Heads lifted and blew, pics inside!

[scot w.]

I turned the alcohol off,added some zylene and didn't hear any popping until 20 lbs. of boost. It was the alcohol.

I would be willing to guess it was the "Alcohol" it's self not being good.

I get mine at our local round track suply store and it's kept inside and is 99.8% pure and I Never had a bad batch or a problem.

SW.

 

[Alky V6]

Are you guys maybe getting some contaminated methanol? Has the gasoline blend been changed?

 

[WSLN 6]

I have been using 99% Methyl Hydrate. Here is some pics of the deck and cylinders for more discussion if need be...(driver 1/3/5 and pass 2/4/6) No scratches can be felt with the fingernail.

 

[Razor]

You cant tell if the deck surface is flat using pixs. That a machine shop has to do for you.

One thing is there is piston scuffing on the walls. Your clearances may be too loose. So the piston rocks back and forth. This may lead to oil coming up and creating problems.

What did the plugs look like on the motor? Nice and light color tan, or sooty? Was there oil on the threads of the plugs?

When you blow a gasket at low boost.. its def not alcohol. You have some issue. Guys that say I dont blow gaskets when I went to race gas dont beat on their cars as much. Once you run alcohol, your hammering away every chance you get. Just like when race gas is in the tank.. your hammering away. Every time you race the engine, its one tick closer to some failure. If you dont want to break it, you wouldnt be racing it anyways. Plenty of passenger cars breaking down everyday without using alcohol. Plenty of buicks have destroyed head gaskets without alcohol. Look at TSM/TSO for example. Racing happens.

Anyone know of an indestructible performance/race car.. please let me know. I'll buy one today

 

[WSLN 6]

The block is at the machine shop now, so we will soon see....
The pistons are Diamond Forged pieces, and were setup with clearance according to the spec sheet that was supplied with them.
The plugs have always been uniform and light tan, no oil on the threads.
I agree with you Razor on the alky comments. The car does get driven with great amounts of "spirit" when possible, but I have always tried to have a safe tune while doing so.

 

[Alky V6]

I believe the holding tank for the methanol is vented, correct?
Has anyone ever bothered to check the methanol for water content after having the methanol sit for a few days, or longer in the underhood tank?

 

[scot w.]

I believe the holding tank for the methanol is vented, correct?
Has anyone ever bothered to check the methanol for water content after having the methanol sit for a few days, or longer in the underhood tank?

+2 Not sure because you didn't post but where did you get your alky? If it was the methel hydride from a harware store I just wouldn't trust what some other company puts into a can or how long it actually sat on the shelves.

Putting a gallon at a time into the freezer to freeze out the water is always a good idea!!

SW.

 

[Razor]

The block is at the machine shop now, so we will soon see....
The pistons are Diamond Forged pieces, and were setup with clearance according to the spec sheet that was supplied with them.
The plugs have always been uniform and light tan, no oil on the threads.
I agree with you Razor on the alky comments. The car does get driven with great amounts of "spirit" when possible, but I have always tried to have a safe tune while doing so.

Start logging your alky and fuel pressure. That will let you know if somethings up.

 

[Alky V6]

I'm not sure if people realize this. You tune your car on the edge with fresh, dry methanol. Then let the methanol sit for days in a vented container, that will allow the methanol to absorb water content. The next time you take the car out, you will be running too lean.

http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/al...anol-autoignite-gas-meth-mix.html#post2388583

This is another one of those tuning variables that alcohol racers have to constantly keep track of. A person that tunes an alcohol engine will always keep the fuel cell vent blocked off between events, or he will flush the fuel out into a separate container and store it separate from the fresh fuel, and will only use that flushed out fuel to start and warm up the engine at the next event. He would never make a WOT pass on that old fuel. He would only use fresh methanol that came from a well sealed container from a reputable source for his full throttle runs.

 

[WS6]

Putting a gallon at a time into the freezer to freeze out the water is always a good idea!!

SW.

Does this work?

Please explain


..

 

[WSLN 6]

Well, the block was checked over and was found to be flat, no warping or anything funny. Sigh.....
I told them to put an RA50 or smoother finish on it and I will give Cometics a try.

 

[Razor]

What did they say about the scuffing and oil?

 

[gbsean]

I'm not sure if people realize this. You tune your car on the edge with fresh, dry methanol. Then let the methanol sit for days in a vented container, that will allow the methanol to absorb water content. The next time you take the car out, you will be running too lean.

http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/al...anol-autoignite-gas-meth-mix.html#post2388583

This is another one of those tuning variables that alcohol racers have to constantly keep track of. A person that tunes an alcohol engine will always keep the fuel cell vent blocked off between events, or he will flush the fuel out into a separate container and store it separate from the fresh fuel, and will only use that flushed out fuel to start and warm up the engine at the next event. He would never make a WOT pass on that old fuel. He would only use fresh methanol that came from a well sealed container from a reputable source for his full throttle runs.

that is interesting Don never knew about Meth absorbing water....

 

[Alky V6]

that is interesting Don never knew about Meth absorbing water....

The term is hygroscopic. Readily absorbing moisture from the atmosphere.
Methanol is a hygroscopic substance.

When a person starts to use enough methanol that it becomes a significant percentage of the total fuel intake, rather than just a simple intake and combustion chamber coolant, then you'd better start learning to take care of that methanol like it's a fuel.

