After reading countless Tranny threads on the site attempting to resolve my no reverse issue with my GN 200r4 I found great info and narrowed it down to replacing the Low Reverse clutch seal. Here is my question, does anyone have some detailed instructions on replacing this seal or an exploded view of location, I am assuming drop the Valve body and it will be there somewhere but I have never torn a part a 200r. Any info will be appreciated
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- Thread starter Jake04
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Nascar83Fan
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- Jul 2, 2010
Unfortunetly i don't have access to the digital version of the 1987 buick regal chassis manual from my phone, that has info on the 200-4R tranny in complete part by part tear down removal detail and putting it all back together to include tools needed along with torque specs etc.
Otherwise i'd upload the chapter in pdf form and post a link to it.
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Otherwise i'd upload the chapter in pdf form and post a link to it.
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Nascar83Fan
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- Jul 2, 2010
Here's where there is a link to the whole chassis manual for download another member shared, it's broken up into multiple pdf's that you can view the parts of it you need without flipping through hundreds of pages to get to a needed section. It's very handy to have it.
http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/index.php?threads/Service-Manual.395266/
Good Luck with getting it resolved. Hope that this helps you with other things down the road as well.
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http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/index.php?threads/Service-Manual.395266/
Good Luck with getting it resolved. Hope that this helps you with other things down the road as well.
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TexasT
Texas, Where are you from
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- Sep 10, 2002
The low/rev is pretty deep inside. After the vb and lock up solenoid, the pump can come out. Then overdrive, the center support, direct and forward drums and sun shell. Then you are to the low/rev. Imo once you are in that deep you should replace the clutches n seals on what you pulled. You can inspect the pump, install a hardened sun shell and hardened stator support, put a pair of hard rings in the pump and maybe a stiffer slide spring. You might want to look at larger boost valves and a stiffer spring to get pressure up. And maybe some vb mods while you are in there. Your call though.
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After reading this I realize this is a little more than just pulling the valve body, so I am sending the tranny out for rebuild, Now since I will have it out should I upgrade the converter, if so any recomendations? I have a close to stock 87 GN I am assiming it has the factory Non lockup in it?? Uprades to the engine are a turbo tweak chip, KN filter, Hot wire fuel pump.
Nascar83Fan
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Does the torque converter on the transmission presently show D5 on it anywhere? From the factory all TR's had lockup converters and a lockup switch solenoid on the transmission that would engage when it needed to.
Unless someone put a non-lockup converter in and unhooked the solenoid, it should still be a lockup converter on your transmission.
What were your future goals with it?
Dave Husek, bison or Dusty Bradford are at least 3 of the most recommended people that do transmission work on 200-4r's and also are members / supporting vendors here. Depending on where you're located one of them may be closer than the other is to you.
They know their stuff and are willing to answer any questions you have on how to proceed based on what you're trying to make the car do.
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Unless someone put a non-lockup converter in and unhooked the solenoid, it should still be a lockup converter on your transmission.
What were your future goals with it?
Dave Husek, bison or Dusty Bradford are at least 3 of the most recommended people that do transmission work on 200-4r's and also are members / supporting vendors here. Depending on where you're located one of them may be closer than the other is to you.
They know their stuff and are willing to answer any questions you have on how to proceed based on what you're trying to make the car do.
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It is still the factory D5, and does still have the solenoid hooked up so that says it is a lock up, just curious if an upgrade would make sense while the tranny is out, my goal is to get the car somewhere in the low 13's, but more of a Friday night cruiser than anything.
Nascar83Fan
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- Jul 2, 2010
You could get the converter refreshed, but if you got say a 9/11 LU that was setup matched to work with the turbo on your car.
Then you'd have your being able to hitting the strip and also be able to have your cruiser on the street in 1 package.
It weighs less than the D5 converter which will mean less rotating weight on the engine and free up alittle power & torque in the process. The turbo will spool up alittle quicker and should reduce your times alittle.
Any of the 3 members i mentioned can better tell you, but alot of people that have used a 9/11 were happy with it.
Is it still the stock turbo on your car?
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Then you'd have your being able to hitting the strip and also be able to have your cruiser on the street in 1 package.
It weighs less than the D5 converter which will mean less rotating weight on the engine and free up alittle power & torque in the process. The turbo will spool up alittle quicker and should reduce your times alittle.
Any of the 3 members i mentioned can better tell you, but alot of people that have used a 9/11 were happy with it.
Is it still the stock turbo on your car?
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Nascar83Fan
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- Jul 2, 2010
It sounds like you had happened to your car that happened to me, when a transmission shop here in el paso tx rebuilt the tranny roughly 3 years ago they swapped in a D6 that is commonly used in other non turbo buick or pontiac tta applications instead of a d5 which is more matched up to our turbo v6's.
Unfortunetly the stock D5 got toasted from one of the 3 bolts backing out and taking alot of stuff with it in the tranny that at the time it happened didnt know when i started having problems with reverse starting to slip before having a big smoke show from the tranny going out weeks later.
Once i have the funds to do it, i'm gonna ditch the D6 and probably have a 9/11 LU installed, it hampers the 60ft etc some having that D6 there even vs a D5 stocker.
