Radar detectors and Laser

[TwinyTwin]

I run a laser jammer on my truck from a company called laser pro park. The good thing about this unit is that it also doubles as a parking sensor.

Just this past Saturday I was driving my truck with my brother and friend coming back from the Army/Navy store. As we hit this one main stretch of road that is not known for radar/laser traps my unit goes nuts. I was doing 60 in a 45 zone, I slowed down to the posted speed limit and then cut the unit off. The reason for doing this is so that the operator of the laser system does not get a jam to gun code. I know this because I have a friend who works for the local pd and we tried this out to see if the unit actually jammed laser. As we come rolling past the police officer standing on the side of the road with his two other buddies sitting in the car waiting to make the bust. He had a very confused look on his face. He looks down at the gun and then back at the truck. He must have been wondering why he could not get a reading then all of a sudden got one. As soon as we passed him. I look in my rear view and notice he is still eye balling my truck really hard. So he takes one last aim at the truck and then goes back to get the on coming traffic.

 

[ARL]

Explained and to the point!

Radio waves, just as light waves (they both exist on the electromagnetic spectrum), travel at the speed of light, or 670,616,629.3844 mph. Theoretically the radio waves will be transmitted from the radar gun to the target, which will set off the radar detector, are reflected and return to the radar gun (transmit/receive), and display a reading. Quite frankly, I would have to agree that the radar detector would alert to the presence of radar first simple because it reads the radio waves sooner than the radar gun receives the waves. Think of the path of travel the waves must take and you will see it's a out and back trip, and the radar detector will 'see' the radio waves before the radar receives the waves back and mathematically calculates the speed using the doppler effect. However, because radio waves travel at the speed of light the argument is a little ridiculous. In reality the popo will know exactly how fast you are going at the same instant your radar detector is going off and then you are going to react and begin braking. The point being that with instant-on radar, if YOU are targeted and alerted by your radar detector (or LIDAR detector), then it's already too late.

Radar is very messy, and the radio wave cone is very broad, splashing radio waves all over the place in that large cone. LIDAR is very precise, and at a distance of 1000' the diamter of the beam is 3' if I recall correctly. I would have to go back and look at my research/training material to verify. This is why I suggest that LIDAR, when deployed properly, may not even necessarily activate the LIDAR detector. Especially of the LIDAR detector is mounted at the top of the windshield. The LIDAR would be excellent for picking specific targets out of a lot of traffic because LIDAR calculates speed by a time-of-flight method, measuring the time it takes the beam to go out and back, and will do this multiple times in a span of less than a second, thereby giving a speed reading. Downfalls of the LIDAR is that it must be deployed 'currently' from a stationary position, and is suseptable to wave attenutation by things such as rain, fog, etc.

Sorry for the bad spelling, it's late.

Real good job on the explanation. Alot of folks don't understand the basic principal of radar. Folks seem to think we just aim or shoot, or just run radar in transmit mode continously. Vehicle estimation, verify, target locked. I love time and distance, no argument, period. No detectors made for that, obviously.. Radar is just a tool to back up the popo's opinion to the speed of the violator.

 

[SilverSleeper]

I've never had a detector, except for the lump of mass in my head called a brain, and common sense.

However, lately, I have been thinking about one. For the simple reason that I get tailgated a lot, but in the dark. Mostly because I am doing the speed limit (or maybe 5 above) and on some stretches of road you will get run over if you're not doing at least 10-15 over. Most of my driving is early morning (dark) or since its winter, by the time Im out of work, its getting dark.
So, when I have cars sucking up my tailpipe fumes, I really would like to know if its a cop, or just an impatient driver. When everyone used to drive Crown Vics or the Caprice, it was easy to pick out the headlights. But, not so much anymore, since our county has everything from a new Hemi Charger, an Impala, Trailblazers, some older Yukons, even a E150 van and a Dodge ram. Not to mention what the NYS troopers have all over.

