Cutting Out At ~14 PSI Boost - Suspect Fuel Pump

[Terbro]

I have known Nick for a long time now and I trust his advice on anything Buick.

If he did the work and it is not doing what it is supposed to go back to him and let him figure it out. At the end of the day, this is business.

You pay for a service and a result and you should get it. I have never known Nick to screw over anyone. What is worse, you have no tools to check anything and you cant solve this problem without them. Maybe there is something else going on here we all dont know of but either you want the problem solved or you dont.

We all know how much money these cars take to build but as you have said it is not doing what it is supposed to. What are you going to do about it Terbro?

I've already been through quite a bit of troubleshooting with Nick, and at this point I'm dissatisfied with the outcome. I know Nick is next to God on this forum, so if I say anything else, I'm in for trouble, so I'll leave it at that. But believe me - if I wasn't 800 miles away, I would've sent it back to him *many* months ago...two days after I got it back home. Of course that's why I sent the whole car to him in the first place (vs just the motor), so I wouldn't be doing what I'm doing anyway. Again, I know I need to walk on eggshells when it comes to complaining about Nick. Note: I'm only replying to Reggie West's comment, okay? So nobody hassle me about whining. I'm not. I'm over it - only wanting get my TR running right, and replying to his comment so people know that his two suggestions are not viable options.

And on that note - I can already tell you I'm extremely encouraged by all the great feedback and advice I've been given. I'm extremely confident that I'll sniff this problem out....once I have the time to really get into it. Probably in the tank somewhere....we'll see.

 

[Terbro]

Ok before you buy anything contact me ill give you whatever you need if i have it. Fuel lines fittings translators data logger or Scan master Casper caps ill give it to you free.

You...are awesome!

Let me what's revealed in the fuel tank. P.S. I have a Scanmaster.

Guys like you make the TR Community great...

 

[Terbro]

Alright...new fuel tank hath arrived, and I've got the afternoon open. Tank drop session begins....NOW!

 

[Terbro]

Welp...I believe I found the problem. Nick never installed the DW fuel pump. Looks like he never opened the tank (see pic...9 months and <500 miles put on it in fair weather only since he's had it). It's got a Walbro 255 lph (F20000169) pump in it. This is a technical post, so I won't leave too much negative feedback on Nick here, but there will be a whopper in the Feedback forum at some point (but look for that feedback post as it will include him putting in some other un-rebuilt transmission, that had no 2nd gear, when he was supposed to rebuild mine...to name just one of many other complaints). And now this...he didn't put in the DW300 pump!

So - back to the solution: I've got a local performance shop that has an AEM 50-1000 320 lph (same flow as the DW) for $125 in stock. He tells me it's the same style as the DW...will drop right in. Anyone have any reason I shouldn't use that? The guy tells me most of these FP's are rebranded from Walbro anyway. Update: I just called AEM tech support, and he says that pump is designed for gasoline. He gave me the E85 equivalent (different internals, to tolerate E85 better), which is 50-1200...just in case anyone wanted to buy that pump.

I'll call around and see if anyone has the DW pump in stock...otherwise just order it online.

PS. What do we think about that sock? Dirty? Normal?

 

[No disintegrations]

Well at least we didn't have you drop the tank for no reason. Good job. You'll get it squared away now.

 

[Terbro]

Well at least we didn't have you drop the tank for no reason. Good job. You'll get it squared away now.

Right! Thanks for all your input!

And I'm actually not surprised at this point...about Nick (with so many prior problems). Point being, I accept it, and am MAINLY JUST HAPPY to have likely solved the problem!!! I'm off now to Denver. Got a shop that's got this kit in stock for $180: https://jet.com/product/detail/7546...156916367580&gclid=CMaTnviu5MsCFQUIaQodGXEIRw

 

[larrym]

I run an AEM 320 pump works good for me.

