Another Hot Air bitching thread!!!!
- Thread starter boostmaster
- Start date
boostmaster
Active Member
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2001
Dyno Numbers
Ah, young grass hopper that shows how yee has little knowledge of the the Turbo Buick power curve. It's not the horsepower with these cars it's the torque and they make gobs and gobs of that. 285 HP to the wheels will get you into the 12's with some stickies.
You ricer guys kill me with the HP talk. It takes you 3 times the dollars to make power then you can't put it to the ground without constanly breaking parts. Now what fun is that? And to boot you don't suffer from a 20% power loss through the driveline.
MoeJr post the torque numbers also.
Ah, young grass hopper that shows how yee has little knowledge of the the Turbo Buick power curve. It's not the horsepower with these cars it's the torque and they make gobs and gobs of that. 285 HP to the wheels will get you into the 12's with some stickies.
You ricer guys kill me with the HP talk. It takes you 3 times the dollars to make power then you can't put it to the ground without constanly breaking parts. Now what fun is that? And to boot you don't suffer from a 20% power loss through the driveline.
MoeJr post the torque numbers also.
racemybuick
Hot Air Teacher/Student
- Joined
- Apr 3, 2003
now hold on BM... I sank 900 into my 1993 civic 1.5 and I pulled a 16 sec 1/4!!! Cold air, header, 2.5" exhaust, good clutch, good ignition and plugs... And new radial tires! lol... That was faster than my 86 regal!!!!! i sold that civic to a kid and he blew it up promptly a week later after missing several shifts and overheating the hell out of it, popping the head gasket and gumming up the oil pan. Oh well... That car still got 33 mpg's when I was done with it!!!!
As far as HP, I HAD to be pusing 110!!!!!! lol
So not ALL of "us" "import" guys sinks 10's of thousands of dollars to race and break! hahahahahaha
Ive got more $$$ into my non running, non assemble T!!!!
John:biggrin:
As far as HP, I HAD to be pusing 110!!!!!! lol
So not ALL of "us" "import" guys sinks 10's of thousands of dollars to race and break! hahahahahaha
Ive got more $$$ into my non running, non assemble T!!!!
John:biggrin:
Attachments
ah.. er.. "old" grasshopper? it's clear that you have no clue of what you speak.
first off: we've had many a honda civic with a total of $3000 into it (including the cost of the car) that had 350whp and ran high 11s on 215 size drag radials. no clue what it would do with slicks. i never tried, as anyone with a fast car can run good times on sticky tires. i also got 36mph and drove the car very hard at drag strips, street races, AND road courses for two years before selling it. pointless you say? depending on your point of view, yes. that was part of the fun. but then you could also say so is not intercooling a turbo car. pointless. but fun for some of you. just not me.
my honda comment was just poking fun. kinda how despite all the power our hondas made, they had very little torque. we'd make fun of that too. our 600whp civic only made about 400ft lbs or so. now, to me, that is hilarious. it's all due to the fact that the car was only 2.0L but revved to 9,000rpm.
again, you can keep the ricer comments to yourself. no wonder you are supposedly 'signing off', with an attitude like that towards others. you don't see me calling you a stubborn old dinosaur that simply refuses to be open-minded about using newer technology, do you? no. why? partly because i don't care what you do with your car and also because i respect your opinions on how you want to build it. go for it, man. anything you do with your "pure" HA car, i can improve on with my IC'd car. lucky for me, people like you have put all the hard work into finding formulas that work. i get to build on them. i feel i deserve that because of all we've given to the Honda community over the years. LOL. we've helped more people than i can count.. now it's nice to be on the other end.
secondly, my last car made quite a bit more torque than horsepower. i understand HP and TQ curves. our mustang had 550/550, my last car had 334/345, etc, etc. i know horsepower isn't the total story with any vehicle just saying that, unless the car in the video posted above made 281/400tq, then i'll, at some point, have to do something to get more power. why does that get under your skin so much? i just don't get it. or, the internet being what it is, maybe i'm misinterpreting your posts wrong. if i'm taking your comments too serious, than i apologize.
now. we can debate this all day long and get nowhere because neither of us will change our minds, or you can play nice and accept the fact that not everyone wants to build your car.
boostmaster
Active Member
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2001
You are and you are again. I was simply stateing that to the uninformed reader that does'nt know anything about these cars always make the same assumption as others that HP is king. Well compare any GN to a Supra on a dyno and it's clear to see that we won't win any HP wars. Torque moves these cars and as always if you don't make big HP numbers you can easily be underated. Just as in your statement, as I have to take it at face value what you have stated. Wether in jest or not. As you siad this is the net and I can't read emotional content through your key board. So before you go off the deep end keep in mind that I have not said anything offensive to you or called you names or any of that. I don't know what your background is or mechanical aptitude. I just made a comment in reference to your post which is very much in line wth the way many ricers think. And while your build may have come in on the low side of the scale on your Honda from my experiance you are wayyy on the low side of the norm. Most guys I know that race imports spent 3 times that amount before they get that fast so you must have some secret KFC recipe....lol.
