TurboDave/Bison/VadersV6/RUQWKNF and Pacecarta almost got me KILLED!

[VadersV6]

oh to clear up
the 190l is the old 307 pump not too good past 65 psi
the 255l is for the 340 pump again better than the 340 but fading fast above 70

the 255l hipsi is the inline walbo

and those are at pump pressures and volumes , doesnt get better through old filters or stock restrictive lines

you can see the diff between 66psi and 76 psi
66 psi = ~45 gallon /hr
76 psi = ~28gallon/hr

The 307 is a 255lph pump. It just has some different internals...like a different spring or something...or maybe Im thinking 317 if theres such a thing.
By the way, make sure your return line is totally clear and your fuel filter is clean. If the return line is restricted, pinched, kinked or clogged with varnish if the car was sitting, you'll have fueling issues. Its good to disconnect the lines at both ends and spray alot of carb cleaner in there and keep blowing it out with compressed air. Also check for dents or kinks.

 

[yullose]

My honest advice ?
Stay safe and simple.
Park the car until you have the right chip in it. :wink:


Tell Eric EXACTLY what your combination is, what boost and what fuel you are running.
Set fuel pressure back down to 43psi
Set boost to the spec written on the back of the chip.

When I had my T-type, I tried what you are doing,(chip burned for stock turbo) only with a TE62 and Nitrous. I never could get the thing to run right. I was cranking fuel pressure up to the point the injectors would lock up and the car wouldn't start. Guess what... it was still going lean on the top end... even at 52psi.

I got a fresh chip burned for the correct TE62 combination and holy cow did it make a difference.


My current combination with MSD50's and PT67 ran those numbers in my sig using one of Eric's chips right out of the box, with the fuel pressure set at the recommended 43psi. First pass down the track was a 10.98 @ 122. No adjustments were made to the chip tune to run those numbers, and no adjustments to the fuel pressure were needed.

When the temps outside started to get cold (40degrees or less), the O2's went into the 600's @ WOT... so I added approx 15% add'l fuel via chip adjustments. Other than that, Eric's chips are "Right on the money" and DAMN FAST right out of the box as far as I'm concerned.

 

[MyBoosta]

My honest advice ?
Stay safe and simple.
Park the car until you have the right chip in it. :wink:


Tell Eric EXACTLY what your combination is, what boost and what fuel you are running.
Set fuel pressure back down to 43psi
Set boost to the spec written on the back of the chip.

When I had my T-type, I tried what you are doing,(chip burned for stock turbo) only with a TE62 and Nitrous. I never could get the thing to run right. I was cranking fuel pressure up to the point the injectors would lock up and the car wouldn't start. Guess what... it was still going lean on the top end... even at 52psi.

I got a fresh chip burned for the correct TE62 combination and holy cow did it make a difference.


My current combination with MSD50's and PT67 ran those numbers in my sig using one of Eric's chips right out of the box, with the fuel pressure set at the recommended 43psi. First pass down the track was a 10.98 @ 122. No adjustments were made to the chip tune to run those numbers, and no adjustments to the fuel pressure were needed.

When the temps outside started to get cold (40degrees or less), the O2's went into the 600's @ WOT... so I added approx 15% add'l fuel via chip adjustments. Other than that, Eric's chips are "Right on the money" and DAMN FAST right out of the box as far as I'm concerned.

Okay...DONE! Gosh this sucks, I wish I knew dayum

 

[bison]

Okay...DONE! Gosh this sucks, I wish I knew dayum

Better to be safe than sorry. You will get even more out of it with another chip also. Its worth the wait and Eric's quick anyway. The spool up will be crisp and the fueling up top will be right on. I cant remember which torque converter you have but you may want to request forced lockup if you have a lockup converter. The lock up could be manually forced with a switch if you dont already have one.