 

[John Larkin]

Be really careful when you put the pump back in the hole. That sock is not flexible at all and the tit on the bottom of the pump that the jam nut holds it onto can break off easily. Mine did and I had to orient it weirdly also to not interfere with the fuel float. In the end it all worked out, just hoping to save the next guy some aggrevation. Congrats on finding the smoking gun.

 

[Nick Micale]

With all due respect to Nick, I've had several significant issues with him. I still respect him, but without going into detail, let me suffice to say, giving him all the benefit possible of doubt - at a minimum, he's made several errors and oversights in my build and during the process that I'm quite disappointed in. As a result, it's cost me quite a bit of time and effort to resolve. For "the most part", Nick has resolved them, but as I said, I'm still disappointed. So at this point - I've lost confidence in him, and so definitely *no*, I do agree with you in your statement 'if he says he put a DW300 pump in he did".

There is usually 2 sides to a story, and here is mine as I wrote off this dead beat, I rather lose the $2k, than deal with his whining and BS?

Terry, if you lived up to your promise and signed a notarized contract to pay me the ~$2000 owed for the work and parts on your car instead of NOT paying the balance as agreed, and not even a call to discuss delayed payment or any issues with your car, this would be a different story?

Your car was a disaster when it arrive here, and suffered greatly from some asshat working on and fukin up the worst mess of wiring and other stupidity I have ever seen on a TR?

I have an idea what your issue may be, and doubt it is fuel?

 

[Boost231]

Nick.... look above

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[Terbro]

There is usually 2 sides to a story, and here is mine as I wrote off this dead beat, I rather lose the $2k, than deal with his whining and BS?

Terry, if you lived up to your promise and signed a notarized contract to pay me the ~$2000 owed for the work and parts on your car instead of NOT paying the balance as agreed, and not even a call to discuss delayed payment or any issues with your car, this would be a different story?

Your car was a disaster when it arrive here, and suffered greatly from some asshat working on and fukin up the worst mess of wiring and other stupidity I have ever seen on a TR?

I have an idea what your issue may be, and doubt it is fuel?

Nick, this isn't the thread to be getting into depth on yours and my personal history on this. But since you're broadcasting the money end of it...I can only THANK GOD I had a balance when I received the car. I would've been FURIOUS otherwise. As I said, when I have the time, I'll be posting the full and complete story, and the bevy of problems I've had from day one with the car, in the feedback section. And it'll include the reason why I haven't paid the $2K. In short - you've been a nightmare. Let's not forget I've already paid you $8,300! I'll be putting a boroscope in the cylinder to confirm that it's got forged pistons. I may lose, but I'm willing to bet $100 right now that I don't have ported heads.

 

[Terbro]

So, called around and found a performance shop that had a DW300 in stock (with the sock, suitable for E85). Ran up there and picked it up. Put everything in decided to test the pump by jumping it at the alternator before adding fuel. Only heard a click. Checked wiring and all looked okay. When I pulled the tank, I stretched the wiring a bit, and the hot wire kit wire disconnected from the hotwire box. When I was in the process of reattaching it, the "hot" wire from the alternator (I believe) contacted the bumper, and sparked - telling me it was live. I proceeded to reattach it to the other side of the wire. But nothing.

So still miffed, I thought I'd bypass the hotwire kit and see if that would work, and it did. I later checked that same hot wire with my volt meter, and it wasn't hot anymore...sigh.

So then, I fill it with fuel, let it run for 5 minutes to warm it up, and everything seemed normal. I refilled it with about 3-4 gallons of gas, but it was reading only about 1/8th of a tank, so I headed straight toward the fuel station. Didn't get a 1/4 mile away, going up a hill and it dies. I figured I was too low on fuel, so I flip a U-turn and coast back to my driveway. Take my gas can and run to the station in my daily driver and buy 5 gals of E85...fill the TR with it, and...fuel pump doesn't turn on!!!

So now I'm miffed again. I checked all the wiring again, thinking maybe the connector disconnected (the clip had broken off before I bought it), but it was okay. Checked and rechecked, tried and retried, but still no fuel pump when putting the ignition to the "on" position. And this is what puzzles me - the fuel pump will still come on if I jump it at the alternator.

