XTSM - Extreme TSM

[V6RACER]

All the discussion of allowing stage blocks in TSM and declining car counts we have to start thinking about opening up the rules to allow more cars in the class if we want to continue this type of racing. I would like to open up the rules to allow more cars and see what happens. If more cars show up to race then we have accomplished something good, if car count stays the same we haven't lost anything. I'd like to have something in place by now so everyone has ~6 months or so to get ready for the TB.com Nats.

Here is the starting point and I want to have constructive comments and open minded discussions around this to increase car counts while keeping the racing close as is was in BG this year. Old TSM records etc would just be frozen and we'd start a new list.


Please keep the comments civil and let's discuss.

Here is what I'm thinking, Keep a majority of the rules from TSM but include the following:


XTSM - Extreme Turbo Street Modified is a class based off of the earlier TSM class. To allow more participation the rules will be opened up to allow more combinations of engines. Now 109, Stage I & II, & aftermarket blocks will be able to race together in heads up class like never before.








2012 RULES

MAIN RULE:*** All rules subject to change due to fairness ***


3250 lbs - Iron Production "8445" casting head / 109 / 71mm

3450 lbs - Aluminum (Champion Style) head / 109 & Series II / 71mm

3650 lbs - Any other block (Stage I & II on/off center, etc) / any style head / 71mm


-100 lbs for 67 3-bolt turbo from any combo
+100 lbs for Alcohol injection

*Safety requirments per track tech
*Factory Stock Appearing External Body must have headlights/tailights (81-87 Regal)
*FSA glass windows
*One 3 bolt turbo up to 71.5mm inducer/103mm exducer in factory stock location (No V-band downpipes)
*No Nitrous Oxide injection
*Iron heads must be production "8445" heads
*Stock suspension/mounting points (no wheelie bars)
*No mini tubs, notched frame ok.
*Any Exhaust: must exit in stock location
*Wastegate must plumb back into downpipe
*Gasoline fuel only (includes E85, Sunoco, VP, etc)
*Alcohol Injection +100 lbs
*70mm Throttle body/cast intake manifold
*Tires - 15" wheel Front must be 3.5" wide footprint. Rear tires up to 29.5" x 10.5"(Slick), 29.5" x 12.5" DOT (ET-Street), or up to 295 series (Drag radial)
*Any GM automatic transmission
*Any GM differential, Dana 60, or Ford 9"



Ultimate Goal
-The 71 turbo would limit the overall power potential to keep class ET close
-The 109 weights would improve 109 longevity
-Stage rules would allow more cars to join in with minimal changes
-Allows for many different combos to be competitive


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[SGRIM]

Sounds good to me...

 

[KevinB]

I like it. If this goes through I will hopefully compete in '13

 

[sackracing]

Subscribed

 

[SGRIM]

We GOTS to have at least one more TSM race though... I want an 8 too:biggrin:

 

[XXQUICK6XX]

How are you going to police cubic inches?

 

[Detomaso71]

Will TA block suffice?
I always wanted to go ta or 153 but didn't want an all out race only car.
I bet a staged 71mm would be fun on street at lower boost on 93 octane

 

[Sydwyndr]

How are you going to police cubic inches?

With the great equalizer being the turbo (regardless 224ci to 280ci or whatever), CI wont be factor I would imagine...

Will TA block suffice?
I always wanted to go ta or 153 but didn't want an all out race only car.
I bet a staged 71mm would be fun on street at lower boost on 93 octane

I would say yes, won't matter

 

[HighPSI]

I don't have a dog in this fight, but I like where the rules are going. I think a big bore, stock stroke Stage motor would be a great combination. Unshrouding the valves has to be worth something

 

[turbobuick]

How about stage block iron production style heads?