Its not that I'm running illegal, about the only thing they may have issue with is my Sirius unit suction cupped to the windshield, but down really low in the passenger corner of the dash. But, I've pulled over for what I thought a regular tailgater before, and instantly the lights come on and officer pulls me over, and I get some sort of "fit description", or some BS excuse, because they haven't had time to run my plates yet or something. Then they just like to sit there and make me 20 minutes late to work. I have a vanity plate on my Cruiser that sort of makes people wonder if its for real. I got followed around by every officer here for about 2 weeks when I first put it on. And now, I have drivers that must be offended, or try to be testy with me over it, so they tailgate me and some have tried to run me off the road. Not gonna say what it is, but honestly its not that bad, and NYS DMV let me have it, its not a fake.

I'm pretty sure most of the guys around here run whatever they use on all the time, because I've seen them just pull a u turn in traffic and go hauling after someone. Is it worth it to get anything, or should I not bother? Honestly, when I get tailgated, I usually drop a couple gears and stab the gas for a couple and let off, and they get the point. But I don't want to do that in front of a cop. But I really hate that when a cop is tailgating you, and trying to make you unconsciously go faster so he can ticket you. I just don't want to fall into that trap again.

 

[bison]

IMO a detector doesnt do dick to protect you. It only lets you know youve been hit. If your speeding all the time then you will get caught eventually. Especially when you are the only one on the road. I used to have a detector years ago and i remember a couple times where there was no detection and then the detector went crazy within a few hundred feet of the cruiser. Like they swithched it on when i got in range to avoid detection.

 

[bison]

I've never had a detector, except for the lump of mass in my head called a brain, and common sense.

However, lately, I have been thinking about one. For the simple reason that I get tailgated a lot, but in the dark. Mostly because I am doing the speed limit (or maybe 5 above) and on some stretches of road you will get run over if you're not doing at least 10-15 over. Most of my driving is early morning (dark) or since its winter, by the time Im out of work, its getting dark.
So, when I have cars sucking up my tailpipe fumes, I really would like to know if its a cop, or just an impatient driver. When everyone used to drive Crown Vics or the Caprice, it was easy to pick out the headlights. But, not so much anymore, since our county has everything from a new Hemi Charger, an Impala, Trailblazers, some older Yukons, even a E150 van and a Dodge ram. Not to mention what the NYS troopers have all over.

Its not that I'm running illegal, about the only thing they may have issue with is my Sirius unit suction cupped to the windshield, but down really low in the passenger corner of the dash. But, I've pulled over for what I thought a regular tailgater before, and instantly the lights come on and officer pulls me over, and I get some sort of "fit description", or some BS excuse, because they haven't had time to run my plates yet or something. Then they just like to sit there and make me 20 minutes late to work. I have a vanity plate on my Cruiser that sort of makes people wonder if its for real. I got followed around by every officer here for about 2 weeks when I first put it on. And now, I have drivers that must be offended, or try to be testy with me over it, so they tailgate me and some have tried to run me off the road. Not gonna say what it is, but honestly its not that bad, and NYS DMV let me have it, its not a fake.

I'm pretty sure most of the guys around here run whatever they use on all the time, because I've seen them just pull a u turn in traffic and go hauling after someone. Is it worth it to get anything, or should I not bother? Honestly, when I get tailgated, I usually drop a couple gears and stab the gas for a couple and let off, and they get the point. But I don't want to do that in front of a cop. But I really hate that when a cop is tailgating you, and trying to make you unconsciously go faster so he can ticket you. I just don't want to fall into that trap again.

If they are tailgating then empty your windshield washer fluid all over them. If theyre close enough to get sprayed then they are too close.

 

[TR Custom Parts]

CONN84Gn. Suggest you follow the posted limits to avoid the need for a radar detector. Follow my example.

 

[JOHNDEEREGN]

I have run the Valentine 1 in rural Kansas, Nebraska, Colorado traveling for years. It saves me a LOT but then again our technology probably is NO WHERE NEAR you guys up in Conn. and the rest of the East Coast.

Hell there are spots in Western Kansas it is 90 miles or more between towns. (insert hillbilly smilie here)

 

[TR Custom Parts]

Ah Kansas............ Ran thru there back in '76 doing a banzai run across the country in a bright yellow Mustang Mach 1 with Cali plates. This was the year after the national 55mph speed limit went into effect. We were averaging about 90 thru Kansas until we got nailed at 5:30 in the morning doing 95.

