Race fuel question....

[Coltsfan1]

Ok here is my question.... I have a stock tta. Rebuilt turbo from bison. Injector and chip upgrade from tt. If I run race fuel will I be safe without the need for a scan master or alky.........now I don't drive my car more than 100 miles a year so I'm not concerned about cost of fuel. I'm more concerned with insurance for when I get on it. Will the race fuel give as much security as the alky? I'm learning so any info would be great

Thanks Chad
GO BRONCOS

 

[Coltsfan1]

Additional. I don't track it. Just wanting to turn the boost up a lil and have fun slapping her ass once in awhile

 

[tta983]

Race fuel is the way they used to do it without alky or e85 but it is hard on the o2 sensor. I sure hope you have a way of montoring the knock. Whether it be scanmaster or else!

 

[turbo89]

Ok here is my question.... I have a stock tta. Rebuilt turbo from bison. Injector and chip upgrade from tt. If I run race fuel will I be safe without the need for a scan master or alky.........now I don't drive my car more than 100 miles a year so I'm not concerned about cost of fuel. I'm more concerned with insurance for when I get on it. Will the race fuel give as much security as the alky? I'm learning so any info would be great

Thanks Chad
GO BRONCOS

Depends on what TT chip is in it ? What fuel was it made for ?

If its a 93 octane chip with the default settings left alone and you ran 100 octane unleaded .. then yes you could get away with 20 psi @ 17 degrees of timing without worrying about detonation .. or killing a O2

I would be more worried about only putting on 100 miles per year and flogging it when you do take it out ... stuff goes bad from sitting .. especially fuel

 

[Pronto]

Why fly blind? Octane is not the only cause of knock. What it your fuel pump started to fail and you went lean? The knock monitor is one of the best features of the Scanmaster.

 

[TurboWh1]

I would agree with these folks. Not worth the risk. Alky in my opinion is very user friendly but I completely understand if you don’t want to add it to a car that maybe all original. Get you a scanmaster and hide it in the car somewhere, that way when you need it you have it!!

 

[TTA976]

Once you start turning up the boost you will definitely need a fuel pump and hot wire, scanmaster and and aftermarket boost gauge at a minimum.
Get a scanmaster and make sure your parameters are set right. Put 110 octane in and get the boost up 22# ...O2's around 825ish...and leave it alone...All the additional equipment is not need for 100-150 miles a year.

 

[Nick Micale]

Here is my opinion based upon 30 years of working on these cars starting with my original 1987 car that I special ordered, and now has 9500 miles.

It does not have a cat or the stock air box, but no other mods. Fuel pump was replaced in the 90's, the rest is stock.

I always used 110 octane leaded race gas for 2 reasons, it has more than enough octane to support the existing HP level, and it has a very long shelf life as compared to crap unleaded gas.

Screw the O2 sensor, the $20 Denso unit will last you for years with your situation, as will the NGK spark plugs.

As mentioned, a hot wire kit for the fuel pump is also a good idea.

 

[turbo89]

Here is my opinion based upon 30 years of working on these cars starting with my original 1987 car that I special ordered, and now has 9500 miles.

It does not have a cat or the stock air box, but no other mods. Fuel pump was replaced in the 90's, the rest is stock.

I always used 110 octane leaded race gas for 2 reasons, it has more than enough octane to support the existing HP level, and it has a very long shelf life as compared to crap unleaded gas.

Screw the O2 sensor, the $20 Denso unit will last you for years with your situation, as will the NGK spark plugs.

As mentioned, a hot wire kit for the fuel pump is also a good idea.

The reason I suggested 100 octane and the setup above is because that same setup has netted mid 12's @ 108-110 on EVERY TTA ive done .. and I have yet to have seen one
detonate or even come close to knocking with the out of the box TT chip settings on a 93 chip .

FWIW it will be SLOWER with 110 Octane LEADED RACE FUEL with the boost / timing he will run than 100 OCT .. been there DONE that don't know how many times with a TTA

 

[Mark T-TB]

Hopefully you will use an entire tank of gas in that 100 miles , as mentioned, gas does have a "shelf life", especially if it has even 10% ethanol.
If you can get "pure" gasoline, that would probably help (none available near me ).
"Some" race gas is touted as being "ethanol free", altho I bought some VP a couple of years ago that I later found out was not. Someone (not sure which brand) has a fuel that they recommend specifically for classic/antique cars that don't see a lot of use. The guys at the Simeone Museum (many multi-million $$ cars) use a Sonoco race gas since it has a multi-year shelf life even without any stabilizer (might be leaded?).
Good Luck

 

[Coltsfan1]

My apologies I have upgraded the fuel pump-wire kit.. I just hate the look of the s canister and pillar gauges as I'm trying to stay stock.....so to recap..
Stock rebuilt turbo.
Stock air cleaner.
60 lb injectors and chip by TTA
Stock downpipe with no cat
Trans rebuilt by art carr 3200 stall
Upgraded fuel pump and wire kit

Thanks for the help. I'm learning. Just want to turn up a little boost.
Only additional I might do is Nicks DP

Chad

 

[Coltsfan1]

I need to call and verify with Eric at TTA and see if my chip is good or of it needs reprogrammed.

