Do i have enough fuel to run E85

[Blevins]

50psi "base fuel presure" and dual walbro 255lph intank pumps. Base pressure being fuel pressure measured at zero vacuum. The fuel pressure regulator is a 1:1 rising unit, so it will raise 1psi of fuel pressure per 1 psi of positive manifold pressure/boost.

If i ran the car at a base pressure of say 70psi on the intank 255lph walbro fuel pumps and tried to get say another 30psi of fuel pressure do to the rising regulator and 30psi of boost the walbro pumps wouldn't be able to keep up.... They wouldn't even make 100psi due to the drop off of flow that is pretty drastic at pressures this high on these pumps. Another thing about these pumps is they have relieve valves on them. So what i do to cheat the sytem per say is push the relief valves in on the pumps so they wont open and add to a drop in fuel pressure. The relief valve will open around 70-75psi on them and bypass fuel if not modfied. Modifying this is a VERY easy modification that you can do in letterally 30 seconds.... It's a cheap and easy way of getting some more fuel supply out of the intank walbros that a lot of guys run.

 

[northerngn]

I have enjoyed reading all the banter on this thread.
My car currently had 83's in it and it runs out of fuel(100% duty cycle xfi triggering ses light).
Car has gone 10.57 @129 on race GAS @ 26psi.
On E-85 I hit 100% at 16psi
The car has a BIG fuel system on it as well...
-12 into Weldon external pump
-10 up to engine
dual -8s to the rails
-6 rear of rails to regulator (keeps rails "loaded")
-8 return
This motor is built and has champ heads so I'm positive the fuel requirements will be higher due to this.
Just my 2c on what I have personally experienced
I'm with Kip on this one
-Dan

 

[turbo89]

I have enjoyed reading all the banter on this thread.
My car currently had 85's in it and it runs out of fuel(100% duty cycle xfi triggering ses light).
Car has gone 10.57 @129 on race GAS @ 26psi.
On E-85 I hit 100% at 16psi
The car has a BIG fuel system on it as well...
-12 into Weldon external pump
-10 up to engine
dual -8s to the rails
-6 rear of rails to regulator (keeps rails "loaded")
-8 return
This motor is built and has champ heads so I'm positive the fuel requirements will be higher due to this.
Just my 2c on what I have personally experienced
I'm with Kip on this one
-Dan

SO .. what did the car run on 16 psi with the 85's maxed out ?

and how high are you buzzing this BUILT motor ?

 

[BIGPSI]

It looks like i am gonna upgrade to 120's. I just viewed my powerlogger run on that 10.80 pass. Thru the traps 6100 rpm and 71% IDC

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[krom]

I have enjoyed reading all the banter on this thread.
My car currently had 85's in it and it runs out of fuel(100% duty cycle xfi triggering ses light).
Car has gone 10.57 @129 on race GAS @ 26psi.
On E-85 I hit 100% at 16psi
The car has a BIG fuel system on it as well...
-12 into Weldon external pump
-10 up to engine
dual -8s to the rails
-6 rear of rails to regulator (keeps rails "loaded")
-8 return
This motor is built and has champ heads so I'm positive the fuel requirements will be higher due to this.
Just my 2c on what I have personally experienced
I'm with Kip on this one
-Dan

I have seen similar results on my car when I had 75's. they would max out at 15lbs when on E85.

 

[northerngn]

SO .. what did the car run on 16 psi with the 85's maxed out ?

and how high are you buzzing this BUILT motor ?

I didn't bother trying it...I found this out "testing" on the street
shifting at 6200
-Dan

 

[northerngn]

I didn't bother trying it...I found this out "testing" on the street
shifting at 6200
-Dan

FWIW it hit 100% at 5000rpm...

 

[turbo89]

I didn't bother trying it...I found this out "testing" on the street
shifting at 6200
-Dan

Well I mean doesn't that tell you something if you are shifting @ 6200 and we are about 1000 rpm lower ? not only that but what kinda rail pressure we talking about with the BIG FUEL system

 

[turbo89]

FWIW it hit 100% at 5000rpm...

Sure .. or at least that's what the SOFTWARE said right ? ... so what your saying is your injector was totally saturated @ 5000 rpm with a 85# injector running 16 psi .... how much power you think your really making there ?

Curious as to how much rail pressure your running or are you just feeding the car through Injector DC and calling it a day.

 

[696]

Northern: you have to run " clean" power to make it work. Maybe old Turbo 89 can tell you how to do it ;-)
Funny, more and more people are coming forward saying it can't be done but a few say no, no...you just can't tune. Hilarious! !!

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[turbo89]

Northern: you have to run " clean" power to make it work. Maybe old Turbo 89 can tell you how to do it ;-)
Funny, more and more people are coming forward saying it can't be done but a few say no, no...you just can't tune. Hilarious! !!

Posted from the TurboBuick.Com mobile app

No whats hilarious is people are using Software injector DC to determine they are out of fuel and not what the car is telling them .. I can run a 80# injector out DC wise on a mid 11 second car if I want to ..


Hell we'll just set the pump up to run 10 volts and drop the rail pressure to 35 psi and call it good .. then we can all look at our SOFTWARE DC be at 125% !!

Guess people really don't get just what DC is .

 

[krom]

No whats hilarious is people are using Software injector DC to determine they are out of fuel and not what the car is telling them .. I can run a 80# injector out DC wise on a mid 11 second car if I want to ..