 

[BobbyBuick]

Look Im getting old and tired but not sick and tired.I know my car will go 9.40s thats probably about it if I wanted to turn it up.However Ive lost alot of ambition over the years and also own 5 turbo cars and a couple other projects. I just love to race heads up at this point.I used to be a lot more aggressive and competitive when this class started but now I want to take the car to the track, race it,and load it up on its own power.You know how this class started right?It was for the guy that had no money for a builder and stage motor, for the garage mechanic to build his 109, and place for the average Joe to go heads up racing and just a small portion of dollars to do it with.Im game though .love the weight break I can keep the spare tire out of the trunk now and it may help keep the front end down.I had a Blast this year! Finished third in the points my first year back with not that fast of a car .Im open to upping the car count mostly and getting more people out to race just want a level playing field

 

[Sydwyndr]

.

 

[Robert Wilson]

On center with Champion style head included in 3550 weight break? What about considering alcohol injection?

 

[11.20n1320]

I would like to run TSM with my little 66 turbo. But I cant see an easy way to get rid of 570 pounds. I think the weights need to be looked at. There are 2 109 block cars that I know of that run in TSM now with iron heads and will have a hard time getting the weight out of them. Im all about car count and have a couple good friends with stage block cars I would like to see compete again. Jason you are headed the right direction, but will be very hard to make a car that light.
DDay

 

[Mike E]

...
3650 - Stage II heads / On/Off center Stage I or II / 71
...

That's awesome that you would even consider allowing the stage heads. I wouldn't have even attempted to ask for that one.

My car might not be done in 6 months, but I might have to find someone with a finished car to partner with until mine is done. Stage heads and a 71 might be an odd combination, but it's a starting point. It will certainly have a streetable cam.

 

[Chris Hogeland]

Looks good to me. Hope to have my other car ready for turbo Buick.com race. Got the engine took apart out of the wreck car today everything looks great. Going back together and will be in the new car by next week!

 

[johnplogii]

Can we just get a few lengths if we are 350lbs overweight? :biggrin:

 

[steve hughes]

I like the weight breaks but i don't think it'll work too well for the iron head guys to try to get that much weight out of their cars. I'm glad to see you thinking outside the box and trying to keep the class alive. Something has to be tried to revive it. Thanks

 

[V6RACER]

How are you going to police cubic inches?

Like Clint said, cubic inches won't matter when the turbo is the limit. We don't check cubic inches now and I doubt there are any current racers that have >250. Now with a stage engine you would most likely start out with a larger cubic inch but you will have to carry more weight.

Will TA block suffice?
I always wanted to go ta or 153 but didn't want an all out race only car.
I bet a staged 71mm would be fun on street at lower boost on 93 octane

TA block would be grouped in with stage engines. Off center to be 3550, On center 3650

How about stage block iron production style heads?

"8445" production iron heads..
No "one off" style iron stage heads

On center with Champion style head included in 3550 weight break? What about considering alcohol injection?

On center would be 3650
I wasn't thinking about alcohol, but maybe with a 100 lb weight addition.

I would like to run TSM with my little 66 turbo. But I cant see an easy way to get rid of 570 pounds. I think the weights need to be looked at. There are 2 109 block cars that I know of that run in TSM now with iron heads and will have a hard time getting the weight out of them. Im all about car count and have a couple good friends with stage block cars I would like to see compete again. Jason you are headed the right direction, but will be very hard to make a car that light.
DDay

I spoke with some iron headed racers from BG and all of them had to add weight to hit 3400 with opportunity to get lighter with the current rules. I wouldn't be opposed to allowing more lightweight items.

Can we just get a few lengths if we are 350lbs overweight? :biggrin:

You can get lighter 3100 is attainable

I like the weight breaks but i don't think it'll work too well for the iron head guys to try to get that much weight out of their cars. I'm glad to see you thinking outside the box and trying to keep the class alive. Something has to be tried to revive it. Thanks

Steve, waiting on your testing to help us moving forward.

 

[SGRIM]

I think all the classes, with the exception of TSA, should all be Turbo Size, Tire, and Weight!