timing cover gasket set
- Thread starter 510TURBO
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turbofabricator
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2004
Rubber seal.
Squid4life
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jul 5, 2004
x100! Also, if you have an old original front cover the crank seal goes in from the inside and has a metal "shoulder", whereas the newer covers push in from the outside/ front and do not have a shoulder or flange. I have a few new and old styles at home and can try to find a number for you if needed.
Squid4life
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jul 5, 2004
Here you go guys, sorry it took so long!
The one on the left is the old style seal with the metal shoulder that goes in from the inside of the front cover. It is FEL-PRO Part # 15200, but says "National S-12623 K100674R".
The one on the right is the newer style for newer front covers where you can install the seal from the front/ outside of the cover (without removing front cover). It says "B231-710613" on it, but the package it came in says "6573 timing cover seal". This is originally a FWD 3.8 seal, but our new covers use them.
Here is some info from "Silverseal":
Silver Seal Products For Buick
Attachments
Squid...you have me confused.
This morning I removed the seal from my aftermarket timing cover. I removed it from the outside...the cover is still firmly bolted to the block.
The identification on the seal that I removed (with a metal shoulder is) National S-12623 K100674R.
This is exactly backwards from what you have stated here??
What is up??
Bob
This morning I removed the seal from my aftermarket timing cover. I removed it from the outside...the cover is still firmly bolted to the block.
The identification on the seal that I removed (with a metal shoulder is) National S-12623 K100674R.
This is exactly backwards from what you have stated here??
What is up??
Bob
Squid4life
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jul 5, 2004
If you used the one with the metal shoulder and it worked, I guess you are good to go. Silver seal says that you are supposed to use the one without the shoulder, but if it works, so be it. They are the same outside diameter, so as long as the shoulder doesn't get in the way and affect the installed depth you might be good.
The main issue I think if you install the one you quote with the metal shield, the lib of the seal is installed backwards when installed on the new cover (where it mounts on the front side). If I remember correctly, the bevel or angle should make it work when installed from the inside, or in the original configuration front cover. If the one with the shoulder is installed on the outside, the seal lib is facing the wrong way. At least that is how I was taught... Maybe it works for you.
Well actually Squid I don't think it did work well. Only have about 100 miles on the engine and I'm pretty sure I had a light oil leak at this seal. Had a misting of oil all around that area.
So I have no history with this seal...only that it was received installed as I mentioned. When I saw the exposed spring I thought it was odd as I thought the spring was on the oil side. Lip seals are designed to seal in one direction...so I think in this case it was a poor use of a seal.
As luck would have it you responded to my WTB note with what is probably the correct seal. Do you have any identification.
However, there is still some confusion.
One thing about the K-12623 seal is the ID is very large and seals against the damper OD...not the crank nose.
Somebody recommended I get seal 710613 for my need. Got one right in front of me an the ID is clearly not big enough to seal against the damper...in fact the entire 710613 almost fits within the ID of the K-12623.
Can I call you???
Bob
So I have no history with this seal...only that it was received installed as I mentioned. When I saw the exposed spring I thought it was odd as I thought the spring was on the oil side. Lip seals are designed to seal in one direction...so I think in this case it was a poor use of a seal.
As luck would have it you responded to my WTB note with what is probably the correct seal. Do you have any identification.
However, there is still some confusion.
One thing about the K-12623 seal is the ID is very large and seals against the damper OD...not the crank nose.
Somebody recommended I get seal 710613 for my need. Got one right in front of me an the ID is clearly not big enough to seal against the damper...in fact the entire 710613 almost fits within the ID of the K-12623.
Can I call you???
Bob
Squid4life
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jul 5, 2004
You must have a different 710613 seal than I have... That is the 710613 seal in my pic (without the metal shoulder). The ID where it seals on the damper is correct, but a little tight. They actually loosen up a little, of if you feel it is too tight, just flex it or "exercise it" a bit and it will be a little more loose. Both those seals in my pic fit tight on the balancer hub.
Make sense?
Make sense?
Huh...what a coincidence. I have a Federal Mogul seal with 710613 on the box that is no where near the shape of the 710613 seal you have...makes me wonder if the box is correct but the seal is wrong. I got if from Napa I think...
So your 710613 and K12623 both have the same OD & ID, and fit into the timing cover from the outside....except the 710613 fits with the spring internal to the oil side and the K12623 external....right??
Thx, Bob
So your 710613 and K12623 both have the same OD & ID, and fit into the timing cover from the outside....except the 710613 fits with the spring internal to the oil side and the K12623 external....right??
Thx, Bob
Squid4life
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jul 5, 2004
The way they look, the spring should be on the inside (towards the oil) on both seals. The only diff is the shoulder style installs from the inside, the non-shoulder installs from the outside.
Are you as confused as me by now?
Are you as confused as me by now?
"The only diff is the shoulder style installs from the inside, the non-shoulder installs from the outside."
Except on my timing cover the K12623 was installed on the outside.
I know a little about lip seals and they are designed to be installed in one orientation. Typically there are some ribs or cuts on/near the lip that, with the rotating motion of the shaft, direct the oil away from the sealing surface...if installed backwards they would direct the oil at the actual lip of the seal. My seal leak at 100 miles is undoubtedly the result.
So while I don't have an explanation for my small size 710613 seal I now know that the K12623 should not be installed on the outside of our aftermarket covers.
I will contact you on my parts wanted list where you offered to sell me a couple.
My only confusion now is why Napa sold me a 710623 seal that is different from other 710623 seals...gotta find that receipt.
Thanks, Bob
Except on my timing cover the K12623 was installed on the outside.
I know a little about lip seals and they are designed to be installed in one orientation. Typically there are some ribs or cuts on/near the lip that, with the rotating motion of the shaft, direct the oil away from the sealing surface...if installed backwards they would direct the oil at the actual lip of the seal. My seal leak at 100 miles is undoubtedly the result.
So while I don't have an explanation for my small size 710613 seal I now know that the K12623 should not be installed on the outside of our aftermarket covers.
I will contact you on my parts wanted list where you offered to sell me a couple.
My only confusion now is why Napa sold me a 710623 seal that is different from other 710623 seals...gotta find that receipt.
Thanks, Bob