BM as soon as I get the info I'll post it. I asked for the whole poop scoop on the build. This place is only 50 minutes away from me.
Kaj trust me when I tell you there is more HP in a hotair than what that GN was putting out. I didn't see an aftermarket turbo on it.
Kaj trust me when I tell you there is more HP in a hotair than what that GN was putting out. I didn't see an aftermarket turbo on it.
Sell the damn car and get another Honda Kaj. Save all of us the agony of another Ilive4GNS please.:biggrin:
If you don't want to listen then please go back to the ricer camp and stay away from here,
I've never said this to another member before so please understand that you have no clue about the way these cars work.:smile: I'm not trying to insult you but if you don't understand what these cars are about then you really need to sell your car and get something else.
If you don't want to listen then please go back to the ricer camp and stay away from here,
I've never said this to another member before so please understand that you have no clue about the way these cars work.:smile: I'm not trying to insult you but if you don't understand what these cars are about then you really need to sell your car and get something else.
naw. no secrets. we just took what people were doing, simplified it, and maybe even got a bit lucky.
as it turns out, Hondas are over-built and respond SUPER well to boost. now.. the all-motor guys are where the money is. they spend $1,000s to end up with about 250whp on a good day. it's crazy. with a turbo kit, all you need is a fuel pump, injectors, and a good tune. no cams, no aftermarket ignition. easy 11s and a trap of 116mph.
then again.. you can spend as much as you want, as with any car. our 600whp civic had WAAAAAAY more money into it. with the slower cars, we were never interested in going any faster than we did in the interest of reliability.
as for my comments on horsepower, that's the number that was posted, so that's what i commented on. no numbers were torque were posted, so... what was i supposed to go off of?
these cars redline at what? 7k rpm? i wouldn't expect to have as much HP as TQ.
oh, i'm sure. any car has more powerful with upgrades. i'm assuming that car had a stock, pre-86 turbo on it. i plan to intercool the car and see where it's at from there. i'd like to add an '86-87 turbo and see what i can do with it. the car may be fun enough to drive at that point. if so, i'll stop. i'll just keep upgrading 'till my ass tells me it's fast enough.
boostmaster
Active Member
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2001
This what I'm talking about. And the reason why I responded to your post in the manner I did. Redline at 7k? Do your homework dude this is not a Honda. These cars are fast but 90% of them have to do it all under 5500 RPM unless your running destroked or a stage motor. Just as your assumption, like many, is that the 1st option to making a hot air car faster is to add an intercooler; your comments do get taken at heart by those that don't know any better. And that is the reason I post the way I do to dispell the disbelief or misinformation put out there about the hot air car. This is the main reason why we don't get any respect. 1) Because there are so few of us 2) Because half the people that bought an 84-85 did'nt know that they were different from the 86-87 and where disappointed from the beginning by not realizing the performance differences between the two.
Jerryl
Tall Unvaccinated Chinese Guy
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2004
Charlie, boostmaster;
Why don’t you guys just go ahead and spill the beans on the secret "go fast" recipe instead of wasting time?
Well, since you guys won't, I will, hope you don't mind. :redface:
Here is a proven “Easy and cheap way to go fast recipe” for HA cars:
Add;
-Big used injectors (You should be able to pick a set up real cheap)
-Flat Tappet cam (to keep cost down) in the 280 advertised range with +.600 lift
-Big fuel pump to supply the fuel
-BIGGEST FM IC (Ford power stroke unit, the bigger the better!)
-BIG turbo (T70) with a 4” DP to make it breath,
-A 3600-3800 stall converter from JEGS or Summit
-A used TT chip from the board or E-Bay.
-4.11 posi rear end with slicks
. . . . . . bolt all the parts and take it to the track,
Be sure the tank is about 1/8-1/4 full to save some weight.
Shift it around 6500-6800 on pump gas at 25-27 psi boost.
Try it and post back, I PROMISE, it will go fast.
Forgot to add to the recipe :redface:;
Add the 87 intake with a good sized air filter.
You can easly extend the wires to the sensors like the TPS and IAC to make is work with the 87 intake.
Charlie, boostmaster;
Why don’t you guys just go ahead and spill the beans on the secret "go fast" recipe instead of wasting time?
Well, since you guys won't, I will, hope you don't mind. :redface:
Here is a proven “Easy and cheap way to go fast recipe” for HA cars:
Add;
-Big used injectors (You should be able to pick a set up real cheap)
-Flat Tappet cam (to keep cost down) in the 280 advertised range with +.600 lift
-Big fuel pump to supply the fuel
-BIGGEST FM IC (Ford power stroke unit, the bigger the better!)
-BIG turbo (T70) with a 4” DP to make it breath,
-A 3600-3800 stall converter from JEGS or Summit
-A used TT chip from the board or E-Bay.
-4.11 posi rear end with slicks
. . . . . . bolt all the parts and take it to the track,
Be sure the tank is about 1/8-1/4 full to save some weight.
