Tough knock question

[Turbo6Smackdown]

What major problem can you guys think of, that would cause genuine knock even with sufficient octane? Just say for instance, for diagnosis's sakes, that my knock retard is real. If I have my current set up, with 103 octane, and 17 psi on a TA61, and about 10.5 on the wideband under WOT at about 50 mph and 17 psi, would that wide band reading be proof positive that I have sufficient fuel flow?
What failure could I have, that would cause real knock with a 10.5 on the wide band and 103 octane in the gas tank? It was about 70 degrees out, and car was running at 167-170.
If I had too much octane (say for instance 103 in the tank and alky spraying too) could that cause KR? I'm lost. I have to treat this as real KR, because if it is, I don't want to break anything.

 

[josh young]

I take it you don't have a fuel pressure gauge you can look at while driving? How old is the pump? Maybe some others will chime in, good luck !

 

[TurboBuRick]

Are you seeing knock retard on the scanmaster recall? What are your o2 mv's? What mph?

Rick

 

[turbo89]

What major problem can you guys think of, that would cause genuine knock even with sufficient octane? Just say for instance, for diagnosis's sakes, that my knock retard is real. If I have my current set up, with 103 octane, and 17 psi on a TA61, and about 10.5 on the wideband under WOT at about 50 mph and 17 psi, would that wide band reading be proof positive that I have sufficient fuel flow?
What failure could I have, that would cause real knock with a 10.5 on the wide band and 103 octane in the gas tank? It was about 70 degrees out, and car was running at 167-170.
If I had too much octane (say for instance 103 in the tank and alky spraying too) could that cause KR? I'm lost. I have to treat this as real KR, because if it is, I don't want to break anything.

FORGET all that ... pull a few plugs and look at them !!!! it can knock from being TOO RICH as well ... look at what the motor is telling you ...

103 and alky it shouldn't be knocking .. if its false knock the fun starts to find it

 

[Turbo6Smackdown]

FORGET all that ... pull a few plugs and look at them !!!! it can knock from being TOO RICH as well ... look at what the motor is telling you ...

103 and alky it shouldn't be knocking .. if its false knock the fun starts to find it

Fuel pump's a hotwired walbro. The pump was new from 08. Less than 500 miles on it. The RECALL on the scan master only works sometimes. What I mean is, is that whenever I see knock, then try to recall it, sometimes it logs, and sometimes it doesn't. 02 mv's? I don't know. When I hooked all this new high speed shit up those went away. My wide band says low tens a lot of times under wot conditions. At about 50 mph or so.

Here's my plug.

 

[turbo89]

Fuel pump's a hotwired walbro. The pump was new from 08. Less than 500 miles on it. The RECALL on the scan master only works sometimes. What I mean is, is that whenever I see knock, then try to recall it, sometimes it logs, and sometimes it doesn't. 02 mv's? I don't know. When I hooked all this new high speed shit up those went away. My wide band says low tens a lot of times under wot conditions. At about 50 mph or so.

Here's my plug.

I cant tell from that plug as its still way too far away to get an idea.. to read the plugs you really need a close up and even some magnification ...

when you are seeing knock .. what is it ? Are you hearing knock audibly ??
to get knock on 100 and alky at that boost ... its very very uncommon ..

I really cant see the plug well .. look at a few plugs ..

 

[SCOOBY DOO]

What's your battery voltage under load?

 

[robzombie]

Fuel pump's a hotwired walbro. The pump was new from 08. Less than 500 miles on it. The RECALL on the scan master only works sometimes. What I mean is, is that whenever I see knock, then try to recall it, sometimes it logs, and sometimes it doesn't. 02 mv's? I don't know. When I hooked all this new high speed shit up those went away. My wide band says low tens a lot of times under wot conditions. At about 50 mph or so.

Here's my plug.

Same year as the camera according to the date stamp in the pic!!

 

[V6sleeper]

Knock sensor can be torqued down to tight causing over sensitive readings..

 

[Turbo6Smackdown]

The pic actually magnifies pretty close. And that's just the generic date/time group. I never set it.
Actually my battery voltage fluctuates a little. From like 13.5 to 14. I was going to ask if it was supposed to do that. I'll check again.
Knock sensor's a touch tighter than finger tight. It's old too. Should I try a new one?

 

[SHADOWII]

All good suggestions but the plugs should have been your first response, as previously stated. Check for oil, burned electrode, coloration, any deposits. Wet gas smell, may indicate stuck inj. or broken/damaged wire in the harness causing intermittent inj. pulse. The knock sensor should be torqued to 14#. The plugs porcelain should be a lt. tan in color w/good electrode. Some added chemicals will discolor the por. but overall they should look alike. If you can get back to us w/the findings, someone will be able to help from there.

 

[Turbo6Smackdown]

Will pull every plug and inspect. Thank you.

 

[turbo89]

Will pull every plug and inspect. Thank you.

When you look at plugs.. you have to look really close .. and I just cant see from that pic is all ... actually at my age I cant see without having a magnification tool .. if its real knock you will easily see the specks on the electrode and ground strap .. if its severe knock .. you will see silver particles on the plugs .. yes that's actually small speckles of piston aluminum.

with the octane you have and spraying alky it should have NO REAL KNOCK for the boost you are running . IF you see nothing on the plugs to indicate detonation.. and you have no audble signs of it.
with that octane AND alky I would suspect FALSE knock. That would move us on to other areas to look at it.

 

[RmvBfrFlght]

Pictures of plugs showing the specks from detonation:

http://www.dynamicefi.com/SparkPlug.php

RemoveBeforeFlight

 

[Turbo6Smackdown]

Oh yea, and no, I can't hear it. That's a good sign right? lol.

 

[Turbo6Smackdown]

What's your battery voltage under load?

Battery voltage under load from the scanmaster was 13.8-14.3 with constant non stop fluctuation. It never changed from idling to cruising to putting a decent load on the car.

 

[delcowizzid]

At a glance too much timing you want the heat mark on the earth electrode in the middle of the bend not right down where it's welded to the plug

Sent from my LT26w using Tapatalk

 

[Turbo6Smackdown]

I have been running 19/17 timing for all but one day on this season thus far. Is that too much? I have it pulled to 18/16 since the last two drives.

 

[Turbo6Smackdown]

Here's the middle driver's side. Let me know if these pics are any better.

The electrode and ground strap look ok, but the ring is all black and the porcelain is pretty clean. I can see specs but only with looking super close with my jeweler's loupe. Is that ok?

 

[Eazy-E]

I have been running 19/17 timing for all but one day on this season thus far. Is that too much? I have it pulled to 18/16 since the last two drives.

do you always run 103 octane gas and spray alky on top?
those timing numbers with 17 pounds of boost are what most people run on 93 alone? i would think that would be way more than enough octane to cause rich knock.