My friend was driving and we had to follow Barney Fife to the local mailbox to pay the fine. I took over the driving and ended up getting a ticket about 5 miles down the road doing 75. Barney must have radioed ahead to watch for a bright yellow Mustang.:biggrin: We sort of stood out like a sore thumb plus we were about the only car on the road at that time.

 

[bison]

Lol.... And you say this from personal experience? Let me be very clear. The detector will absolutely NOT alert before the Radar or Laser gets a reading if the cop is using a newer Radar/Laser unit. That's a myth and if you choose to believe that then that's your choice but before you raise the BS flag have something more then your opinion to back it up before you do so.

In the city the unit would not pick up a target that far away because of obvious building interference. On the highway with a KA band unit it absolutely would. This I know because I have measured it myself with a couple trooper friends of mine when we became certified to operate the units. We went to the extreme but it was just for fun to see how far the more expensive and sensitive KA band radars would work.

With Laser you would not pick something up at 10 miles cause you wouldn't beable to see what your aiming at. The Radar has a wide beam and would certainly pick up a vehicle at those distances as long as there are no clear obstructions as I stated.

What rules are you talking about? lol.... City police departments have no rules. Even if there was a rule anything past 1000 feet would be too far to see anyway.

So what you understand vs. what you think vs. what is facts are about Radar and Laser units are obviously (3) different things.

Id like to see how the prosecutor would react if someone told him the officer tagged him at over 1000 feet so it doesnt count. That would be some funny $hit:biggrin: .

 

[JOHNDEEREGN]

Ah Kansas............ Ran thru there back in '76 doing a banzai run across the country in a bright yellow Mustang Mach 1 with Cali plates. This was the year after the national 55mph speed limit went into effect. We were averaging about 90 thru Kansas until we got nailed at 5:30 in the morning doing 95.

My friend was driving and we had to follow Barney Fife to the local mailbox to pay the fine. I took over the driving and ended up getting a ticket about 5 miles down the road doing 75. Barney must have radioed ahead to watch for a bright yellow Mustang.:biggrin: We sort of stood out like a sore thumb plus we were about the only car on the road at that time.

Must a ran Hwy 36 East to West across Northern Kansas or Visa Versa

 

[TR Custom Parts]

cornfields on the left and cornfields on the right and the road was straight as far as you could see. Don't remember which interstate it was, almost 33 years ago!

 

[A2000RICH]

Radio waves, just as light waves (they both exist on the electromagnetic spectrum), travel at the speed of light, or 670,616,629.3844 mph. Theoretically the radio waves will be transmitted from the radar gun to the target, which will set off the radar detector, are reflected and return to the radar gun (transmit/receive), and display a reading. Quite frankly, I would have to agree that the radar detector would alert to the presence of radar first simple because it reads the radio waves sooner than the radar gun receives the waves. Think of the path of travel the waves must take and you will see it's a out and back trip, and the radar detector will 'see' the radio waves before the radar receives the waves back and mathematically calculates the speed using the doppler effect. However, because radio waves travel at the speed of light the argument is a little ridiculous. In reality the popo will know exactly how fast you are going at the same instant your radar detector is going off and then you are going to react and begin braking. The point being that with instant-on radar, if YOU are targeted and alerted by your radar detector (or LIDAR detector), then it's already too late.

Radar is very messy, and the radio wave cone is very broad, splashing radio waves all over the place in that large cone. LIDAR is very precise, and at a distance of 1000' the diamter of the beam is 3' if I recall correctly. I would have to go back and look at my research/training material to verify. This is why I suggest that LIDAR, when deployed properly, may not even necessarily activate the LIDAR detector. Especially of the LIDAR detector is mounted at the top of the windshield. The LIDAR would be excellent for picking specific targets out of a lot of traffic because LIDAR calculates speed by a time-of-flight method, measuring the time it takes the beam to go out and back, and will do this multiple times in a span of less than a second, thereby giving a speed reading. Downfalls of the LIDAR is that it must be deployed 'currently' from a stationary position, and is suseptable to wave attenutation by things such as rain, fog, etc.