Hell we'll just set the pump up to run 10 volts and drop the rail pressure to 35 psi and call it good .. then we can all look at our SOFTWARE DC be at 125% !!

Guess people really don't get just what DC is .

My car is 15 volts and FP was base 58, I do not take the DC as gospel. We are all not fuckups like you imply. I would rather have bigger injectors than ones that are marginal.

 

[Blevins]

ANYONE can make a post with their views.... And feel free to think im one of these people that dont know a thing and am just posting on a forum

I personally tune engines for a living and have for a LONG time now nearly 2 decades.... Due to this i see A LOT of different combos, platforms you name it. From very mild street cars to full tube chassis race/drag cars. I feel i have a pretty darn good grasp of whats going on in general and especially when it comes to something as simple to me as a fuel system. And in doing what i do for a living i see and talk to a lot of people on the daily that think they have things figured out to only be proven wrong in the real world outside of mis information and posts on forums.... No one has everything figured out, and that can't be debated. I sure dont think i do but i feel i am not clueless by any means either. And by some of these posts i feel like im some sort of genius.... Just joking with u guys haha... or am i? With that being said i will say just because some have done it and some others "havent" doesnt mean it cant be done. And setups differ.. Obviously! I can honestly say that I know what ive done with my own car.. I know what it makes, i know what it runs.... Everyone can debate back and forth till your blue in the face, it still doesnt change what myself and many others that don't post on forums or reply to threads like this on these forums have done. And yes i know for some of you its hard to fathom that everyone that has a TR doesn't post on these forums and post their results of their trials of parts etc. lol This thread is..... WOW just WOW

 

[turbo89]

My car is 15 volts and FP was base 58, I do not take the DC as gospel. We are all not fuckups like you imply. I would rather have bigger injectors than ones that are marginal.

HUH ???

On Fuel 42's have been into the bottom 11's and even tickled 10's ... the old MSD 50's have gone 125 ... 72's in the 140 zone (with similar AFR mind you )

and you guys are maxing out 85's on Fuel @ upper 120's ... fuckups .. umm no I never said that ... what I said was 80's can support what this guy is trying to do.
BAse @ 58 psi .... 15V at pump ... BIG fuel system with NO drop in pressure @ 80+psi fuel and your out of fuel @ 16pi ???

You say you don't take DC as gospel.. what do you use to determine your injector capacity ? you also say its better to have bigger injectors .. yeah makes a lot of sense to have any extra 35% DC you aren't doing shit with 99.9% of the time at the expense of driveability.

 

[northerngn]

Well I mean doesn't that tell you something if you are shifting @ 6200 and we are about 1000 rpm lower ? not only that but what kinda rail pressure we talking about with the BIG FUEL system

45 psi base and lb per lb up to 71 psi for 26 lbs of boost
And when the d/c went to 100% plus The afrs got lean quick!!!
Wideband tuning K/R and logging 16frames per second dont lie!
I'll try to fine a log on corn where it went lean and post pic...stay tuned!!!

 

[northerngn]

Here is at the finish line with gasoline and no volt booster log still screen...power is clean it is drawn thru a 30a relay from the battery in the trunk same terminal that alt charge wire is connected to...
Don't get the wrong idea here I run E-85 95% of the time as my car at 15psi will still kill most cars on the street and its usually a dollar cheaper per gal than 87 here in MN
160's and I'll be set for life
-Dan
P.S. what target afr are you shooting for with E-85?
XFI uses a true E-85 afr scale and the motor likes 7.8-80 target at WOT and idles at 10.0
I'm sure you non XFI guys are tuning E-85 using a gas afr scale
I am a HUGE E-85 believer and after all these years have STILL never blown a headgasket...hows that for "tuning"

 

[Nakamichiman]

This thread has become pretty interesting....does someone have a set of Mike Moran 220s Billet Atomizers they can sell me...I'm looking to go 10.80s and have the ultimate in drivability....

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[northerngn]

I have deleted most of my bad runs but I did find one with some data...
d/c at 100% with xfi adding 22.7% addl fuel and target still not near actual
This was with my older smaller turbo (te45a)
When I went to my 67/65 this is when this occurrence happened at even a lower rpm and boost level...this engine wants to eat up some fuel!
This type of data is what I have based my results off of...I'm not saying you are wrong, I'm just saying it didn't work for me!

-Dan

 

[northerngn]

LOL
Nakamichiman

 

[turbo89]

Here is at the finish line with gasoline and no volt booster log still screen...power is clean it is drawn thru a 30a relay from the battery in the trunk same terminal that alt charge wire is connected to...
Don't get the wrong idea here I run E-85 95% of the time as my car at 15psi will still kill most cars on the street and its usually a dollar cheaper per gal than 87 here in MN
160's and I'll be set for life
-Dan
P.S. what target afr are you shooting for with E-85?
XFI uses a true E-85 afr scale and the motor likes 7.8-80 target at WOT and idles at 10.0
I'm sure you non XFI guys are tuning E-85 using a gas afr scale
I am a HUGE E-85 believer and after all these years have STILL never blown a headgasket...hows that for "tuning"

No offense .. but your still looking at SOFTWARE for your tuning

What were you using 25 years ago before XFI's and widebands were available at the local 711

... and with E85 it would take a CATASTROPHIC tuning F UP to unload a head gasket...

your using DC to fuel your car ... not your BIG FUEL SYSTEM