Engine Oil Cooler good or bad in my situation

[JimP]

My oil gets black fast, and smells like gas. I have an external oil cooler installed, it's fairly large, I also have a large aluminum Aladdin radiator and my car never gets over 180 degrees and usually stays about 165-170. I was thinking about removing the oil cooler as I don't think the oil is getting up to an optimal operating temperature to stay clean / evaporate any fuel.

Does this sound like a good idea?

 

[we4Mateo]

This begs the question, why is it getting contaminated with fuel so quickly in the first place?

 

[JimP]

I have checked the injectors, they were sent out, I have gone through everything, I have no idea, it doesn't even smell that bad when running and I don't have a cat. I have flushed the engine, it just gets black fast and I haven't been beating on it. I have done both compression and leak down tests, no issues there. In addition my fuel pressure gauge will stay at 42 psi for days and days after turning the car off, my buddies GN drops to zero pretty quick and he does not have this issue. My tune is not pig rich either, that's why I am scratching my beautiful but balding head.

The reason I was leaning towards cold oil, my Impala was not getting up to operating temp, the oil got dark very fast and did smell a bit. Upon changing the thermostat, (it gets to 195*), I'm due for an oil change but the oil has barely changed color and does not smell. I have just under 55,000 miles (90,000 km) on my car and it hasn't been beaten to death, I have owned it 8 years and knew the previous mature owner.

 

[scgnx2]

Bypassing the oil cooler is an easy enough to do. It would be worth doing just to verify or rule out the cause of your issue.
Lots of Turbo Buicks including mine running around without that oil cooler. My oil still looks pretty clean at over 1000 miles.
Not sure if deleting the oil cooler plays a factor tho.

 

[TT/Ameasap]

Color is not automatically a sign of bad oil. If its cloudy, then it needs boiled out. The raw fuel in the oil would be concerning. As I have found out running E85 for the first year, you need to run the oil up to temp more often to boil out the moisture it draws. Everyday you start your car (especially in this cold weather) it contaminates the oil with moisture.
Removing the factory oil cooler makes this process a little longer.

 

[we4Mateo]

I have checked the injectors, they were sent out, I have gone through everything, I have no idea, it doesn't even smell that bad when running and I don't have a cat. I have flushed the engine, it just gets black fast and I haven't been beating on it. I have done both compression and leak down tests, no issues there. In addition my fuel pressure gauge will stay at 42 psi for days and days after turning the car off, my buddies GN drops to zero pretty quick and he does not have this issue. My tune is not pig rich either, that's why I am scratching my beautiful but balding head.

The reason I was leaning towards cold oil, my Impala was not getting up to operating temp, the oil got dark very fast and did smell a bit. Upon changing the thermostat, (it gets to 195*), I'm due for an oil change but the oil has barely changed color and does not smell. I have just under 55,000 miles (90,000 km) on my car and it hasn't been beaten to death, I have owned it 8 years and knew the previous mature owner.

Sounds good. I would try to bypass the cooler then. Your thought process is right. I don't run a cooler and always get my car hot when driving it and the oil holds up well. Are you still running a PCV system? That helps a lot with oil contamination too, but it's another thing to maintain and I see why many eliminate it.

 

[ttypewhite]

Bypassing the oil from the rad Jim has no effect on the color of your oil. I bypassed mine just for peace of mind. If anything internally happen to my rad the dangers of all these fluids mixing together imo just isn't worth it. But by doing so, I saw no difference in oil color. I would start with another chip to eliminate fuel as being the culprit. Start up enrichment and idle quality is usually where the fuel getting into the oil is big problem. Also make sure the motor has proper ventilation, whether it be your charcoal canister or valve cover breathers. What plug and heat range plugs do you use? Your spark plug gap might need to be opened up a bit more to properly burn the fuel at idle. Lots of variables, but those are a start.

 

[turbo nasty]

http://www.amazon.com/Derale-25719-Fluid-Control-Thermostat/dp/B004XOQ0R6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1394638714&sr=8-2&keywords=oil cooler thermostat

This could help let the oil warm up.

