No Start..... yes really....

[19BGN86]

So I bought my first Grand national 2 weeks ago ... been wanting one of these cars since high school....

Car had been in storage for the last 5 years, and when it came up for sale, I jumped on it.....

Well, the first day, the car ran pretty crappie..... but that was bad gas, filled it up with hi-test, and the car ran fine up until this morning, I had to make about a 75 mile round trip, I made it to where I was going, took care of business, came back to the car, and no start.... so I started checking everything I could in the parking lot with no tools, and came to the conclusion that the fuel pump relay was not clicking..... did the old tap test, and it clicked, and the car started....
Got back in town and the car died right in the middle of our 4 lane that runs through town....
Got pulled back home, and now I can't get the relay to do anything.... so I took it apart to see if I could see anything inside that would lead me somewhere, I can close the contacts and get some fuel pressure at the rail, but I don't have a gauge so I don't know what the psi is...
I took the wires off the Coil packs and it does spark between the towers.....
Anybody have any ideas on where to go/what to do next?
I do have a FP.RELAY coming for in the morning so that'll be new...

Any help and suggestions are greatly appreciated...

 

[whitehot1]

Starting the engine with 5 year old gas in the tank was not a good idea.

You could have damaged the fuel pump and or the injectors and fuel pressure regulator.

 

[Nascar83Fan]

I'd go pick up a fuel pressure tester gauge from one of the auto part stores near you and you'd have a way to see fuel pressure to verify how much it has while troubleshooting things in the driveway / garage.
You probably should replace the fuel filter and need to do a few other things being it was stored for a long time.
There's a list of spring cleaning things to do to these cars that keeps them healthy and happy. There's a sticky post for the link to the guide for new owners and other information under the general turbo buick section of the forum that you should take a look at.
There's alot of information on this board and quite a few helpful people as well.
Out of curiousity does the car have a scanmaster or other device such as a power logger installed in it?
What's been done to the car so far?


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[robzombie]

C'mon give him a break !

He had a woody for a GN and threw caution to the wind because he just had to drive it that badly.

Now he will pay the price for his ignorance and excitement.

How many times have we heard of this happening?? They buy their first T-regal and get a five foot hard on driving it before going through it after it has been sitting for however many umpteen years and then wonder why it left them stranded.

 

[NY Twin Turbo]

If you get stuck with a bad relay, you can always jump it out in a bind. Cut the wires a few inches before the plug, strip them back, twist them together and go home. I never go anywhere without my Leatherman Multi Tool.

Later....you have some harness repair to do along with the new relay. However, this is much cheaper then a tow-truck from 75 miles away.

 

[19BGN86]

I had thought about splicing them but I didn't want to f*ck anything up

 

[NY Twin Turbo]

I had thought about splicing them but I didn't want to f*ck anything up

Worst that could happen is you blow a fuse. And you could always relocate another in the panel if you don't carry spares. Just don't use the one that says "brakes"

 

[NY Twin Turbo]

Worst that could happen is you blow a fuse. And you could always relocate another in the panel if you don't carry spares. Just don't use the one that says "brakes"

Also, the other fellas are correct. Take some time to go through that car before you chance 75 mile drives. Do a big spring cleaning. Write a long list of things that need to get done. And do them. 5 years of sitting along with 23 years before that.....it's not the car's fault. It's just due.

 

[Coelacanth]

C'mon give him a break !

He had a woody for a GN and threw caution to the wind because he just had to drive it that badly.

Now he will pay the price for his ignorance and excitement.

How many times have we heard of this happening?? They buy their first T-regal and get a five foot hard on driving it before going through it after it has been sitting for however many umpteen years and then wonder why it left them stranded.

That was helpful. Great way to welcome a new member.

 

[v6turbo87]

If you get stuck with a bad relay, you can always jump it out in a bind. Cut the wires a few inches before the plug, strip them back, twist them together and go home. I never go anywhere without my Leatherman Multi Tool.

Later....you have some harness repair to do along with the new relay. However, this is much cheaper then a tow-truck from 75 miles away.