Does that tell us anything?

 

[turbo89]

So, called around and found a performance shop that had a DW300 in stock (with the sock, suitable for E85). Ran up there and picked it up. Put everything in decided to test the pump by jumping it at the alternator before adding fuel. Only heard a click. Checked wiring and all looked okay. When I pulled the tank, I stretched the wiring a bit, and the hot wire kit wire disconnected from the hotwire box. When I was in the process of reattaching it, the "hot" wire from the alternator (I believe) contacted the bumper, and sparked - telling me it was live. I proceeded to reattach it to the other side of the wire. But nothing.

So still miffed, I thought I'd bypass the hotwire kit and see if that would work, and it did. I later checked that same hot wire with my volt meter, and it wasn't hot anymore...sigh.

So then, I fill it with fuel, let it run for 5 minutes to warm it up, and everything seemed normal. I refilled it with about 3-4 gallons of gas, but it was reading only about 1/8th of a tank, so I headed straight toward the fuel station. Didn't get a 1/4 mile away, going up a hill and it dies. I figured I was too low on fuel, so I flip a U-turn and coast back to my driveway. Take my gas can and run to the station in my daily driver and buy 5 gals of E85...fill the TR with it, and...fuel pump doesn't turn on!!!

So now I'm miffed again. I checked all the wiring again, thinking maybe the connector disconnected (the clip had broken off before I bought it), but it was okay. Checked and rechecked, tried and retried, but still no fuel pump when putting the ignition to the "on" position. And this is what puzzles me - the fuel pump will still come on if I jump it at the alternator.

Does that tell us anything?

Check Fuel pump Relay ( pass side middle relay by the ESC module )

 

[Pronto]

The hotwire should have a fuse in it too.

 

[Terbro]

Check Fuel pump Relay ( pass side middle relay by the ESC module )

So it's one of those little black boxes just inside the fender, I assume. Okay, so electronics is not my strong point. What exact would I do to "check it"? I do have a volt meter. Please step-by-step me through the procedure to determine if it's gone bad. Thanks in advance...

 

[Terbro]

The hotwire should have a fuse in it too.

Ah. I'll check that as well. Thanks...

 

[Pronto]

So it's one of those little black boxes just inside the fender, I assume. Okay, so electronics is not my strong point. What exact would I do to "check it"? I do have a volt meter. Please step-by-step me through the procedure to determine if it's gone bad. Thanks in advance...

Here you go
http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/fuel_pump.htm

 

[dynoman]

That vortex buicks link should be a sticky in the general tech section . It would save a lot of back and forth explanations of trouble shooting the fuel pump electrical system , and be consistent.

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[larrym]

That vortex buicks link should be a sticky in the general tech section . It would save a lot of back and forth explanations of trouble shooting the fuel pump electrical system , and be consistent.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

It's one of my favourites lots of good info there.

 

[Terbro]

That vortex link was helpful...while some of it is a bit challenging (read the whole thing); again, electronics is my weak point, but I got most of it.

Anyway...some of what it said has me wonder if it's not the fp/inj fuse at the block because: I wanted to get the car in the garage, so I jumped the pump at the alternator and it does start. If the fuel pump/injectors fuse was blown at the fuse block, it wouldn't start...being that the injectors wouldn't work, right?

Secondly, it said that if the relay was bad, it should still start (just that it will take longer). After I had the motor running, I was playing with the connection at the alternator jumper wire, and it disconnected for a moment. The motor immediately shut off the instant the connection was lost. Wait...I just thought of something. It shut off *instantly*. It didn't sputter out, as if it was lacking fuel, it was just like I turned off the key. I know my fuel rail loses fuel pressure fast, but again, this seemed to be instantly. Does that clue anyone in?

I'll check the fp/inj fuse at the fuse block...just to be sure. I have a feeling that this is related to something burning when I accidently contacted the hotwire kit's hot wire to the bumper (when I saw it spark).