This particular one may not be correct for the NPT size you need but they do make other sizes.

 

[87geeinn]

I've seen the word "bypass" thrown around a few times in this thread. Bypassing the oil cooler would be a pretty bad idea. Removing the entire cooler is a whole different story.

 

[chopped39]

What kind of oil are you running ? I'm with we4Mateo .whats causing the problem? Pull vacuum line off the top of fuel pressure regulator and make sure there is no fuel exiting through vacuum port. What are your scanmaster readings.

 

[JimP]

I'll try to answer all questions here,

I usually run a good synthetic oil, I add ZDP at all changes
I have an external oil cooler (I would remove it entirely to see if oil temp is an issue)
I do have a working PVC, EGR and current chip is a Full Throttle Extender (about 2 years old)
My plugs are gapped tight .028-.030 (They are NGK UR5's??? I recall)
I have vented both valve covers with breathers but I don't even know if the charcoal canister is even still there, I'll have to look.

Interesting you guys mentioned the fuel pressure regulator, I did not think of that, it is about 8 years old, it's a good billet unit but I have not ruled that out so it could be the culprit. It's the fuel smell that concerns me as I don't want to be washing down the cylinders. I'll advise about the regulator, I'll let it run with the vac line off for a long while and see if any fuel comes out.

Thanks guys.

 

[1KWIKSIX]

What temperature thermostat do you have installed?
(Sorry if you've already posted this.....I guess I missed it).

I had similar concerns with my car running too cool to allow for proper expansion of the engines internal components up to optimimum operating temperature / tolerances, so I switched from a 160 to a 180 degree thermostat.

Also had the chip fine tuned to increase the temperature that the fans turned on at.
My Extender Extreme G chip originally turned the fans on at 175, but now they don't turn on till 187deg F & turn off at 170deg F.

Works great. I am very happy with this change. Of course, my car is strictly street driven (at least at this point in time).

When I get to the track, I may switch back & tweak the fan on / off settings a bit lower, but for now I'm happy, if only for peace of mind.

Food for though.

dave

 

[TLIMITED]

What kind of oil are you running ? I'm with we4Mateo .whats causing the problem? Pull vacuum line off the top of fuel pressure regulator and make sure there is no fuel exiting through vacuum port. What are your scanmaster readings.

X2,as far as oil for some reason if I use Castrol which I do alot it seems to get dark alot faster than Mobil1.But I have never had internal failures using either one.Do like Chopped said and figure out were the fuel is coming from.Have you tried a little more gap on the plugs?The gap you are running sounds very tight.Maybe a different plug also!!!

 

[we4Mateo]

X2,as far as oil for some reason if I use Castrol which I do alot it seems to get dark alot faster than Mobil1.But I have never had internal failures using either one.Do like Chopped said and figure out were the fuel is coming from.Have you tried a little more gap on the plugs?The gap you are running sounds very tight.Maybe a different plug also!!!

.028 to .030 is pretty standard gap with a 20+ psi combo. The Bailey module and modern coil pack has allowed me to open up my gap to .035 to .040 and no spark blowout at 30psi. I never had oil problems like this even when I was still running a .028 gap though.

 

[chopped39]

I'll try to answer all questions here,

I usually run a good synthetic oil, I add ZDP at all changes
I have an external oil cooler (I would remove it entirely to see if oil temp is an issue)
I do have a working PVC, EGR and current chip is a Full Throttle Extender (about 2 years old)
My plugs are gapped tight .028-.030 (They are NGK UR5's??? I recall)
I have vented both valve covers with breathers but I don't even know if the charcoal canister is even still there, I'll have to look.

Interesting you guys mentioned the fuel pressure regulator, I did not think of that, it is about 8 years old, it's a good billet unit but I have not ruled that out so it could be the culprit. It's the fuel smell that concerns me as I don't want to be washing down the cylinders. I'll advise about the regulator, I'll let it run with the vac line off for a long while and see if any fuel comes out.

