What does owning a turbo buick have to do with anything? I have owned dozens of turbo cars over the years, and I used to work on turbo vehicles for a living. One of my current turbo cars puts well over 600 to the ground using 70% iso and 93 pump. When you buy an aftermarket turbo with an internal wastegate housing, you have the option of getting any spring they offer with your wastegate actuator. Why in the world would you get one that has a high pressure spring in it? If you made that mistake you could buy another actuator and take it as a lesson learned. Sorry, but a lot of guys on this forum seem to bag on smc whenever they see the threat of smc having the edge in the alky world.
SMC or Razor????
- Thread starter 87we410877
- Start date
stanggod said:
This is how I knew you didnt have a Buick. When we buy turbo's for our cars, we have two options. Stock or heavy duty. The stock wont allow past 18-19 PSI. The HD will allow mid 20's.
Your next question "Why in the world would you get one that has a high pressure spring in it?".. Here is the answer.. There is no choice in springs. While on some applications like race cars external gates are used, it is not the norm. Has to do with $$$.
Then you say, "Sorry, but a lot of guys on this forum seem to bag on smc whenever they see the threat of smc having the edge in the alky world." The only bag is his lack of web presence. You are on a Turbo Buick Board replying to a thread relating to a Turbo Buick. Hence..
So when you say "The new SMC kits with the new v3 controller will have a failsafe, meaning if the pump or anything goes south the controller goes back to the wastegate set boost level." I had to call you out since what your claiming his product would do.. cant happen PHYSICALLY with the majority of our cars.
With an aftermarket gate that has a low tension spring.. sure.. but that comprises 1% of the cars.. if that many within the Buick communitty.
I would have not questioned you if you had responded, "I have an SMC kit and extremely happy making over 600 whp on 93 to the ground ans ISO, I believe his kit is the best" can you see the difference?
If you want to share new findings, ideas, theories, failsafes, etc.. i'm all ears.. and start a brand new thread. That way it can be universal. Kinda like staying on topic when threads open.. keeps a focus on things
:wink:
- Joined
- Jan 19, 2005
i just wanna add, im very impressed and happy with my razzors kit on my personal TType. I have installed several other brands on other TR's with success. But i just perfer my alkycontrol unit. The tune it came with was dam near spot on. I just hooked it up and used it.
I'll add something to this...... I'm sure Steve has a good product..... but as much as I read on the alky forum.... I don't know if he posts on it... or if he is even a member of the board. Razor is always posting tuning help to anybody (sometimes regardless if the kit was his kit or someone elses kit) that asks for it. His post count is upwards of 5800 posts..... How many posts does Steve have? I'm not suggesting he (Steve) doesn't support his product.... or help people tune their stuff..... I just don't see his presence in the online turbo Buick community like I see Razor's. At one point.... I had a choice to which one I wanted.... both got good reviews..... you will find some people actually have both .... Razor's on one car.... and SMC on the other... and like both. I made a decision based on how easy it was to get technical tuning advice fairly quick and often..... cause anyone that thinks they bolt on a kit... and don't have to tune their car for it is an idiot. It takes support by the more knowledgeable people.... and Razor is there to help when you need him.
Razor said:This is how I knew you didnt have a Buick. When we buy turbo's for our cars, we have two options. Stock or heavy duty. The stock wont allow past 18-19 PSI. The HD will allow mid 20's.
Your next question "Why in the world would you get one that has a high pressure spring in it?".. Here is the answer.. There is no choice in springs. While on some applications like race cars external gates are used, it is not the norm. Has to do with $$$.
Then you say, "Sorry, but a lot of guys on this forum seem to bag on smc whenever they see the threat of smc having the edge in the alky world." The only bag is his lack of web presence. You are on a Turbo Buick Board replying to a thread relating to a Turbo Buick. Hence..
So when you say "The new SMC kits with the new v3 controller will have a failsafe, meaning if the pump or anything goes south the controller goes back to the wastegate set boost level." I had to call you out since what your claiming his product would do.. cant happen PHYSICALLY with the majority of our cars.
With an aftermarket gate that has a low tension spring.. sure.. but that comprises 1% of the cars.. if that many within the Buick communitty.
I would have not questioned you if you had responded, "I have an SMC kit and extremely happy making over 600 whp on 93 to the ground ans ISO, I believe his kit is the best" can you see the difference?
If you want to share new findings, ideas, theories, failsafes, etc.. i'm all ears.. and start a brand new thread. That way it can be universal. Kinda like staying on topic when threads open.. keeps a focus on things
:wink:
See this post is exactly what I'm talking about. With the selection of internal wastegate actuators out there you could have low boost even on a tr. Go ahead call around. Sure the most popular ones are the two you mentioned, but there are other options. What about the stock turbo guys? I guess they can't run stock boost on pump gas either. I did a lot of research before I bought my 1st smc kit and one of the main reasons is smc is always working on making their kits better. I know smc is your direct competition, but I and and lot of others would have greater respect for you if you gave credit where credit is due, instead of finding negative things to say. You have a great wealth of knowledge but sometimes only post bits and pieces instead of the whole picture in order to get more sales. I'm sure i'll get flamed, but pumps in alky kits go out all the time and one more safety feature to keep your engine in one piece cant hurt. Oh and steve might not have 5000+ posts, bu there are such things as a telephones.
