My new TA SI Heads and GN1 Aluminum Heads

turbodave231 said:
The truth will set you free!!

This was a fun project!! It was nice to compare two products side by side. We took some serious weight off the TA's with this process.........and it took more than 5 minutes Brian!!!! I bet we spent an hour or more on each head.

But I'm sure Rick's results will be well worth our effort.

This is the first set of TA's I've looked at and re-worked. So far, I am impressed. I would buy them un-assembled with the valve job done to make the rework faster. I can see even more opportunity to obtain more flow out of the TA heads, but I'd want to verify all changes on a flowbench.

My feedback on the TA's:
  • Overall a Very Nice product
  • Valve bowls should be pocket ported out of the box (nobody would want to use them as shipped)
  • Combustion chamber should be CNC machined out of the box
  • Lot of potential for more flow
  • Overall cost is more than the GN1's
  • A specific set of rocker arms is available that avoid the pushrod interference problems inherent with the GN1's
  • Better Availability than the other alternative
Click to expand...
This bullet point below. Does this mean out of the box or above and beyond the GN1s?
  • Lot of potential for more flow
 
IMG_20150709_155132223.jpg IMG_20150606_161338191.jpg IMG_20150530_120336711_HDR.jpg IMG_20150530_120243342_HDR.jpg Here are a few pics of TA heads I did recently. Probably the last set I will do. Trying to quit.
 
Looks like some nice work there!

I think the Gn1's will flow better out of the box, but the TA's have more potential when fully ported.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
 
turbodave231 said:
Looks like some nice work there!

I think the Gn1's will flow better out of the box, but the TA's have more potential when fully ported.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Which head has been faster? We have flowed a bunch of heads, small valve GN1s, first and 3rd gen GN1Rs, ported TAs that weren't that great, and a set of TAs that were killer. All by the same place. The killer TAs flowed the most, but the 3rd gen GN1Rs weren't the highest flowing GN1Rs available. Without having a set of those, I cant speak for them. I know what the high flowing TAs flowed on another bench, and what they flowed when we had them done, and it wasnt close, but atleast a apples to apples comparison, and we know how fast they have been.
 
GN1s have been in the 7s as well. These flow numbers have track times to back them up as well. Stage 2 heads still hold the TSO record, so flow has something to do with it.
 
To get a car in the 7's there is so much more involved than just flow #'s its really hard to say how important that single variable is to the entire combo.

My personal experience FWIW: I still think you can get a stock style head car down the front half of the track faster than a S2 head car which can be an advantage in a Buick due to aerodynamics.

I believe S2 heads are out front because most of them run cam profiles more appropriate for the RPM range that the motors are running in for those speeds and we have more experience making big HP #'s with them.

I believe a TA head that flows 85-90% of what a S2 head does with a smaller valve, less port volume and higher port velocity along with the appropriate cam profile for the RPM range the motor is going to run in, can have an advantage over a S2 head.
 
turbobuick said:
To get a car in the 7's there is so much more involved than just flow #'s its really hard to say how important that single variable is to the entire combo.

My personal experience FWIW: I still think you can get a stock style head car down the front half of the track faster than a S2 head car which can be an advantage in a Buick due to aerodynamics.

I believe S2 heads are out front because most of them run cam profiles more appropriate for the RPM range that the motors are running in for those speeds and we have more experience making big HP #'s with them.

I believe a TA head that flows 85-90% of what a S2 head does with a smaller valve, less port volume and higher port velocity along with the appropriate cam profile for the RPM range the motor is going to run in, can have an advantage over a S2 head.
Click to expand...
I agree. I think it is just a matter of figuring out how to get that power out of them. Look how every class gets faster, especially TSM. Not much has changed in the heads. I went from small valve GN1s that flowed in the 230s to GN1Rs that flowed 257 peak, and flowed more the entire curve. The car made the same power once the backpressure came up. Power was up at lower boost.
 
turbobuick said:
To get a car in the 7's there is so much more involved than just flow #'s its really hard to say how important that single variable is to the entire combo.

My personal experience FWIW: I still think you can get a stock style head car down the front half of the track faster than a S2 head car which can be an advantage in a Buick due to aerodynamics.

I believe S2 heads are out front because most of them run cam profiles more appropriate for the RPM range that the motors are running in for those speeds and we have more experience making big HP #'s with them.

I believe a TA head that flows 85-90% of what a S2 head does with a smaller valve, less port volume and higher port velocity along with the appropriate cam profile for the RPM range the motor is going to run in, can have an advantage over a S2 head.
Click to expand...

I agree and also believe that a lot of these fast S2 combos are in the real high compression range to make them work well.
AG.
 
Which of the 2 heads has the best et and mph, Champion or Ta. It seems Ta's outflow the Gn1 on the intake and Gn1 outflow Ta's on the exhaust side.
 
Which of the 2 heads has the best et and mph, Champion or Ta. It seems Ta's outflow the Gn1 on the intake and Gn1 outflow Ta's on the exhaust side.
 
ttypewhite said:
Which of the 2 heads has the best et and mph, Champion or Ta. It seems Ta's outflow the Gn1 on the intake and Gn1 outflow Ta's on the exhaust side.
Click to expand...

Our experience with Champion and TA alum heads with max ported versions is that their performance is about equal.

When the first 109 block went into the 8's, it was with Champion heads we prepared on a TSM GN, and a stock intake which had been welded to raise the ports to match the increased height of head intake ports. The calculations to accomplish this is well over 900 HP.

The TA heads have excellent flow on the exhaust side and requires little port work, mainly just a clean-up and port match for applications well into the 9's.

Availability of TA heads is outstanding, as I stock many SI and SE heads for various levels of performance.
 
Which of the 2 heads has the best et and mph, Champion or Ta. It seems Ta's outflow the Gn1 on the intake and Gn1 outflow Ta's on the exhaust side.
Nick Micale said:
Our experience with Champion and TA alum heads with max ported versions is that their performance is about equal.

When the first 109 block went into the 8's, it was with Champion heads we prepared on a TSM GN, and a stock intake which had been welded to raise the ports to match the increased height of head intake ports. The calculations to accomplish this is well over 900 HP.

The TA heads have excellent flow on the exhaust side and requires little port work, mainly just a clean-up and port match for applications well into the 9's.

Availability of TA heads is outstanding, as I stock many SI and SE heads for various levels of performance.
Click to expand...

Thanks Nick, good to know we cannot go wrong with either heads from a performance point of view.
 
The TA heads we tested had better exhaust flow than the Champions, but that can be a bad thing when back pressure is high.
 
forcefed3.8's said:
The TA heads we tested had better exhaust flow than the Champions, but that can be a bad thing when back pressure is high.
Click to expand...
I flowed a bunch of them and from my experience the TA GN! and even M&A exhaust ports were all very similar when comparing comparable ported heads.
 
forcefed3.8's said:
The TA heads we tested had better exhaust flow than the Champions, but that can be a bad thing when back pressure is high.
Click to expand...
I flowed a bunch of them and from my experience the TA GN! and even M&A exhaust ports were all very similar when comparing comparable ported heads.
 
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