Who runs this cam....

[4timesT]

I made a post in the General Tech Forum but that might not have been the right Forum to post in.

I recently picked up an 86 T-Type with a blown motor. I have rebuilt motor sitting in the garage with an old Full Throttle 224/224 cam in it but never got the chance to run it. I know the cam gives up some bottom end and I'm worried it will hurt spool up.

Anybody have any experience with this cam?

Thanks.

 

[mikestertwo]

I recently picked up an 86 T-Type with a blown motor. I have rebuilt motor sitting in the garage with an old Full Throttle 224/224 cam in it but never got the chance to run it. I know the cam gives up some bottom end and I'm worried it will hurt spool up.

Anybody have any experience with this cam?

Thanks.

That's a pretty big cam for a turbo motor. What's your combo?

 

[gossamer]

You'll need lots and lots of mods. I had to run more converter than I thought to make my 212/212 work good.

+2 That is a big cam for these engines.

 

[jpwalt1987]

That cam isnt too small...... Your heads and convertor are not big enough!!! If you have stock heads and want to keep a 3000 rpm or less stall I would get something much smaller. Is that a roller or a flat tappet? I would suggest a 206/206 roller depending on your mods. Hope this helps. Jeremy

 

[4timesT]

Here's the build up.


The engine's got ported heads (1.77/1.50), ported intake, 2 billet caps, stock TB and plenum. Stock headers (cleaned up) 3 or 3.5 inch DP (still deciding).

I'm looking at the PTE 6265 turbo or bigger. Plan on running alky on the street and alky race gas 30 or more PSI at the track.

I have a Pro TQ converter laying around but I'm thinking it won't stall high enough. I did get 1.55 60' out of it (11.6 at 117) with stock suspension (no front sway bar) with a 20 PSI E-brake launch on 28x10 slicks. lol That was on a 100K mile stock long block with a T63e, 3" DP, 55lbers and Max Effort chip (running full rich on race gas).

Basically looking to run mid to low 10s at 130+ MPH.

 

[bison]

Here's the build up.


The engine's got ported heads (1.77/1.50), ported intake, 2 billet caps, stock TB and plenum. Stock headers (cleaned up) 3 or 3.5 inch DP (still deciding).

I'm looking at the PTE 6265 turbo or bigger. Plan on running alky on the street and alky race gas 30 or more PSI at the track.

I have a Pro TQ converter laying around but I'm thinking it won't stall high enough. I did get 1.55 60' out of it (11.6 at 117) with stock suspension (no front sway bar) with a 20 PSI E-brake launch on 28x10 slicks. lol That was on a 100K mile stock long block with a T63e, 3" DP, 55lbers and Max Effort chip (running full rich on race gas).

Basically looking to run mid to low 10s at 130+ MPH.

The 65 trim exhaust will make it a little harder than a GTQ/HPQ to mph. I wouldnt go with more than a 212/212. Id rec an even smaller 210/205 or 206/206 if you are staying with the small turbine wheel. Build the engine to make peak power before 5800rpm with iron heads and GTQ (5600 if you keep the 65 trim). The 224/224 is a horrible mis-match with iron heads and your turbo. Its nearly what ill be running with a set of race ported GN1's, way more turbo and shifting at 6400-6500. You need to have a 3800 stall minimum and keep the engine at 5500-6500 to take advantage of the 224. I only have .496 lift on my 212/212 and it mph really well on a really tired engine. If you are considering a GTQ then get a 3.5 dp. Otherwise it wont matter at all with the 65 trim and the 3" is lighter and leaves more clearance. Id also highly rec a PTC 9.5" I never would have been able to mph like i did without it.

 

[4timesT]

Well what I really want is another T63e or TE45a to go with this cam and a higher stalling converter. I don't think the Pro Torque I have now will work.

This was my combination back in 2000.