Sorry for the bad spelling, it's late.

i agree with you but i feel if we are going to discuss this silly subject with detector "believers" we should use science to do it completely---------think about it this way-------the radio/radar wave leaves the gun at the speed of 186,000 miles sec-------it reflects off your car and lets assume your detector responds immediately and your brain/foot combination can hit the brake essentially instantly (we both agree this is impossible but lets make the ridiculous assumption anyhow)-----when your instantly responding detector alarm goes off you have two warning signals------audibly and visually--------your detector is on the dash or visor-------sound travels at the snails pace of only 1 ft per millisecond---------before the sound arrives at your ears the laser/radar signal has returned to the gun, recorded your speed and bypassed the cop by hundreds of miles--------and you still have to react------and we haven't allowed any time for propogation delay in the microprocessors of the detector which is actually a lot considering our reference for this topic is the speed of light--------as for your eyes it takes them several milliseconds to respond to a visual signal------(thats why movies and TV's look like they are moving when we all know they are really compilations of single still frames)-------its totally ridiculous to think that there is any way a detector can protect you from a cop that is using one of these newer devices correctly-------and to try to calculate the energy required to slow a car 10 or 20 miles an hour in a few milliseconds?????? its just science fiction especially if we don't want to kill the occupants ---------radar detectors and laser detectors are one of the greatest examples of 20th century snake oil technology--------they are like locks-------they remind good drivers to continue to obey the speed limits-------they offer little to no protection--------the only protection from speeding tickets is a really good lawyer that has a good relationship with the DA................RC

 

[SS_Sean]

Thank you, and good night!!! :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:

 

[turbojimmy]

All i know is if a cop flips it on and then off and has his aim on you, no radar detector is gonna save you.

True, which is why you can't use the radar detector as a free pass to do whatever you'd like. It's a tool that works best in conjunction with common sense and it's not foolproof. I like to drive a little faster than the posted limits, but also drive courteously and with respect to conditions and the environment. Let's face it, some speed limits are set artificially low specifically for revenue generation. I pass through many rural areas on my way to work that allow me to bypass the major highways. Cops in these towns LOVE to pick off commuters who they don't believe should be using their roads for this purpose. My Bel has saved me COUNTLESS times on these roads. Mostly Ka, with the occasional K band.

On the highway, however, you need to employ a little more strategy. I always keep someone out ahead of me as bait. Listen for the blip from the detector when they get 'instant on'd', watch for brake lights up ahead. People stand on their brakes when they see a cop no matter how fast or slow they're going. It's a sure sign of a cop set up in the median.

I've had the laser detection light up before, but it's pretty much useless. It will only light up when you take a direct hit or a glancing blow from another car. You can see them a mile away anyway, since laser is line-of-sight. You see the brake lights, then the guy freezing his gonads off standing outside his car with the gun. Again, common sense applies - if you're the only one on the road it's best to suck it up and obey the limits.

The only ticket I've gotten with my Bel was when it wasn't plugged in (had unplugged it in order to plug in my GPS and forgot that I wasn't 'protected').

they remind good drivers to continue to obey the speed limits-------they offer little to no protection--------the only protection from speeding tickets is a really good lawyer that has a good relationship with the DA................RC

They remind fast drivers to slow down to the speed limit. They offer plenty of protection. I went from multiple tickets per year to one in the past 4 years after buying my Bels (have had a couple of them).

A good, well connected lawyer is not protection from a ticket unless you keep him in the car with you all the time. A good lawyer will get your ticket reduced or eliminated in court, though.

Jim

 

[leprcon]

k-40 radar detector front and rear with laser diffuser fron and rear. has more than payed for itself. i got one ticket from a airplane and got it thrown out of court. also has a trooper try to give me a ticket for unlawful speed but couldn't prove it because laser wasn't "acting" right lol really best investment ever. if you had to get a window mount i would go with a v1.

but understand that alot of high end cars come with factory tint on their window although light, really diminishes the effectivness of a radar detector

 

[BASS]

Ok, the moral of the story is: Radar detectors DO help warm you if you have speeders in front of you and they get zapped first. If your all alone speeding and the cop has instant-on or laser, your screwed.

There is one thing that sounds too good to be true though that I saw advertised in the back of a Car and Driver magazine, and thats a GPS tracker that supposedly tells the driver the locations of all the cop cars within the vicinity since supposedly all the cop cars these days are equipped with GPS units so their stations know where their officeers are..If this device really works, it would be awesome, but I havent read anything from anyone that has had experince with these GPS trackers..