 

[MyBoosta]

Better to be safe than sorry. You will get even more out of it with another chip also. Its worth the wait and Eric's quick anyway. The spool up will be crisp and the fueling up top will be right on. I cant remember which torque converter you have but you may want to request forced lockup if you have a lockup converter. The lock up could be manually forced with a switch if you dont already have one.

Yeah Bison,

I will be waiting...this bites! All the efforts of late night testing and money spent for racing gas (10.50 X 20 = $210), plugs (two swaps), sensors (two swaps) fuel filter (two swaps) and all I was doing was chasing my tale.

This is what I get for listening to some of the folks who told me that changing chips FROM my 93oct street chip w/50lbs injectors for a stock turbo and DP TO a 93oct chip w/50lbs injectors for a TE-44 and THDP was NOT necessary since the injectors were the same

I did another test late last night or should I say this morning [12:30 am] yet again to see what would happen if I lower the FP. And this is what I got:
Lowered static FP down to 43psi from 52psi ...Drove it and noticed that my 1st and 2nd gear O2 readings did not change much from before (High 700's to low 800's). Then I nailed it in 3rd for a nice little distance and...Knock knock...who is there? O2 readings fell to 720's and 700! with 2.3 knock; of course I lifted.

I pulled over to an empty lot and noticed that my gage read 40psi static...what? How did I drop 3psi...but wait, my car has been doing this since day ONE of the install of my FP reg and rail gage. Oh well, back to my issue(s); I jacked up the FP to 48psi static and made another run...O2 readings in 3rd now said 750 to 742 but with a .8 knock...I repeated this run but for a longer distance and bam no KNOCK but O2 dropped between
732 & 728. So I left it there for now...or at least until the new chip gets here and then start the WHOLE process all over again!

I am exhausted...all these late night testing excursions are catching up to me. All because I wanted to race tonight, and now this is NOT going to happen...man this late minute slap of the face bites!

I wish I could have spoken to you (Bison), TurboDave, Pacecarta, RUQWNF and VadersV6 sooner...or at least a week ago. I would have been ready for tonight and been able to take advantage of this unsual cool weather.

Thanks

PS, when I was driving under the 43 static FP settings, my car felt like a MOFO. I mean, when I was cruising at about 45mph and nail it, the freaking car was all over...and thought I heard it chirp into 3rd...I AM NOT kidding ya!

Man if I could get my car to run like that all the time w/o being on the edge, that would be something

 

[RUQWKNF]

Don't stress it bro.
Once you get that race chip and the fp back down where it should be, it will run like that. Lean down low with great spool up and pull like a freight train on the top end. You'll have a grin that you can't wipe off for a week. It does sound like you have a bad case of the disease tho.
One question, what brand 117 are you running?

Patrick

 

[pacecarta]

going from 93 street chip to te44 thdp wasnt the problem

you have other factors going on that are causing you issues with getting enough fuel

its cold out , the air is denser and requires more fuel , this will require increasing fuel which is why having erics chip is a plus and why watching o2s and kr are hkey to these cars ,

you raised your boost (boost will put more air in the cylinder and require more fuel) beyond what the chips injectory duty is burned for and able to adjust for with +20% added in , back it down , you cant expect to drop FP and run the same boost and high timing


with race fuel you need timing but you should run less timing until the fuel and boost is sorted out and then work on adding timing, keep the FP at 43 , lower the boost already and work your way up fuel then boost small steps , when the chip adjustment is maxed with no knock at the top of the 1/4 thats the limit of that chip

so either run less boost or get another chip

i am actually done with this thread , i found a thread in chip forum from almost a week ago where you discussed this with eric and he explained it to you so i dont see why this needs further explanation , http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/computer-chips-101/212767-tuning-tt-chip-question.html

 