86 TR weighing 3600 lbs w/driver
bone stock suspension (sway bars and all)
stock front rims and 27x10 slicks and 8" Welds on the back
stock rear and gears
slipping tranny (flared good on both shifts) 2600-2800 stall Pat's converter ( unlocked )
**Had to manually shift the tranny (off the stock tach) because it was out of a 307 olds powered car and would upshift at like 4000 RPM**

9" K&N cone filter, stock maf (1 screen removed), 3" MAF pipe
T-63E turbo, Kenne Bell big boy intercooler, stock t-body, hemco 62 mm bonnet

rebuilt stock block, stock crank and rods, 2 billet caps, .020 over JE pistons, ESP stage 4 cam (on it's way to flatsville) 204/214 .448/.472 108 LSA, stock rockers.
fully ported stock heads and intake

ported exh. manifolds, 3" ATR downpipe with ATR external WG, Open offroad dump pipe, 3" single shot with BLOWMASTER muffler (14 psi of back pressure with the dump capped!!!!).

55 lb injectors, stock lines and rail, Red's 107 chip, 307 pump, adj reg
C-16 in the tank

27 psi boost in 1st and 2nd gears, 30 psi in 3rd gear
42 psi static fuel pressure spiking to 72 psi in 3rd and then dropping off

car was a dog in 1st and 2nd gears and then leaned out big time in 3rd (it lean popped 4 times in 3rd gear)

ran 97 mph in the 1/8 and 126 in the 1/4 (97 in the 1/8 should be a 121 in the quarter). Like I said, a dog in the first 2 gears. 11.39 et with a 1.88 60'.

If I had a better converter and tranny, less fuel downstairs and more upstairs there's no reason why she shouldn't have ran 130 mph in the 1/4 (possibly faster). Obviously, a little suspension tuning wouldn't have hurt either. lol


Since I sold my old turbo intercooler and downpipe I'm researching their replacements.

I want the new car to top end like a SOB that's why I'm kinda looking to stay with the 224 cam and am hoping someone out there actuallt ran this cam back in the day.

 

[bison]

The cam you had was very close to the comp 212. Id go with a 9.5" PTC converter and a BB GTQ turbo. Get the tune nailed down. It would have taken a lot more boost to go 130mph with the old combo. If you had it all nailed down with that combo your eighth mph wold have went up and your quarter would have stayed the same. If you go with the 224 it will raise the power band right out of the usable range with those heads.

 

[4timesT]

Get the tune nailed down. It would have taken a lot more boost to go 130mph with the old combo. If you had it all nailed down with that combo your eighth mph wold have went up and your quarter would have stayed the same.

I think there was a very good chance the car would have seen 130 with the boost I was running. The T63e flows a lot of air.

A member on this board and the other one, 1970GSX, has run 128 MPH with a T63e at 25 psi on alky. He hasn't upated his sig on here but look him up on the other board. I PMed him and asked how much boost he ran on the 128 mph pass and he replied 24-25 psi.

Even with the tight converter I was using at the time, if I could have leaned out the RA chip in the first 2 gears the car would have pulled better. More fuel upstairs would have kept the car from lean popping 4 times in 3rd gear. Tranny was flaring hard on both upshifts so that was costing some ET and MPH. Could have locked the converter too.

 

[vacuum 6]

Maybe Turbo1dr will chime in. This might help dont know.

I have a 212/212 roller and I love it. At 6000 rpm it keeps pulling. I just went 119.96 with a 5000 2-3 shift and 5700 thru traps.

 

[bison]

Maybe Turbo1dr will chime in. This might help dont know.

I have a 212/212 roller and I love it. At 6000 rpm it keeps pulling. I just went 119.96 with a 5000 2-3 shift and 5700 thru traps.

If your shifting the 212 at 5000 your leaving a lot on the table. Your converter isnt coupling to well either. Again leaving a lot on the table. I had 3.42 gears, 27" tire and crossed at 5750 with a trap of 133.46mph. Mine starts tapering off at 5800. Based on the DC dropping. I dont see how you are pulling past 6000 effectively.

 

[bison]

I think there was a very good chance the car would have seen 130 with the boost I was running. The T63e flows a lot of air.

