could 1/2 accum problem cause bind up on 1-2 shift?

[Warrant]

Before I pull my 2004r out.

Is they anything that the 1/2 accumulator could have to do with the trans binding up on the 1-2 shift?

I am using a new valve body with CK's shift kit in it. And his servo. I also tired the original valve body with a transgo kit.

The accum is blocked. same thing with both valve bodies. What if it some kid of leak inside there? could that cause it?

Thanks for any help.

 

[77 cruiser]

Is the bind manualy shifting or left in Drive?

 

[Warrant]

its on any 1-2 shift, no matter the throttle angle, in any forward range.

http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/tr...d-new-trans-bad-pressures-downshifts-1st.html

 

[bison]

I dont see how the accum could cause a binding issue on the 1-2. The band is applying and nothing is releasing. Its possible you have a cross leak in your pump or a crack in the pump body that is pressurizing the lock up circuit but that usually results in a stalled engine coming to a stop? Is it possible you have a cross leak at the manual valve? Is there a trans brake in there? Sounds like either direct or OD is applying as it shifts into second but it would have to be slight and only instant since the trans would lock up with those on with the band holding.

 

[Warrant]

I dont see how the accum could cause a binding issue on the 1-2. The band is applying and nothing is releasing. Its possible you have a cross leak in your pump or a crack in the pump body that is pressurizing the lock up circuit but that usually results in a stalled engine coming to a stop? Is it possible you have a cross leak at the manual valve? Is there a trans brake in there? Sounds like either direct or OD is applying as it shifts into second but it would have to be slight and only instant since the trans would lock up with those on with the band holding.

The pump is from Chris at CK, I thought he was pretty thorogh in his work so I dont think its that. I even sent him the direct drum, center support, and forward drum AND the OD/input shaft since I thought they had leaks, he replaced the direct drum.

It doesnt die coming to a stop, it jumps back into regular first. I can put it to the floor to try to "break it loose" and the car just barrrrrley creeps forward, engine holding at rpm, no acceleration at all. And like I said if i get speed up and then shift, it skids the rear tires for a sec, slows down rapidly and almost stops, kicks back into first.

I contacted Chris on it, he sent me the new valve body, had no effect. So I dont think its any of the valves in there.

I thought everything air checked fine and I had all my clearences right where they needed to be. I cant figure it out and no one else can haha.

 

[Warrant]

Could the Servo On the side of the trans cause symptoms like i described? (the bind in 2nd gear)

 

[chris718]

Do you feel engine braking in od postition 1st gear?In order for that to happen the rear carrier is not being allowed to rotate,causing a bind.

 

[Warrant]

Do you feel engine braking in od postition 1st gear?

Yes, feels like normal first gear. shifts into second at about the right time and speed, major bind and brings car to almost a stop.

I was just checking if there was anything else I could do without pulling the trans out (Ive done the valve body, going to do the accumulator this week, only other thing I can think is the servo, and maybe the governor)

 

[bison]

Yes, feels like normal first gear. shifts into second at about the right time and speed, major bind and brings car to almost a stop.

I was just checking if there was anything else I could do without pulling the trans out (Ive done the valve body, going to do the accumulator this week, only other thing I can think is the servo, and maybe the governor)

Wrong 2nd accum housing possibly.

 

[David Husek]

The pump is from Chris at CK, I thought he was pretty thorogh in his work so I dont think its that. I even sent him the direct drum, center support, and forward drum AND the OD/input shaft since I thought they had leaks, he replaced the direct drum.

It doesnt die coming to a stop, it jumps back into regular first. I can put it to the floor to try to "break it loose" and the car just barrrrrley creeps forward, engine holding at rpm, no acceleration at all. And like I said if i get speed up and then shift, it skids the rear tires for a sec, slows down rapidly and almost stops, kicks back into first.

I contacted Chris on it, he sent me the new valve body, had no effect. So I dont think its any of the valves in there.

I thought everything air checked fine and I had all my clearences right where they needed to be. I cant figure it out and no one else can haha.

Before I pull my 2004r out.

Is they anything that the 1/2 accumulator could have to do with the trans binding up on the 1-2 shift?

I am using a new valve body with CK's shift kit in it. And his servo. I also tired the original valve body with a transgo kit.

The accum is blocked. same thing with both valve bodies. What if it some kid of leak inside there? could that cause it?

Thanks for any help.

Yes, feels like normal first gear. shifts into second at about the right time and speed, major bind and brings car to almost a stop.

I was just checking if there was anything else I could do without pulling the trans out (Ive done the valve body, going to do the accumulator this week, only other thing I can think is the servo, and maybe the governor)

Check your accumulator plate with a straight edge and make sure it is flat. I have seen this a few times as a warped plate does cause what you have described if I am understanding your descriptions correctly. I hope this check gets you working....

 

[KL Mallender]

Check your intermediate servo, outer sealing ring(smaller of the two) is either leaking or installed backwards causing 2nd gear oil to apply the direct clutch/low fluid circut.

Kevin.