[MyBoosta]

going from 93 street chip to te44 thdp wasnt the problem

you have other factors going on that are causing you issues with getting enough fuel

its cold out , the air is denser and requires more fuel , this will require increasing fuel which is why having erics chip is a plus and why watching o2s and kr are hkey to these cars ,

you raised your boost (boost will put more air in the cylinder and require more fuel) beyond what the chips injectory duty is burned for and able to adjust for with +20% added in , back it down , you cant expect to drop FP and run the same boost and high timing


with race fuel you need timing but you should run less timing until the fuel and boost is sorted out and then work on adding timing, keep the FP at 43 , lower the boost already and work your way up fuel then boost small steps , when the chip adjustment is maxed with no knock at the top of the 1/4 thats the limit of that chip

so either run less boost or get another chip

i am actually done with this thread , i found a thread in chip forum from almost a week ago where you discussed this with eric and he explained it to you so i dont see why this needs further explanation , http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/computer-chips-101/212767-tuning-tt-chip-question.html

Right Pacecarta,

My discussion with Eric was back then when I was JUST getting started with pump gas. Since then I played with my set up trying to find a good tune. I have not posted over there because over there one can post a question today and NOT get an answer for about two days or more. Email reponses are not the best/fastest over there. So sorry if you noticed a little off the same questions over here (I wanted to get a 2nd or even a 3rd opinion). Like said, I learned the most these last three days ever since joining this forum back in November.

Trust me, your help on this matter has been very benificial. I already decided to: A) order another chip for the new T44 and DP, B) double check all of my fuel lines and fuel related parts, and 3) get an alky kit w/a alky chip from TT.

Thanks:biggrin:

 

[MyBoosta]

Don't stress it bro.
Once you get that race chip and the fp back down where it should be, it will run like that. Lean down low with great spool up and pull like a freight train on the top end. You'll have a grin that you can't wipe off for a week. It does sound like you have a bad case of the disease tho.
One question, what brand 117 are you running?

Patrick

Thanks Patrick,

I'm ordering the chips as we speak. I don't know the brand of gas, but I do love the way it smells. It smells much better than the red 103 unleaded stuff I use on my 9.80sec 2006 Vette.

 

[murphster]

Just to make things more confusing......your current chip will probably work decent as an alky chip.

You could skip getting any more chips and just buy an alky kit and forget race gas. The benefit of the alky chip over your current chip will be that the base settings will be much closer to the ideal settings and you won't have to adjust it too much. This comes in handy if you unplug your battery alot and might forget to change the settings back or in rare (or not so rare for buicks) event that your ECM resets and it goes back to base chip settings.

Alky replaces some of the fuel so alky chips don't need as much fuel as race chips at the same boost level. It won't be quite as good as an alky chip because of the fuel curves as the alky comes in. You might be rich at lower boost levels and lean with higher boost levels with alky and a street chip. But now that you're learning to tune that should be no problem. :biggrin:

Just leave the FP at 43 static. You should only have to vary this +/- 1 pound or so to get the idle perfect and low rpm perfect and let the chip do the rest. Don't worry about the O2 readings so much, just tune for no knock and highest mph. Its good to have an EGT or wideband as a backup though to make sure you're not melting your pistons in the process.

 

[Ormand]

I'm surprised that somebody didn't tell you not to get a torque strap. They work, but they are a band-aid. My car, pretty much stock, had a torque strap, until it broke off the "eye" of the eye bolt used in the alternator mount. Some have had the alternator mount break- not good! Better to replace the engine mounts. New stock mounts are much better than mounts which are 20 years old, and the poly mounts from HR parts-n-stuff are even stiffer.

 

[VadersV6]

While we're on the subject of motor mounts...It would also be a good idea to use a solid drivers side motor mount (not poly...solid) and a stock style soft rubber one on the passenger side. That way the engine rotates about its proper axis when under a load (an engine strap causes the whole drivetrain to tweak in bad directions because the tie down point is up so high from the crank centerline)...but the soft passenger side mount will absorb the engine vibration pretty well. The solid motor mount will prevent the engine from rotating any more than the cushion of the passenger side one will allow. Its a nice balance between torque control and comfort.