 

[turbojimmy]

Ok, the moral of the story is: Radar detectors DO help warm you if you have speeders in front of you and they get zapped first. If your all alone speeding and the cop has instant-on or laser, your screwed.

There is one thing that sounds too good to be true though that I saw advertised in the back of a Car and Driver magazine, and thats a GPS tracker that supposedly tells the driver the locations of all the cop cars within the vicinity since supposedly all the cop cars these days are equipped with GPS units so their stations know where their officeers are..If this device really works, it would be awesome, but I havent read anything from anyone that has had experince with these GPS trackers..

I don't know about that. But the new BELs allow you to 'mark' speed traps, redlight cameras and false alarms using GPS. The next time you approach those coordinates, you will be warned (or not warned in the case of a false alarm). This would help with the instant-on, too, if they sit in the same place all the time.

Jim

 

[Blown&Injected]

Lol.... And you say this from personal experience? Let me be very clear. The detector will absolutely NOT alert before the Radar or Laser gets a reading if the cop is using a newer Radar/Laser unit. That's a myth and if you choose to believe that then that's your choice but before you raise the BS flag have something more then your opinion to back it up before you do so.

In the city the unit would not pick up a target that far away because of obvious building interference. On the highway with a KA band unit it absolutely would. This I know because I have measured it myself with a couple trooper friends of mine when we became certified to operate the units. We went to the extreme but it was just for fun to see how far the more expensive and sensitive KA band radars would work.

With Laser you would not pick something up at 10 miles cause you wouldn't beable to see what your aiming at. The Radar has a wide beam and would certainly pick up a vehicle at those distances as long as there are no clear obstructions as I stated.

What rules are you talking about? lol.... City police departments have no rules. Even if there was a rule anything past 1000 feet would be too far to see anyway.

So what you understand vs. what you think vs. what is facts are about Radar and Laser units are obviously (3) different things.

LMAO - Ka is even lower power - have you ever known anything about radar?

 

[Blown&Injected]

Radio waves, just as light waves (they both exist on the electromagnetic spectrum), travel at the speed of light, or 670,616,629.3844 mph. Theoretically the radio waves will be transmitted from the radar gun to the target, which will set off the radar detector, are reflected and return to the radar gun (transmit/receive), and display a reading. Quite frankly, I would have to agree that the radar detector would alert to the presence of radar first simple because it reads the radio waves sooner than the radar gun receives the waves. Think of the path of travel the waves must take and you will see it's a out and back trip, and the radar detector will 'see' the radio waves before the radar receives the waves back and mathematically calculates the speed using the doppler effect. However, because radio waves travel at the speed of light the argument is a little ridiculous. In reality the popo will know exactly how fast you are going at the same instant your radar detector is going off and then you are going to react and begin braking. The point being that with instant-on radar, if YOU are targeted and alerted by your radar detector (or LIDAR detector), then it's already too late.

Radar is very messy, and the radio wave cone is very broad, splashing radio waves all over the place in that large cone. LIDAR is very precise, and at a distance of 1000' the diamter of the beam is 3' if I recall correctly. I would have to go back and look at my research/training material to verify. This is why I suggest that LIDAR, when deployed properly, may not even necessarily activate the LIDAR detector. Especially of the LIDAR detector is mounted at the top of the windshield. The LIDAR would be excellent for picking specific targets out of a lot of traffic because LIDAR calculates speed by a time-of-flight method, measuring the time it takes the beam to go out and back, and will do this multiple times in a span of less than a second, thereby giving a speed reading. Downfalls of the LIDAR is that it must be deployed 'currently' from a stationary position, and is suseptable to wave attenutation by things such as rain, fog, etc.

Sorry for the bad spelling, it's late.

Agreed!

 

[chopped39]

They aim with laser at the plate or headligts, laser jammers are your best bet, I use. A Valentine1 and is never let me down, of course I did get a speeding ticket in my wives frickin van ( no V1) figures and cost be a grand to get out of it ,it was in a work zone on a Sunday no workers but still stuck it to me!

My buddies wife got nailed on I88 54 IN A 45 WORK ZONE $750.00