 

[Otto J]

Did you change the 1-2 acc housing? was the problem there before?
there is a different acc housing that will cause the trans to lockup on the 1-2

 

[Warrant]

Thanks guys Ill check all those.

I never changed the acc housing, just blocked it (taped the hole and plugged it). One of the retaining holes for the housing did strip and I helicoiled it, dont think that would cause any issues. I had another hole strip on the outside of the case too, maybe its just a **** case.

It was a unknown core so I dont know what it did before.

Wouldnt those seals in the servo show up on a air check? It air checked fine.

Ive talked to some of the best builders here over the phone and the best they could come up with is cracked case, or somethings up with the acc housing.

Its posted above but here is the link explaining everything incase of someone wants to take a deeper stab at it http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/tr...d-new-trans-bad-pressures-downshifts-1st.html

Thanks

 

[chris718]

To be certain the lo clutch is on in 2nd causing the bind ,do this.plug the low reverse passage in the case w/ a 3/8 cup plug and go for a ride,JUST REMEMBER YOU WILL HAVE NO REVERSE TILL YOU REMOVE THE PLUG AGAIN.

 

[Warrant]

Wrong 2nd accum housing possibly.

Did you change the 1-2 acc housing? was the problem there before?
there is a different acc housing that will cause the trans to lockup on the 1-2

guys, im just finally goin under to do some testing to figure this out, ive got a 82 trans and a 85 trans that I was goin to use parts or other builds, you guys say wrong acc housing? but my ck book says all three are interchangable, Ive plugged the one that was already on there, i guess i could drill it back out to test it with the piston and spring installed? But can I use the 1985 one. (it was a 1990 trans).

Thanks.

 

[chris718]

I gave you an easy way to see if it was the low reverse clutch applying and you dont seem interested in doing it.There is another area that can fault and cuase a bind and cause the low clutch to drag.The housings are interchangeable especially when they are plugged.If you take time to study the housing differences you will see that most of the data presented on its function after the change is simply incorrect.There is another thing going on there that no one seems to see until they study the housing.

 

[Warrant]

If I plug the low reverse passage, what will that cause other then no reverse? The lo clutch to be on always? causing the bind to be there? If so, what did I just accomplish since the bind is there anyways? or will it go away?

I cant find a diagram right now that shows me which passage your talking about but im guessing its under the valve body? just seems like alot of work is all. Im just about ready to be done with it and pull it apart to do it all over again, even more carefully.

Thanks

 

[Warrant]

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

well sorta, but it doesnt bind up as before.

I changed to a older style accumulator, didnt block it, used the same piston with a new seal, and a transgo spring, a different plate, and for the hell of it I put in a 85 grand national governer in. Thats it.

It seemed to shift fine on the stands, but didnt spend much time in 2nd gear.

On the road, moderate throttle, manually shifting, it shifts fine, faily snappy.

On its own, I cant tell if its starting in second or I just cant feel the 1-2 shift, doesnt want to shift into 3rd untill I let off the gas.

I tried manual lockup in 3rd goin about 40, seems like theres a slight delay to lock, and doesnt look like much of a rpm change either (3200 stall)

I only tired 4th gear once, somethings fishy there too. felt like maybe it was going in and out of 4th/3rd, or maybe the converter was unlocking and locking.

I think I need to put the other governor back in? (from a 5 liter car)


Also can anyone explain why it would work from a blocked to a unblock 1-2 acc?

First time its been out on the road in 2 years, Im so excited!

 

[Warrant]

did some more playing today.

trans seems to shift fine when manually shifting 1-2-3, downshifts manually fine, leaving it in 3 and slowing to a stop it downshift fine too. the only thing that bugs me when I manually shift 1-2 at moderate throttle, at about 4000RPM (no WOT yet, new motor) It takes about two seconds for it to actually shift, its not a instant shift, and I did a mod in ck book to prevent this...

Leaving in drive, at light throttle, it slips into 2nd at about 5 mph (cant fell the shift at all however, so it pretty much starts in 2nd) . Heavy throttle it will start in 1st but shifts into second soon after.

Lockup works in second and third, but when I flip the switch its not a hard lockup, its very light, not what I was expecting, and theres about a little delay too.

4th ok on the jack stands

Here are the pressures:

min t.v.
idle -1000ish

P 80
R 135
N 80
4 80
3 80
2 240
1 235

max t.v
idle - 1000ish

P 195
R 255
N 195
4 195
3 190
2 235
1 235

any thoughts or ideas to whats goin?? just play with that governer and the BTO TV adjustment? ok to drive?

 

[Ttype6]

Also can anyone explain why it would work from a blocked to a unblock 1-2 acc?

You haven't proven that your problem was caused by a blocked accumulator because you changed too many things. Put your blocked acc back on and do nothing else. I doubt if this will bring back the bind but you have to do it to prove what was wrong. If doing this doesn't bring back the bind,you'll have to re-install each of the parts you removed one at a time until the bind returns. This is the only way to identify the cause of the problem. We are all waiting for the answer.