A member on this board and the other one, 1970GSX, has run 128 MPH with a T63e at 25 psi on alky. He hasn't upated his sig on here but look him up on the other board. I PMed him and asked how much boost he ran on the 128 mph pass and he replied 24-25 psi.

Even with the tight converter I was using at the time, if I could have leaned out the RA chip in the first 2 gears the car would have pulled better. More fuel upstairs would have kept the car from lean popping 4 times in 3rd gear. Tranny was flaring hard on both upshifts so that was costing some ET and MPH. Could have locked the converter too.

But it went 126mph. If you were flat footed through the whole run then picking up 4 mph will take approx. another 55-60whp. So probably 34-35psi. Be aware that unless you are reading off of a MAP sensor your boost gauge could be off a couple psi. Ive seen it before. Locking the converter might have given a couple mph. The 63e is generally not a 130mph turbo unless the car is light. If you want 130mph you should strongly consider a GTQ and a PTC 9.5". You will gain about 5 mph with the two running 26-28 psi. The p-trim causes a lot of backpressure and makes it more difficult when running higher boost/rpm.

 

[Otto J]

I agree at 5700 rpm you should have more MPH than 119 unless your running a 26" tall tire.

 

[vacuum 6]

If your shifting the 212 at 5000 your leaving a lot on the table. Your converter isnt coupling to well either. Again leaving a lot on the table. I had 3.42 gears, 27" tire and crossed at 5750 with a trap of 133.46mph. Mine starts tapering off at 5800. Based on the DC dropping. I dont see how you are pulling past 6000 effectively.

Agree 100%. The point still remains, if I'm running 119.96 with a lot left on the table just think what the 212/212 can really do. 130 MPH anyone? BTW - the convertor is a seperate issue and yes I'm running a 26" tire.

 

[Otto J]

Time for taller tires

 

[bison]

Agree 100%. just think what the 212/212 can really do

I know what it can do with the right combo. Read my sig. It could have done more. Tired 8.3:1 engine iron heads and low timing. Time for you to get a 28" tire and a 9.5" PTC converter.

 

[4timesT]

Maybe Turbo1dr will chime in. This might help dont know.

I have a 212/212 roller and I love it. At 6000 rpm it keeps pulling. I just went 119.96 with a 5000 2-3 shift and 5700 thru traps.

He was running w/o a MAF.

I'd love to have a roller setup in mine but I'm not looking to spend that kind of money right now. Rather spend it on a good turbo.

 

[bison]

He was running w/o a MAF.

I'd love to have a roller setup in mine but I'm not looking to spend that kind of money right now. Rather spend it on a good turbo.

He had a lot more lift than me on the 212.

 

[vacuum 6]

IMO - I would spend the $$$ on a reliable roller setup. If the motor is built well (good heads, stock ported intake, roller lifters, & roller cam), slap on a 630 HP journal turbo = 10 sec car. Smaller turbos fun on the street. From other posts, a 700 hp BB turbo and 9.5" 2800 stall does the same thing but its a $2200 setup.

 

[4timesT]

But it went 126mph. If you were flat footed through the whole run then picking up 4 mph will take approx. another 55-60whp. So probably 34-35psi. Be aware that unless you are reading off of a MAP sensor your boost gauge could be off a couple psi. Ive seen it before. Locking the converter might have given a couple mph. The 63e is generally not a 130mph turbo unless the car is light. If you want 130mph you should strongly consider a GTQ and a PTC 9.5". You will gain about 5 mph with the two running 26-28 psi. The p-trim causes a lot of backpressure and makes it more difficult when running higher boost/rpm.

Yes, my completely untuned and slapped together car went 126 running out of fuel. Ergo, running properly it could never have run 130 w/o running 34-35 psi. Got it.

Boost gauge could have been off a couple of pounds...up or down.

30 psi is not a lot of boost for a T63e, as per John Craig. When i spoke to him on the phone back in the day he told me that turbo could efficently run 40 psi all day long.