 

[WSLN 6]

No other mention mention of the scuffing. They were just going to knock the glaze off of it. I will be talking to them later in the week. Thnaks for everyone's input!

 

[TurboV6Olds]

Oil in Water

Hello fellows,

I have read the post thru this thread and have some of the same problems. I have a car that I recently rebuilt and has less than 200 miles on it and have already blown the 1,2,6 cylinder HG once and now I have water in the oil AGAIN!! I have 60# inj., Alky, Walbro 340, Hot wire kit, TT chip for Alky, updated scanmaster, powerlogger. I have ran as much as 17 - 18 psi boost and had close to 60# fuel under boost while using alky and cannot get o2 above 600s. I have checked everything with grounding, changed ecm, o2 sensor (3 times). I have been told that the o2 readings are incorrect that I need a wideband to be sure. I just dismantled the engine AGAIN last night and going to have the block and heads checked again to make sure they are surfaced properly. When this happened last night I was using alky on 93 oct. and running 14 psi boost (should never blow at that setup). Could it be that I have too much timing? The TT chip has 18 - 22 deg of timing ( I think ) @ 14-18 psi boost. Could the car have had a problem from the beginning with water getting into the oil and cause the o2 reading to be wrong? Everytime I drove the car and pulled in the garage the exhaust pipes would look like they had steam or smoke coming out for about ten min. Is this normal for a turbo car? I have worked on this car for several months and becoming frustrated with the problems ( I'm sure I'm not alone ). Any help would be GREATLY appreciated.

Thanks to everyone and this site,

Rick

 

[JayC]

Hello fellows,

I have read the post thru this thread and have some of the same problems. I have a car that I recently rebuilt and has less than 200 miles on it and have already blown the 1,2,6 cylinder HG once and now I have water in the oil AGAIN!! I have 60# inj., Alky, Walbro 340, Hot wire kit, TT chip for Alky, updated scanmaster, powerlogger. I have ran as much as 17 - 18 psi boost and had close to 60# fuel under boost while using alky and cannot get o2 above 600s. I have checked everything with grounding, changed ecm, o2 sensor (3 times). I have been told that the o2 readings are incorrect that I need a wideband to be sure. I just dismantled the engine AGAIN last night and going to have the block and heads checked again to make sure they are surfaced properly. When this happened last night I was using alky on 93 oct. and running 14 psi boost (should never blow at that setup). Could it be that I have too much timing? The TT chip has 18 - 22 deg of timing ( I think ) @ 14-18 psi boost. Could the car have had a problem from the beginning with water getting into the oil and cause the o2 reading to be wrong? Everytime I drove the car and pulled in the garage the exhaust pipes would look like they had steam or smoke coming out for about ten min. Is this normal for a turbo car? I have worked on this car for several months and becoming frustrated with the problems ( I'm sure I'm not alone ). Any help would be GREATLY appreciated.

Thanks to everyone and this site,

Rick

Sounds to me like youre just lean, especially if you cant get the O2s above 600. I see you also have a MAF Translator on the car. I dont know how long you've had it but Bob told me a while back there was a bad batch of MAFs floating around, that could be an issue.

What do your plugs look like? I mean, if youre THAT lean, even methanol isnt going to save you. Granted you should not be blowing gaskets at that boost level unless youre really lean and detonating the crap out of it.

 

[jdpolzin]

What is the correct way to install a knock sensor? Just need to torque it right? What is the torque spec? 18lbs?

 

[SloGN]

I built a Ford small block motor 2 years ago and went to tune it. At 11 PSI, 10.8:1 AFR, 20 degree's timing.. it popped the gasket on the dyno. It had graphite gaskets on 1/2 studs. We put coppers on it, ran the engine again.. at 13 PSI it popped 4 pistons. Same safe AFR, same safe timing on the XFI.

After pulling the motor and going through it top to bottom.. new pistins/bearings/rings/etc.. what I found was the balancer had spun on itself. So 20 degree's timing on the XFI was actually 45 degree's.

I had another buddy with a BHJ balancer on a Buick.. the ring was pressed in the wrong location and his timing was off.

After the balancer incident the motor now has logged over 75 passes with zero issues.

So sometimes we need to look into places we havent for resolving issues.

Hope this post helps

I have seen some issuses related to timing too. one way to check in the reluctor ring and or the crank sensor timing.


you can use the cam sensor tool and adapt it to the crank sensor and using a known balancer (stock ) you can verify that the sensor is actually triggering @ 0 zero degrees. I have checked several crank sensors using the same engine/balancer and had the sensor turn on the led @ different derees of rotation. This may explain why some people have to change the crank referance angle in the XFI's to make the timing in the fast actually match the engine's timing via a timing light.


Now using that same method you can check different balancers when using a known good crank sensor that triggers correctly using a stock balancer.


when checking a reactivity of crank sensor i found several that were 2-3 degrees off. But i found one that was 11 degrees off. 11 degrees will kill a headgaskets in no time.


i happen to stumble upon this when i was checking my BHJ balancer and then i had alway suspected a issue with crank sensors. so i decided to check them and verified what i had been suspected for a few yrs.


HTH guys




BTW there had to be some knock to kill those gaskets. I would check and make sure the knock sensor is working correctly.

 

[WSLN 6]

I may be going to an aftermarket balancer/damper and will check actual timing before the car gets beaten upon. The torque spec for a knock sensor is 14 ftlbs.
I have had the same problem at 25 degrees timing and at 18. You would think if the actual timing was out you would have nasty transitional knock.