Engine Build?

[Bird Man]

Ok, I've had my GN now for about 2.5-3 years and the previous owner didn't treat her the best. Car has fire damage to wiring and hoses, terrible rewiring, and other issues but was still drivable. But my recent upgrades changed that. So I'm looking at pulling the block and wrapping it up and saving it and rebuilding it at a later time. So my question is what is the best build for what I'm wanting. Low 10sec car in 5,500DA, 91 pump gas(no meth, no nitrous) street car.
Would I need a aluminum block or could a original 3.8 be fine?
I would like to sort of over build the engine for what I'm wanting so I'm not pushing it to hard
Any recommendations would be grateful.
Current upgrades I have is
TA-49 upgraded turbo
Adj heavy duty wastegate
3in down pipe
60lb injectors
Voltage booster for fuel pump
Rjc boost controller (18psi current)
3in exhaust with cutout
3in maf with translator
Walboro 255 fuel pump
3,200 stall

 

[earlbrown]

You lost me at ''low 10''.


you might want to leave that tidbit out in the future

 

[Bird Man]

What lost you at low 10?
Why would I leave that out? I'm trying to get my Buick and my 69 Firebird to run within a few tenths of each other.

 

[getdowngranny]

"Low 10sec car in 5,500DA, 91 pump gas(no meth, no nitrous) street car."

Solely on 91 octane. Not going to happen.


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[Bird Man]

Would high 10s/low 11's be reachable with out meth? Not wanting to depend on having meth to be able race.
I'm wanting a street car that can compete with all the other ones in my area. The average daily drivin street car around here is a high to mid 11 car at the track.

 

[NC87GN]

Realistically low to mid 12's on 91 octane (no alky) should be your goal. On top of what you listed invest in a set of ported irons, FMIC, suspension uprade, Drag Radials and a nice extender chip from Bob Bailey to get into the 11s and possibly high 10s ET. On 91 octane, without ported heads, your gonna have to run the boost (26-28# with a 49 turbo) to net a low 11's - high 10's time slip. To do that you need the race gas or alky or you will be replacing head gaskets every pass. Do not forget about the tune and scantool to help record your progress.

 

[Bird Man]

Well I've got a scan tool and 275 drag radials on it. With aluminum drive shaft and going to be purchasing the full tubular suspension for front and back, everything adjustable.
I have no problem buying a new turbo or anything else. Money isn't really a problem. My current set up got me a 12.6 before the trans gave up.

 

[aufond]

e85? maybe

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[Bird Man]

e85? maybe

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Closest e85 pump to my town is a 3.5 hours away sadly.

 

[baby6]

Alcohol is your best route? It's more practical then trying to drive a GN with a giant front mount and a radical setup (big cam, ported heads, etc) just to try and get around buying some alcohol or methanol every once in awhile. Plus I assume running an intercooler that large that could keep the charge temps that low would most likely cause some engine temp and thermal exchange issues... Recipe for failure. This is a turbocharged motor, without something to quench/prevent detonation, it will probably end up badly.

 

[earlbrown]

You really need to do a search before your start dumping money after money into your car.

Try and concentrate on newbies with low post counts that mention "10's" and find some of their threads. You'll be happy to notice their goals are very very parallel to your own. Then, search their name for later posts showing the results of their gameplan.....

You'll be sad to notice that there was never a mention of finishing the plan, and NOT ONE has done it.

I hate to be a debbie downer but 10's are possible in street trim, but it takes WAYYYYYY more than just engine to make it happen. Much more than bolting on catalog parts... and it's NEVER been done on 91 without supplemental chemical intercooling at the least.



You're trying to do what people that know these car's won't even try (for good reason) and you're lacking the first hand experience to make it happen.


Now what I just posted about the 10 second mark you're shooting for might not be the same as a "10 sec street car" ( <-- notice the quotes?). Back years ago when my car ran (actual) 13.3's all day long I can't tell you how many "11 sec cars" I used to wear out left and right on the street.

 

[jasjamz]

565ci Big Block Chevy....

 

[hiboom]

you can look at my signature and our combo's are similar last time I was at the track on 110 octane 28-30 lbs of boost 25 degrees of timing 1.8 60 foot time on street tires I could only run a 11.80@118 mph and I felt like was pushing it pretty hard problely a little faster with drag radials and a better 60 foot time but no way I was getting low 11 or high 10 and that was on race gas. on 91 I can only run 17-18 lbs of boost with 17 degree's of timing safely I'm sure other can and will tell you they have done it, but this is real world experience with my car

 

[Bird Man]

Alcohol is your best route? It's more practical then trying to drive a GN with a giant front mount and a radical setup (big cam, ported heads, etc) just to try and get around buying some alcohol or methanol every once in awhile. Plus I assume running an intercooler that large that could keep the charge temps that low would most likely cause some engine temp and thermal exchange issues... Recipe for failure. This is a turbocharged motor, without something to quench/prevent detonation, it will probably end up badly.

-what alky kit do you recommend then? It's one of the pain in the ass fuels to get ahold of here that's why i prefer not to run it.

You really need to do a search before your start dumping money after money into your car.

Try and concentrate on newbies with low post counts that mention "10's" and find some of their threads. You'll be happy to notice their goals are very very parallel to your own. Then, search their name for later posts showing the results of their gameplan.....