The D6 converter has a lower rpm spool range than the D5 converter that was matched up to our turbo v6's that helped them take off out of the hole. Since the D6 converter works at a much lower rpm range to start out at makes even a stock turbo regal have extra lag from a standing start. The D5 converter had a higher rpm range that it'd allow it to spool sooner from a standing start and resulted in solid respectable performance that at the time helped launch our TR's to being at the top of the factory produced gm cars that included beating up on or keeping up with higher priced sports cars.
You'll definitely want to ditch that D6 and get a better matched converter.
That's why it's better to deal with people that know the difference between a 200-4r behind a turbo buick v6 engine vs the other 200-4r applications, they don't go putting in the wrong stuff.
The one shop i had work done where i am located claimed it wasn't different and wasn't special from other 200-4r's.
They also said the 200-4r's weren't good transmissions and were piles of crap. I had argued that they were wrong, but they didn't wanna listen since they claimed to had been rebuilding transmissions for over 10 years. Yet they admitted they were always breaking their transmission of some sort when they took whatever car they used to the track. If they are always working on their stuff, they obviously aren't putting the right stuff behind their engines if they are having that going on.
Needless to say i haven't been back there since they had put it back together and given me a D6 converter in place of something more matched to the engine. Thank goodness it's still holding up quite well these days though, they did good work but don't know TR's for squat.
I wished i had known they did that when i went to go pay the bill when i picked her back up instead of finding out years later.
It'll save you spending money later to go with one of the Turbo Buick 200-4r gurus, don't let some one who doesn't know the differences take your money.
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Unfortunetly the stock D5 got toasted from one of the 3 bolts backing out and taking alot of stuff with it in the tranny that at the time it happened didnt know when i started having problems with reverse starting to slip before having a big smoke show from the tranny going out weeks later.
Once i have the funds to do it, i'm gonna ditch the D6 and probably have a 9/11 LU installed, it hampers the 60ft etc some having that D6 there even vs a D5 stocker.
The D6 converter has a lower rpm spool range than the D5 converter that was matched up to our turbo v6's that helped them take off out of the hole. Since the D6 converter works at a much lower rpm range to start out at makes even a stock turbo regal have extra lag from a standing start. The D5 converter had a higher rpm range that it'd allow it to spool sooner from a standing start and resulted in solid respectable performance that at the time helped launch our TR's to being at the top of the factory produced gm cars that included beating up on or keeping up with higher priced sports cars.
You'll definitely want to ditch that D6 and get a better matched converter.
That's why it's better to deal with people that know the difference between a 200-4r behind a turbo buick v6 engine vs the other 200-4r applications, they don't go putting in the wrong stuff.
The one shop i had work done where i am located claimed it wasn't different and wasn't special from other 200-4r's.
They also said the 200-4r's weren't good transmissions and were piles of crap. I had argued that they were wrong, but they didn't wanna listen since they claimed to had been rebuilding transmissions for over 10 years. Yet they admitted they were always breaking their transmission of some sort when they took whatever car they used to the track. If they are always working on their stuff, they obviously aren't putting the right stuff behind their engines if they are having that going on.
Needless to say i haven't been back there since they had put it back together and given me a D6 converter in place of something more matched to the engine. Thank goodness it's still holding up quite well these days though, they did good work but don't know TR's for squat.
I wished i had known they did that when i went to go pay the bill when i picked her back up instead of finding out years later.
It'll save you spending money later to go with one of the Turbo Buick 200-4r gurus, don't let some one who doesn't know the differences take your money.
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Nascar83Fan
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- Jul 2, 2010
No problem, you should be able to easily reach your goals with the D6 out of the equation and you have a better suited matched up converter in there.
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Any good name 9.5 or 10" lockup with a stall of 24-2800 would be ideal & give you some room to grow if you do on down the line.
Don't cheap out & buy some ebay garbage for $200. Expect to pay $450 on up for something decent.
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Don't cheap out & buy some ebay garbage for $200. Expect to pay $450 on up for something decent.
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TexasT
Texas, Where are you from
- Joined
- Sep 10, 2002
X2 on getting someone with a decent rep to overhaul your trans.
I would defintely replace the converter. You will think it is a new car with a good converter.
Have them put in a carbon band and make sure you get your "694" servo or a aftermarket servo. The other upgrades I mentioned should be considered mandatory also. If your builder doesn't know them you probably need a different builder.
Low 13s should be no prob with a good running stock car in street trim.
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I would defintely replace the converter. You will think it is a new car with a good converter.
Have them put in a carbon band and make sure you get your "694" servo or a aftermarket servo. The other upgrades I mentioned should be considered mandatory also. If your builder doesn't know them you probably need a different builder.
Low 13s should be no prob with a good running stock car in street trim.
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I just noticed this thread. How did you come to the conclusion the low reverse "seal" is out? There's two lip seals on the apply piston and there is a sealing cup that is pressed into the case and is visible with the vb and plate off. Compressed air can be applied almost directly to the piston and a very good seal can be made against the cup with a rubber tipped air nozzle. You can watch the clutch pack apply through the window in the case. If you do this and it won't apply then the lip seal(s) are damaged. I had one today that was like this.
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