowing out the lines. Maybe you should do that anyhow, especially the fuel rail.

Injectors pass the leak down test. Even though I'm lean at idle, I'm SUPER rich everywhere else, so I'm thinking my injectors are good to go. And a Buick god on here told me about plug reading-which was that all plug readers were kind of wasting their time because if you don't recreate the situation you're looking for, then shut the engine off Immediately and then pull the plug immediately, you're wasting your time. The second you hit the accelerator pedal, it changes the way the plugs look, effectively masking the situation you're looking for on the plugs.

And I'm not wanted lol. In fact just the opposite lol. We're just told to keep our business to ourselves in todays current situation. After I got probed once on Facebook a few years back I started taking our CI officers security classes more serious lol. None the less I actually did pull my plugs, and they were good to go. My engine instructor seen them too and blessed off on them as well. I'm thinking it's the gen 2 translator but not sure yet. I'm just not too geeked about yanking all the wires back off and returning that section of the car to stock, but I guess I must for diagnostics sake. Back in the trenches I go

 

[John Larkin]

It's got to be the chip or whatever you use to command fuel. Since you are near the buick gods, try to borrow a translator for a swap.

 

[Turbo6Smackdown]

Ok. Yanked the gen 2 translator and put back in the stock maf. With a few small tweaks to the idle air screw, she idles nice and smooth But now my IAC counts are zero. Uuuhhh, what do I do now?

Got it. The instructions I printed off of here were wrong. Exact opposite for the idle air adjustment screw lol. I was like WTF? How? Idles a lot better now, but still kinda lean. I'm as lost as a Lieutenant with a compass...

 

[John Larkin]

Back off the air gap screw until the IAC goes up a bit, 10 at hot idle is good, 20 ok also. Then reset the TPS. It's a dance.

 

[Turbo6Smackdown]

Done. She's not bad, but she's still chokin' a bit. Need more fuel in the tune. Fuel pressure doesn't help. Plus it would make my super rich tune even worse. Going to try to look for header cracks. Though that's going to be hard lol.

 

[Turbo6Smackdown]

Ok. The with the tt street chip and the stock maf, she idles pretty good, but needs just a touch more fuel at idle. (inside the tune) So then I threw the gen 2 translator back on with the stock maf as input/output, and everything else set to the correct settings per the set up guide, and she runs lean as hell. I'm wondering what it is with the stock translator that makes this happen. I asked about which settings besides the 800 rpm low load affect idle and was told none. The only way this car will idle semi decent with the translator on is with the 800 rpm fuel added to 62.5%, which is max. What on this translator do you guys think is causing this? I can see that with no other change than the translator, the idles super lean and the rpms are a tad lower. They're about 900 with no translator and about 725 with. And the map sensor shows around 15-16 inches of vac without the translator and a tad less with it. Something within the translator is now allowing my idle to get fuel. Weird.
I did this experiment just to see what would happen when the only change was the translator. Weird.

I'd love to try a normal translator, but feel guilty if I were to buy one just for experiments sakes. I'm afraid if I buy one the results will be the same. Then what do I do. Return it because it didn't work right? Anyone have one I could use for testing purposes?

 

[scgnx2]

I would give mike at full throttle a call. They may be able to test the unit or offer some advice.

 

[Turbo6Smackdown]

Yea, they will test it. I'm just curious about a normal translator as well. I'm not sure it's a malfunction in the translator as much as a mis programmed "translation" of some sort. I'll send her in anyways though.

 

[TurboDave]

I think I might have caught your issue. You stated you set the MAF IN and MAF OUT to stock MAF when running the stock MAF. IIRC, You are supposed to set the MAF IN to the specific MAF you're running, BUT.......You set the MAF OUT to the specific CHIP you're running.

 

[Turbo6Smackdown]

Yea, which is stock for Turbo Tweak.