front suspension questions 87 t

greeneyegi

Well-Known Member
i put on hotchkis uppers and the new qa1 lowers that work with coil overs or standard springs. i've got hotchkis lowering springs and double adjustable shocks now.
it has the 94 impala drop spindles also.
i have a set of qa1 coil overs to install.
i want to make sure the geometry will work with this setup, with the frankenstein setup i want to be sure it should still work.
 

greeneyegi

Well-Known Member
i put on hotchkis uppers and the new qa1 lowers that work with coil overs or standard springs. i've got hotchkis lowering springs and double adjustable shocks now.
it has the 94 impala drop spindles also.
i have a set of qa1 coil overs to install.
i want to make sure the geometry will work with this setup, with the frankenstein setup i want to be sure it should still work.
ttt
 

Turbo6inKY

Short Guy
Most of what you want to know can be found by searching, but this presents an opportunity for some summation for future searchers:

Your plan is straight out of 1992. If you want good results, you can abandon it right now. I get what you're doing because I did it, and worked OK sort of, but I still ended up junking most of it.

The problem with the G-Body front geometry is the spindle height and the kingpin inclination. You can fix the height with aftermarket ball joints with a taller stud. You can use a taller upper ball joint with no negative impacts. Adding a taller lower balljoint requires a bumpsteer correction kit for the steering arms. The kingpin problem is overcome either with a different spindle available from SpeedTech, or dialing in a ton of caster in the alignment (I'm running over NINE degrees of positive caster). Getting enough caster to overcome the kingpin inclination requires a set of control arms that offset the ball joint pads, otherwise the amount of shims you'd need in the UCA mounts would put the arm somewhere in the middle of the headers.

Replacing the arms without adding spindle height doesn't really help much.

The B-Body spindle is taller and has a better kingpin inclination, but the tie rod attachment is not in the right place to work with the G-Body's shorter control arms and creates a very serious bumpsteer issue that is not easily correctable.

Also, drop spindles are for looks, not performance.

Then there's the heat problems with our application. The control arms available now are all basically interchangeable. They all work great... on a Monte Carlo. Our headers/downpipe will melt delrin bushings right out of all of them. The only solution is the UMI Race arm with the steel rod-end pivots.

Then there's the sway bar problem. Since RideTech stopped selling their monsterbar, there really isn't a bolt-on solution with enough rate for us, which sends you down the road of either uncomfortably high spring rates, a fabbed setup using a torsion bar, or both.

All that said, for the next person that finds this thread: It is cheaper and simpler to pick a vendor and buy their entire system. I've learned from bitter personal experience that trying to save money by cobbling it together doesn't actually save money, because you'll go through three or four iterations before it's right, and it may never be right.

Sorry if this isn't the affirmation you were seeking, but I do wish you good luck. The combination you have will work OK, but it'll only just be OK.
 

greeneyegi

Well-Known Member
Most of what you want to know can be found by searching, but this presents an opportunity for some summation for future searchers:

Your plan is straight out of 1992. If you want good results, you can abandon it right now. I get what you're doing because I did it, and worked OK sort of, but I still ended up junking most of it.

The problem with the G-Body front geometry is the spindle height and the kingpin inclination. You can fix the height with aftermarket ball joints with a taller stud. You can use a taller upper ball joint with no negative impacts. Adding a taller lower balljoint requires a bumpsteer correction kit for the steering arms. The kingpin problem is overcome either with a different spindle available from SpeedTech, or dialing in a ton of caster in the alignment (I'm running over NINE degrees of positive caster). Getting enough caster to overcome the kingpin inclination requires a set of control arms that offset the ball joint pads, otherwise the amount of shims you'd need in the UCA mounts would put the arm somewhere in the middle of the headers.

Replacing the arms without adding spindle height doesn't really help much.

The B-Body spindle is taller and has a better kingpin inclination, but the tie rod attachment is not in the right place to work with the G-Body's shorter control arms and creates a very serious bumpsteer issue that is not easily correctable.

Also, drop spindles are for looks, not performance.

Then there's the heat problems with our application. The control arms available now are all basically interchangeable. They all work great... on a Monte Carlo. Our headers/downpipe will melt delrin bushings right out of all of them. The only solution is the UMI Race arm with the steel rod-end pivots.

Then there's the sway bar problem. Since RideTech stopped selling their monsterbar, there really isn't a bolt-on solution with enough rate for us, which sends you down the road of either uncomfortably high spring rates, a fabbed setup using a torsion bar, or both.

All that said, for the next person that finds this thread: It is cheaper and simpler to pick a vendor and buy their entire system. I've learned from bitter personal experience that trying to save money by cobbling it together doesn't actually save money, because you'll go through three or four iterations before it's right, and it may never be right.

Sorry if this isn't the affirmation you were seeking, but I do wish you good luck. The combination you have will work OK, but it'll only just be OK.
there are so many threads i was completely overwhelmed with info.
i really appreciate the explanation
i will be purchasing all new one vendor setup.
i figured it was a frankenstein setup als thought i was spinning my wheels
thanks for the reply
 

Mr.Spool

Well-Known Member
i put on hotchkis uppers and the new qa1 lowers that work with coil overs or standard springs. i've got hotchkis lowering springs and double adjustable shocks now.
it has the 94 impala drop spindles also.
i have a set of qa1 coil overs to install.
i want to make sure the geometry will work with this setup, with the frankenstein setup i want to be sure it should still work.
What are you trying to do exactly?
 

greeneyegi

Well-Known Member
Drag setup? Or turns only or a little bit of

Drag setup? Or turns only or a little bit of both?
I do hit the tracks a few times a year to get kicked out and really want my 60" times to lower and also car shows in summertime. But I want to put 4 people in it to cruise also. So Basically a bit of both, I do have Trans brake so launching is a bit easier. I run 18" wheels with Nitto Dr's so not expecting anything under 1.6 in reality.
Car is a bit heavy @ 3850 with me in it.
 

Mr.Spool

Well-Known Member
I do hit the tracks a few times a year to get kicked out and really want my 60" times to lower and also car shows in summertime. But I want to put 4 people in it to cruise also. So Basically a bit of both, I do have Trans brake so launching is a bit easier. I run 18" wheels with Nitto Dr's so not expecting anything under 1.6 in reality.
Car is a bit heavy @ 3850 with me in it.
1.6 with good good driving habits is not a hard task.
What is your combo?
You can pm me if you like
 
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