I have been locked out of here for a while and could not post , so let me say thats beautiful work. I tried to ask the question how you were going to put a radius in the corners of the o-ring grooves on a bridgeport (cause I dont know how to) but I see your in the same boat as me on that. Great work Mike
Time to go Stage II!
- Thread starter Alky V6
- Start date
Today a good friend of mine, who used to work for Lockheed on the DSRV project, came by the shop to check out the latest progress on the intake. He noticed the o-ring grooves and asked what I planned on doing for the o-rings. I told him about the vulcanizing kit I was looking at and he started to tell me about how they used to put together o-rings for the DSRV by gluing the o-rings together with super glue. I was very surprised to find that out. With all the documentation and testing that is gone through during an overhaul of the DSRV, it turns out the o-rings are simply super glued together. Amazing.
A 45 degree cut of the ends of the o-ring to be spliced, and a minimum amount of glue is preferred.
A special type of glue (fluorinated epoxy resin) is needed when splicing Viton rubber o-rings.
Some information on the Viton product.
Viton® is a registered trademark of DuPont Performance Elastomers.
Viton® rubber, a specific fluoroelastomer polymer (FPM), was introduced into the aerospace industry in 1957 to fulfill its needs for a high-performance elastomer. Following its introduction, the usage of Viton® spread quickly to other industries including the automotive, appliance, chemical and fluid power industries. Viton® has a strong reputation as a high performance elastomer in very hot and extremely corrosive environments.
Well known for its excellent heat resistance properties (400°F/200°C), Viton® is the most specified fluoroelastomer available for:
As a product of DuPont elastomers, Viton® rubber can be processed to meet the performance requirements of many automotive, chemical processing and various other industrial applications.
A special type of glue (fluorinated epoxy resin) is needed when splicing Viton rubber o-rings.
Some information on the Viton product.
Viton® is a registered trademark of DuPont Performance Elastomers.
Viton® rubber, a specific fluoroelastomer polymer (FPM), was introduced into the aerospace industry in 1957 to fulfill its needs for a high-performance elastomer. Following its introduction, the usage of Viton® spread quickly to other industries including the automotive, appliance, chemical and fluid power industries. Viton® has a strong reputation as a high performance elastomer in very hot and extremely corrosive environments.
Well known for its excellent heat resistance properties (400°F/200°C), Viton® is the most specified fluoroelastomer available for:
- Fuel system seals & hoses
- O-rings
- Shaft seals
- Expansion joints and gaskets
As a product of DuPont elastomers, Viton® rubber can be processed to meet the performance requirements of many automotive, chemical processing and various other industrial applications.
What kind of o-ring material and glue do you use?
I think its standard Buna?? black o-ring material I buy by the foot. I used standard super glue. I realy dont think it matters too much about the glue type. When the o-ring gets compressed it stuffs the ends into a compressive mode anyway. basically it just to hold it together while you can still see it!! Mike
Buna-N is the rubber my friend said he often used with the super glue. From my research so far, it appears common super glue is often used in Buna-N o-ring splicing kits.
It is now time to make the exhaust header adapters. I'll make them oversized at first until I have the header bolt pattern for each port, which may be different from port to port, figured out. Then, I'll trim the adapters to give them a more cool look.
Squid4life
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jul 5, 2004
Donnie, why the need for header adapters? Why can't you just bolt the header flanges directly to the heads? I saw SII adapter plates often in groups of SII parts, but thought maybe they were for spacing the headers out for access to bolts, plugs, etc, or maybe to aid in flow of the exhaust, but most I saw were only ~3/8" thick. Curious what your reasoning is for running adapters. It is early and I have only had a single cup of coffee, so maybe my mind is not clear right now... 
BTW, I blame you and this thread... I went and looked at a mill/lathe combo after church on Sunday...
BTW, I blame you and this thread... I went and looked at a mill/lathe combo after church on Sunday...
Exhaust header flange adapters are commonly used when the bolt pattern of the head will not support the size of primary tube that is planned for.
The primary tube size that I plan to use will be uncommonly large. In my opinion, when you're targeting 1,500-1,600 bhp out of only 6 cylinders at around 9,000 rpm, you've got to get that exhaust out quick with little restriction. Otherwise, you start combating pumping losses.
I've seen primary pipe sizes for BBCs rated at slightly over 1,200 bhp use 'engine builder recommended' primaries in the 2.125-2.250 range. An 8 cylinder putting out 1,230 bhp is producing the exhaust mass of 154 hp per cylinder.
A six cylinder making 1,600 bhp is producing the exhaust mass of 267 hp per cylinder. A 73% difference. Adding to that, methanol creates more exhaust mass than gasoline. Does it make sense to use only a 2" primary tube? Maybe if you were concerned with having to spool a very large turbo. But that's what I have the nitrous system for, so I don't have to feel restricted with having to compromise the size of the primary tube.
ref: http://www.stahlheaders.com/
The primary tube size that I plan to use will be uncommonly large. In my opinion, when you're targeting 1,500-1,600 bhp out of only 6 cylinders at around 9,000 rpm, you've got to get that exhaust out quick with little restriction. Otherwise, you start combating pumping losses.
I've seen primary pipe sizes for BBCs rated at slightly over 1,200 bhp use 'engine builder recommended' primaries in the 2.125-2.250 range. An 8 cylinder putting out 1,230 bhp is producing the exhaust mass of 154 hp per cylinder.
A six cylinder making 1,600 bhp is producing the exhaust mass of 267 hp per cylinder. A 73% difference. Adding to that, methanol creates more exhaust mass than gasoline. Does it make sense to use only a 2" primary tube? Maybe if you were concerned with having to spool a very large turbo. But that's what I have the nitrous system for, so I don't have to feel restricted with having to compromise the size of the primary tube.
ref: http://www.stahlheaders.com/
James. Do you recall the type of material the adapters were made of? Mild steel seems to be the common material.Donnie, why the need for header adapters? Why can't you just bolt the header flanges directly to the heads? I saw SII adapter plates often in groups of SII parts, but thought maybe they were for spacing the headers out for access to bolts, plugs, etc, or maybe to aid in flow of the exhaust, but most I saw were only ~3/8" thick. Curious what your reasoning is for running adapters. It is early and I have only had a single cup of coffee, so maybe my mind is not clear right now...
BTW, I blame you and this thread... I went and looked at a mill/lathe combo after church on Sunday...
The preliminary plan is to use mild steel for the adapters at 3/8" thick. If I have thicker material laying around the shop, I may go thicker.
I'll be waterjetting the pieces, so I may design the header flanges too, and have it all cut out at the same time.
I'll be waterjetting the pieces, so I may design the header flanges too, and have it all cut out at the same time.
Squid4life
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jul 5, 2004
Oh boy, no, not off the top of my head... I am on my lunch break during training so I don't have my Powersource book here or I'd look there. Maybe the material is in there? I want to say they looked to be Ti or aluminum, but that is just going off memory, and that doesn't seem feasible for head to header connections...
Makes sense about the adapter plate allowing your mounting points to be different to allow larger diam/ primary tubes. I'd have to see a pic of a plate to see how much the difference is though. Sounds like a good option for your build.