 

[Scott89TTA]

Why are you running a 3200 stall converter on a stock motor and turbo? That converter is designed for a much larger then stock turbo and would be way to loose and actually slow you down. Also unless you plan on upgrading to a bigger turbo and turning boost up to 22+ psi the 3" DP really isn't going to do much on a stock setup either. Also if you're going to keep the stock restricted airbox why upgrade the exhaust if you plan to restrict the intake? Not running a Scanmaster is just asking for trouble even on a stock TTA these days especially if you plan to run anything over stock 16 psi.

 

[Coltsfan1]

I ment to say 2800.......

 

[Coltsfan1]

And I agree about the PD.

 

[Nick Micale]

Why are you running a 3200 stall converter on a stock motor and turbo? That converter is designed for a much larger then stock turbo and would be way to loose and actually slow you down..........

Not trying to beat you up Scott, but just because the converter is labeled as a 3200 stall that is just a number which is not an absolute level since there are many variables in converters, and how they labeled with a given number does not mean they all perform the same?

In all the hundreds of GN's I have built and modified, most all that come to me are way too tight, or the customer wants a tighter converter, but is happy with what I spec with a higher stall.

I just changed the converter on a car here that pulled 700 RWHP on the dyno, but my stock daily driver would kill it off the line for a block or more, after the new converter it is now an easy mid-10 car.

My original turbo T with only 9000 miles has the cat removed, dual mufflers, open air filter, chip with a 10" non-lock up converter will run in the 12's, and it is awesome on the street, and did not slow that car down at all.

 

[Coltsfan1]

Nick somehow I lost ur cell. Pm me with it and best time to reach u. Thanks

 

[bison]

Ok here is my question.... I have a stock tta. Rebuilt turbo from bison. Injector and chip upgrade from tt. If I run race fuel will I be safe without the need for a scan master or alky.........now I don't drive my car more than 100 miles a year so I'm not concerned about cost of fuel. I'm more concerned with insurance for when I get on it. Will the race fuel give as much security as the alky? I'm learning so any info would be great

Thanks Chad
GO BRONCOS

If you have a solid fuel system, verify timing, and have a chip burned for how hard you're running it and what fuel and you will be fine. The same way we ran our cars in the 80's and 90's. I did cheat and have an OTC 2000 that I used to read o2 millivolts. I also had a volt meter I would use to tap into o2 circuit with in different cars.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[1987 Six Shooter]

Go broncos!

 

[Scott89TTA]

Not trying to beat you up Scott, but just because the converter is labeled as a 3200 stall that is just a number which is not an absolute level since there are many variables in converters, and how they labeled with a given number does not mean they all perform the same?

In all the hundreds of GN's I have built and modified, most all that come to me are way too tight, or the customer wants a tighter converter, but is happy with what I spec with a higher stall.

I just changed the converter on a car here that pulled 700 RWHP on the dyno, but my stock daily driver would kill it off the line for a block or more, after the new converter it is now an easy mid-10 car.

My original turbo T with only 9000 miles has the cat removed, dual mufflers, open air filter, chip with a 10" non-lock up converter will run in the 12's, and it is awesome on the street, and did not slow that car down at all.

No problem Nick, My point was simply that he stated the car was for the most part stock with the exception of the 60lb injectors and a TT chip and had no intent of upgrading anything else. He also said the car had a 3200 stall converter at which I said it was too much converter for a 100% stock TTA with the stock T3 turbo...the stock converter was designed for the setup works just fine in this case. My comment about slowing the car down would be mainly in the case of drag racing and the percentage of slippage of the 3200 would most certainly cost him power and MPH especially on the top end and build unwanted temps in the trans and converter. Now he did correct himself saying it was a 2800 stall and not a 3200 stall which would be much more acceptable on a stock TTA I don't know of anyone that would recommend a 3200 stall converter on a 100% stock TTA...there is no benefit or reason. I if you look at all the charts they really don't even start to recommend higher then stock stall converters like the 2800 until upgrading to something like a TE-60. Even with the very popular TA49 Precision only recommends a 2600 not to say a 2800 wouldn't work in this case cause we all know it will but that is hardly stock anymore either.

I'm sure you are familiar with these converter recommendation charts as well
http://www.gnttype.org/techarea/turbo/turboupdate.html

Hey I ran a TCS billet 9/11 3400-3600 stall converter....with a PT6776 standard journal for about 8 years and it worked pretty good getting my stock head and cam TTA to a 11.17 @ 122 with a 1.48 60ft

-Scott