sorry but I don't see Buick guys goin to the expense or pain to get a boost controller .. my opinion (ya everyone know's ) keep it simple and stupid .. BUT what the hell do I know ... I have only had a fleet of these cars since 1986
ok someone pass the box of popcorn
) keep it simple and stupid .. BUT what the hell do I know ... I have only had a fleet of these cars since 1986 ok someone pass the box of popcorn
stanggod said:
Awe now.... it was just getting good.... you haven't even told us about your combo...... with the SMC kit..... the 600 RWHP job.....or even told us what make/model of car it is..... stanggod? What size engine? I'm always interested in anything that makes power... especally 600 RWHP .... Is it a regularly street driven car..... those are the best.....
educate yourself
In the real world. Not a magazine. You say better. That is your opinion. But before you make statements that are 40% complete you need to do like Beyonce says & check up on it. I dont know about steve. So I wont be negative about him or his product. But you dont know what razor does. He spends thousands & thousands of dollars to not only have failsafe features but goes all out to make a bullet proof system. Maybe your idea of pumps going out all the time & having a controller that brings boost back down is what makes you happy. But razor finds the problems & eliminates them. If you think I am not correct then so be it but alot of people out there can back me on this. So go enjoy your smc kit. Sounds like a perfect fit for you.
stanggod said:
In the real world. Not a magazine. You say better. That is your opinion. But before you make statements that are 40% complete you need to do like Beyonce says & check up on it. I dont know about steve. So I wont be negative about him or his product. But you dont know what razor does. He spends thousands & thousands of dollars to not only have failsafe features but goes all out to make a bullet proof system. Maybe your idea of pumps going out all the time & having a controller that brings boost back down is what makes you happy. But razor finds the problems & eliminates them. If you think I am not correct then so be it but alot of people out there can back me on this. So go enjoy your smc kit. Sounds like a perfect fit for you.
Stock ford 5.0 with AFR 185 heads, cartech box intake, incon turbo kit, smc universal kit with 1st gen controller, wal-mart 70% iso, m15 single nozzle, 93 pump gas. The most amazing thing is the fuel system only consists of 36# injectors and a single walbro 255 pump. With the alky my A/F is 11.5-12.00Blazer406 said:
My other current project is an 87 chevy turbo sprint. It has a 3 cyl 1.0 engine. The stock turbo shot the exhaust whel out the exhaust, so I'm fabbing a manifold to fit a ihi rhb5. I have a smc wrx alky kit I'm going to use on it with an m3 nozzle. My goal is to get it in the 13's@ ~102.
Well its a Mustang, so he dyno'd it on a Mustang dyno :biggrin:
Whats a first gen controller Is that the one with the clear plastic hose going to the box. You should contact Steve and update your setup.. Plus the first gen used an in-tank pump that wasnt 70% anything compatible.
I get no props when I figure someone doesnt own a TR :biggrin:
And no.. you dont have a choice on springs.. rite Grumpy :wink:
Whats a first gen controller
Is that the one with the clear plastic hose going to the box. You should contact Steve and update your setup.. Plus the first gen used an in-tank pump that wasnt 70% anything compatible.I get no props when I figure someone doesnt own a TR :biggrin:
And no.. you dont have a choice on springs.. rite Grumpy :wink:
Razor said:
Grumpy said:
I know this is getting off topic..... but would there be a market for an internal stock style wastegate actuator with a replaceable spring? That seems like something fairly easy to pull off...... Why hasn't anyone already brought something like this to market?...... or would there even be a market.....?? say .... priced under $100 ...... ??
Grumpy said:hmmm just have one question ...wait a min maybe 2 ... 600 rwhp ... so you dyno'd the car ??? how about drag racing it ??? like real world conditions
I dyno'd it a while ago with the stock heads and it made 500 to the tires with the stock unported heads and intake. Trapped ~125
With the new heads it traps ~133
I will dyno it this summer again. My buddys car dyno'd ~630 and trapped ~132. His car weighs the same.
For the non believers here is a dyno sheet:
http://www.turbomustangs.com/smf/index.php?topic=36941.0
I'm going to put a progressive controller on it and see what kind of numbers I can get out of it with 87 pump. Many are scared to run it in turbo cars, but I have been messing with it for a while now and have had great luck except the regular controller sprays to much alky at lower boost.
I know I don't own a tr, but I'm open minded, not brand loyal and like a variety of cars including buick. I have learned a bit from this site and hope to maybe contribute some of my knowledge to it.
I know we have been giving you some stuff..... b/c of you being a newbie....and kinda stubborn .... but respect what Razor brings to the table too..... His 3800+ # car traps 132+ mph as well.... except on 6 cylinders...... so he definately has his ducks in a row...... I think his motor is a stock block/ported iron heads too...... Not only does he sell alky kits.... he races his cream puff TTA regularly...with his kit on it.... and turns mid 10's consistantly.....
.... but respect what Razor brings to the table too..... His 3800+ # car traps 132+ mph as well.... except on 6 cylinders...... so he definately has his ducks in a row...... I think his motor is a stock block/ported iron heads too...... Not only does he sell alky kits.... he races his cream puff TTA regularly...with his kit on it.... and turns mid 10's consistantly.....stanggod said:
I was asking about your car .. what do ya run for ET ?? Brand loyal ???? I don't care what it is eithier .. I am waiting for the new Shelby to come out .. I had a lot of "blue" blood goin threw me years ago ..
been into the Buick thing since 86 .. I am looking for bang for the buck .. nothing has beat the Buick at that for sometime except for maybe the 03-04 Cobra's :biggrin:Similar threads