NO DON'T DO THAT! There is a fule pump prime wire connector located behind/ near the alternator! All you need to do is run a wire from the hot terminal at the back of the alternator to this connector and the pump should come on. If it doesn't your pump is bad. The last thing you want to be doing is cutting wires!

 

[robzombie]

Welcome to the board 19BGN86. We have a diverse group of people here that will help you out when problems arise with your car.

That was helpful. Great way to welcome a new member.

We have all been there at some point in life whether it be a car or something or someone else. You get so excited that you overlook what should have been obvious and then look back in retrospect and want to kick yourself for not doing what you should have done in the first place. Kinda like this response to your post, I should've just ignored it and moved on.

Ahhh retrospect, why couldn't you have come sooner and saved me from wasting my time typing this.

 

[SHADOWII]

WELCOME PILGRIM!!!
You have certainly come to the right board for help as there are some very knowledgeable people on here. If you do most of your own maintenance, you will find www.gnttype.com & www.vortexbuicks.com
The last I looked, Caspers electronics had a sale on f/p relays, at which time you could also invest in a fuel rail pressure gauge w/a 3' s/s flexible fuel line to tape the gauge to the base of the windshield when you need to monitor the fuel pressure. Then tuck it on the fender when not needed. TRCustoms offers a hood mount kit if you want to display a f/p gauge all the time. These are good venders that use what they sell.
Again WELCOME!!

 

[19BGN86]

Can someone please show me a pic of this fuel pump prime wire?

I got my hands on a fuel pump relay (BWD), and still no start, and I don't hear the 3 second FP prime...

I'm familiar with the prime wire on the Third Gen Camaros, and that's where I had started looking, but they are obviously not in the same place. Lol.

Pictures are worth a thousand words.....

 

[salvageV6]

" Also , to answer your question - the fuel pump prime test wire is grey color and exits the wire harness on the driver side valve cover, behind the alternator. The green one is for a tach hook-up. "
Behind the alternator under the A/C high pressure switch that has 3 wires to it mounted in a metal A/C high pressure line.
USE THE GRAY WIRE. AIMING DOWN IN PICTURE.

 

[19BGN86]

Ok.... so I energized the FP prime wire, and the fuel pump will prime.... still no start....

Is there a way to bench test the crank sensor like on the 3.1 MPFI cars - disconnect from the block and wave a screwdriver or the like in front of it to see if I have ignition fire?

 

[salvageV6]

If it doesn't prime for 2-3 seconds via the ECM prime signal via Key On test then I would check the ECM/IGN 10A lower left, RLYS 5A top of fuse box, ECM/BAT 10A middle right, FP/INJ 15A middle left, and CCCI 10A top left, fuses first.

Two of the three wires on the crank sensor are power for it Pins A and C, A should be +12 volts and C a dedicated signal ground for it.

Easier to start at fuse panel in my opinion.

Take a plug out and verify spark there first.

Acton makes a good fp. guage that will hook to the rail for about $40 it's worth it.

Verify fuel or spark missing first or both....

 

[19BGN86]

Ok, so I just noticed I was not getting the SES light when the ignition switch was flipped on......
Sooo.... I decided to check and make sure all the ecm plugs were plugged in good and tight..... they were, but after the "jostling" of pulling it down in the openess of the floor board, I flipped on the ignition, and the SES light was on so I gave her a twist, and BAM.... fired right up.....

Did notice that the ECM is a GM remaned unit..... do these plugs have a tendency to work themselves out or was this just a freak occurrence.....

 

[1987GNASTROROOF]

No way they will get out of place because the click in. Maybe last person who mess with the ECM did not plug it in all the way,just to make sure clean the pins in the plug.


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[19BGN86]

Also, will be doing "'summer' Cleaning" this weekend, weather permitting....

So far I have
- ACDelco 41-803 plugs
- MSD SF plug wires
- ACDelco fuel filter
- Transmission filter, gasket, and fluid
- Air Filter

What else am I missing.... I know there something....

 

[19BGN86]

No way they will get out of place because the click in. Maybe last person who mess with the ECM did not plug it in all the way,just to make sure clean the pins in the plug.


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Was fixing to walk back out and do that lol