Shift it around 6500-6800 on pump gas at 25-27 psi boost.
Try it and post back, I PROMISE, it will go fast.
It will go fast for at least 1 pass.
:biggrin: LMAO! Thanks Jerryl.:smile:
Jerryl
Tall Unvaccinated Chinese Guy
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2004
It will go fast for at least 1 pass.
Well you can always turn the boost down to about 22 and shift at 6000 to make is last, agree?
:biggrin:
Agreed. I may have fun with the car as-is. I can also do alcohol or n2o if I decide to go faster, but choose not to. its mostly for safety reasons now and because it gives me room to grow, should I go that direction. same reason I'll be doing injectors and fuel pump. juuust in case. Especially since we only have 91oct here.
I love building cars, so I'm 99% sure I crave more power later.
This part of the forum is a riot. LOL nobody here needs to prove anything to me. HA cars are awesome and original. I get it. I have no inferiority complex. I have no superiority complex. I'm just a car guy who appreciates all of them. sorry I don't fall in line with some of Your perception of what a Regal owner should be. sell my car? really?
for those that have been supportive: thank you very much. I'm learning.
Like I said, I'm not being mean but the expectations you have for the car and your knowledge about other brands don't mix. Please take your time and learn about them first so you have a better idea of what you're up against.
If you think the SFI HA cars are hard to find parts for or mod then take a look at the CT cars. I litterally had to make my own turbo because there's no upgrade for them. The principles are the same though. Know what the system will allow and how you can modify it for better peformance before you decide to do any mods.
If you think the SFI HA cars are hard to find parts for or mod then take a look at the CT cars. I litterally had to make my own turbo because there's no upgrade for them. The principles are the same though. Know what the system will allow and how you can modify it for better peformance before you decide to do any mods.
I hear ya on the CT issue. I almost bought an 83. I would have swapped everything out, due to it not running, etc...but I did look into restoring. Wow. What a daunting task.
Like I said: I understand the desire to keep these cars original. If I could have found a newer car in my price range, I would have bought it. I don't mind putting work into a car, so upgrading wasn't a deterrent for me.
I've been talking to a few people VIA PMs. They have warned me about the unfriendly environment in the HA forum. I guess I had to see It first hand. I'm stubborn. LOL. I've NEVER had issues on a web forum before..this is new to me. As such, I'm just gonna swap to the 87 top end. Less headaches and, as a bonus, I don't have to post in HA anymore.
Thanks to the guys that put forth the effort and helped me out. I do appreciate it, but I don't have the patience nor time to deal with the drama. I want my build to be enjoyable. There will be mechanical issues along the way, but why add more by being a part of this forum?
I'm deleting my HA subscriptions and will stick to the rest of the board.
no hard feelings. i realize, after all, that this thread is CALLED a bitching thread.
i just don't feel i'm a fit for the HA crowd. Intercooled, here I come.
Kaj, I was in the same place not too long ago. I actually bought an '83 T-Type back in '90. Everyone told me I was stupid, but the car ran great (slow) and was in perfect physical condition. When the turbo finally blew at 99k miles, I swapped in a built SBC. It was easy, cheap, and I had lots of experience with 'Chebbies to draw from. I sold the car at the first sign of rust.
Last year I picked up an '84 GN, and dove in head first with the '87 IC conversion. I spent a lot of time researching, and still spent more than double what I budgeted. Was it worth it? Yes and no. Cost-wise, definitely not. I wish I saved the money and learned to tweak the HA setup before performing heart transplant surgery. But I learned a ton that I otherwise would not have. Sure, it ran quick, was easy to work on, etc. But upgrades and bolt-on's are too easy. I like a challenge, and I like being different. I'm reverting back to the HA setup this spring.
Bottom line, it's your car, do what you want, but make sure you read up on it as much as possible. Research will help make your experience better no matter what you choose to do. Just don't expect warm fuzzies from all of us, because the HA cars are getting more scarce and there is a strong base of fans devoted to preserving them.
Last year I picked up an '84 GN, and dove in head first with the '87 IC conversion. I spent a lot of time researching, and still spent more than double what I budgeted. Was it worth it? Yes and no. Cost-wise, definitely not. I wish I saved the money and learned to tweak the HA setup before performing heart transplant surgery. But I learned a ton that I otherwise would not have. Sure, it ran quick, was easy to work on, etc. But upgrades and bolt-on's are too easy. I like a challenge, and I like being different. I'm reverting back to the HA setup this spring.
Bottom line, it's your car, do what you want, but make sure you read up on it as much as possible. Research will help make your experience better no matter what you choose to do. Just don't expect warm fuzzies from all of us, because the HA cars are getting more scarce and there is a strong base of fans devoted to preserving them.
LOL Esinger. Unfortunately this is the mentality that alot of people have in today's society. They don't want to work at anything they rather just take the easy route out. As has been said this is just another HA that's gonna be ruined by laziness and ignorance. I know those are harsh words but I am very passionate about preserving the HA cars and it pi$$es me off when people convert them when so many I/C cars exist.
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