Thanks guys.

Sometimes it wont leak without vacuum so get some clear hose and put it between the line and regulator That way you can see the fuel. Do you have a scanmaster or powerlogger ? If not I would get one especially with Mods.

 

[JimP]

Thanks for the advice and suggestions, the weather has taken a turn for the worse again here, I was going to bring the car to a buddy's and get a few things done before the snow melted. To answer a cpl of questions, I have a 160 degree thermostat, I do have a scan master, numbers look good but it does pull a bit of fuel while cruising when engine gets warm, I have also enabled lean cruise through the chip and pulled a bit of fuel at idle through the MAF Translator. I had the plugs gapped tight when I had a bad ignition module, I have since changed it and I'll be putting in some AC Delco 042's. The way I had the chip parameter set my fans come on at 160, I'll likely change that to 180.

What ever I find I will be sure to come back and post in case others have this issue, I appreciate the little tip with the clear hose from the fuel pressure regulator.

Jim

 

[1KWIKSIX]

Hey Jim,
If you're leary of putting in the 180deg T-stat...there is another option available.
Grab a 170deg T-stat (made for a small block chevy) & cut down the outside of the flange to match your 160 T-stat with tin snips to fit the Buicks smaller housing opening.

It will give you a choice in between the two 160 & 180 that are presently available.

Just saying.

dave

 

[JimP]

I had a day off today, so I made it to where my car is stored. The guy was nice enough to let me work on it there a bit. I fired it up, let it idle unplugged the fuel pressure regulator and placed a clear hose between it and the line took off. I let the car run for about 20 minutes while we chatted, nothing, no fuel, scan master numbers looked good, I had left the chip with it's baseline tune as I had unhooked the battery when the car was parked, I found it a bit rich at idle but not too bad. (I had changed the oil when I parked it and it had no fuel smell yet).

Just as I was about to remove the clear hose the fuel pressure regulator, the car stumbled momentarily and I saw fuel being sipped into the vacuum line, it came from the regulator vacuum port. I'm hoping this is my issue with fuel smell in oil, I was just surprised at how long the car had to idle / run before I saw the problem. It's a billet unit, I'll be getting a replacement so I can put it on when car comes out. It's apparently rebuild-able but I have no idea who made it and I didn't get any pics.

Thanks for the tips and advice!

 

[TurboTdr3.8]

Just as I was about to remove the clear hose the fuel pressure regulator, the car stumbled momentarily and I saw fuel being sipped into the vacuum line, it came from the regulator vacuum port. I'm hoping this is my issue with fuel smell in oil, I was just surprised at how long the car had to idle / run before I saw the problem. It's a billet unit, I'll be getting a replacement so I can put it on when car comes out. It's apparently rebuild-able but I have no idea who made it and I didn't get any pics.

Sounds like you found the problem as it took a while for the fuel to saturate the diaphragm and come through to the vacuum port .

 

[chopped39]

I had a day off today, so I made it to where my car is stored. The guy was nice enough to let me work on it there a bit. I fired it up, let it idle unplugged the fuel pressure regulator and placed a clear hose between it and the line took off. I let the car run for about 20 minutes while we chatted, nothing, no fuel, scan master numbers looked good, I had left the chip with it's baseline tune as I had unhooked the battery when the car was parked, I found it a bit rich at idle but not too bad. (I had changed the oil when I parked it and it had no fuel smell yet).

Just as I was about to remove the clear hose the fuel pressure regulator, the car stumbled momentarily and I saw fuel being sipped into the vacuum line, it came from the regulator vacuum port. I'm hoping this is my issue with fuel smell in oil, I was just surprised at how long the car had to idle / run before I saw the problem. It's a billet unit, I'll be getting a replacement so I can put it on when car comes out. It's apparently rebuild-able but I have no idea who made it and I didn't get any pics.

Thanks for the tips and advice!

Next time your there get some pics of regulator I'm sure someone sells a rebuild kit for it.