You'll be sad to notice that there was never a mention of finishing the plan, and NOT ONE has done it.

I hate to be a debbie downer but 10's are possible in street trim, but it takes WAYYYYYY more than just engine to make it happen. Much more than bolting on catalog parts... and it's NEVER been done on 91 without supplemental chemical intercooling at the least.



You're trying to do what people that know these car's won't even try (for good reason) and you're lacking the first hand experience to make it happen.


Now what I just posted about the 10 second mark you're shooting for might not be the same as a "10 sec street car" ( <-- notice the quotes?). Back years ago when my car ran (actual) 13.3's all day long I can't tell you how many "11 sec cars" I used to wear out left and right on the street.

I don't plan on just throwing money at my car. I'm doing the research. And I'm not just some kid that thinks everything I want will happen. I have two other cars that are way more crazy then what I'm wanting here
1969 Firebird pro touring build
-Aluminum Olds 455 with 6 speed auto. Full interior car with air conditioning runs constant 10.30-10.40s at the track with 600hp
1968 Chevy c10
-5.3L aluminum 4v cobra motor with twin 88mm turbos and 3 speed. Makes 1,436hp and has full interior, air conditioning, and is bagged and body dropped to drag frame with a coffin in the bed
-both run pump 91 octane.
I just figured that with a fully built motor and all the suspension work that I plan on doing it would be capable of happening. So if not I'll just return it back to factory and make it a show car. I'm sitting right in the middle of oilfield money right now so wearing out other street cars doesn't happen around here. If they do break then they are fixed and faster within a week or so.

 

[Bird Man]

you can look at my signature and our combo's are similar last time I was at the track on 110 octane 28-30 lbs of boost 25 degrees of timing 1.8 60 foot time on street tires I could only run a 11.80@118 mph and I felt like was pushing it pretty hard problely a little faster with drag radials and a better 60 foot time but no way I was getting low 11 or high 10 and that was on race gas. on 91 I can only run 17-18 lbs of boost with 17 degree's of timing safely I'm sure other can and will tell you they have done it, but this is real world experience with my car

I wish I could have gotten mine faster. You were only getting a 1.8 60 foot what psi were you leaving at? I was getting 1.61-1.67 leaving at 10psi on anti lag for the only three passes the car made before the trans starting slipping.
I would be ok will a 11.8 or so but I wouldn't want to be pushin it that hard like you said. I want it to stay together.

 

[Phoneguy]

Alky Control by Razor ( Julio) is the kit that you want. The ALKY only sprays when you reach the boost turn on point so you are not using it unless you are in boost. The kit is a progressive pressure ramp. It is built for our cars and does quite well, also he is a member and tech support is available to you if needed. He attends the events as well. The reservoir holds plenty for cruising around playing...This is the best bang for the buck you can get as far as I am concerned. My stroker motor went a 1.54 60' on a zero boost launch and 6.91 @ 103 back in 2010 at 21 psi. I will see what it can do in bowling Green next month with the new engine and tranny on the 2 step.

Bryan

 

[hiboom]

I wish I could have gotten mine faster. You were only getting a 1.8 60 foot what psi were you leaving at? I was getting 1.61-1.67 leaving at 10psi on anti lag for the only three passes the car made before the trans starting slipping.
I would be ok will a 11.8 or so but I wouldn't want to be pushin it that hard like you said. I want it to stay together.

was leaving at 5lbs of boost (2500 rpm) that's all the brakes would hold before the rear tires started spinning with 235 tiger paw street tires it would just go up in smoke plus drove 60 miles to track and really didn't want to brake it and have to make arrangements to get it home lol

 

[turbocamino1]

'Bird Man' quote; ...
-5.3L aluminum 4v cobra motor with twin 88mm turbos and 3 speed. Makes 1,436hp and has full interior, air conditioning, and is bagged and body dropped to drag frame with a coffin in the bed
-both run pump 91 octane. Wow...1400hp on 91...thats...thats...wow!

 

[Bird Man]

Alky Control by Razor ( Julio) is the kit that you want. The ALKY only sprays when you reach the boost turn on point so you are not using it unless you are in boost. The kit is a progressive pressure ramp. It is built for our cars and does quite well, also he is a member and tech support is available to you if needed. He attends the events as well. The reservoir holds plenty for cruising around playing...This is the best bang for the buck you can get as far as I am concerned. My stroker motor went a 1.54 60' on a zero boost launch and 6.91 @ 103 back in 2010 at 21 psi. I will see what it can do in bowling Green next month with the new engine and tranny on the 2 step.

Bryan

Ok thanks. Where do you recommend to put the nozzle? I hear people puting it in a lot of different places and would like the most out of it. Average summer temp around here gets to the 100s.

 

[Bird Man]

'Bird Man' quote; ...
-5.3L aluminum 4v cobra motor with twin 88mm turbos and 3 speed. Makes 1,436hp and has full interior, air conditioning, and is bagged and body dropped to drag frame with a coffin in the bed
-both run pump 91 octane. Wow...1400hp on 91...thats...thats...wow!

It's a fully built motor at 9to1 compression off boost and 13.5to1 with boost. The 88s are on the large size. I could have gotten by with 72s. But I wanted something to really pull like a monster on the top end and utilize the 7,900 redline. I would like to run it at our local track but can't pass tech since it has no cage or seat belts.