Mixed Meth and Water Track Testing

Thanks Kevin, That's been in the back of my mind as well. I've heard quite a few people complain about the 009s too.

BTW: I'm not switching over to a Fast XFI anytime soon, they want a lot more $$$ than I can muster at this point. The SD Chip and Powerlogger are much more budget friendly.
 
If one is going to try and run straight water injection. you will not need as big of a nozzle top get the same cooling effect if you have a strong pump.

That being said with a stronger pump and a smaller nozzle means that you will have a much finer mist being sprayed in the intake. thus by having a finer mist will allow for better steam conversion. using the steam itself will help control knock and has a big effect on intake temp without having any effects on the A/F ratio.


I really think that one would be better off using a 50/50 mix. i know of guys doing a 70%h20/30% meth. aka peak windsheild washer fluid.


here is a neat page where you can size the nozzles to the amount of power/fuel flow vs engine size.

RSR Water Injection Calculator

here is another great site for info

http://www.torquecars.com/tuning/water-injection.php
 
BTW: I'm not switching over to a Fast XFI anytime soon, they want a lot more $$$ than I can muster at this point. The SD Chip and Powerlogger are much more budget friendly.

By all accounts it is a nice system, but yes it is a bit difficult to justify that kind of expenditure no doubt.

But anyway, step up to the 50's and I will almost bet you will be amazed at how much more they can be tweaked compared to the 009's.
 
If one is going to try and run straight water injection. you will not need as big of a nozzle top get the same cooling effect if you have a strong pump.

That being said with a stronger pump and a smaller nozzle means that you will have a much finer mist being sprayed in the intake. thus by having a finer mist will allow for better steam conversion. using the steam itself will help control knock and has a big effect on intake temp without having any effects on the A/F ratio.

I really think that one would be better off using a 50/50 mix. i know of guys doing a 70%h20/30% meth. aka peak windsheild washer fluid.

RSR Water Injection Calculator

X2
And "HECK YEAH!", These guys know their stuff!!

Edit FYI:
The std alky nozzle is M15 = 15 Gal/hour @ 100PSI
15 gallon [US, liquid] = 56,781 cubic centimeter
 
Well, after going through the calculations and taking a 2 nozzle deduction I'm getting back $1000 from the State and $4000 from Federal! Now I can afford the turbo, injectors and Fast XFI:D

You lost me, but I am happy 4 u. :eek:
 
You lost me, but I am happy 4 u. :eek:

Just kidding around Jerryl:wink: Just went to the calculator and thought of tax calculations for some reason. Anyway, I'm reading through the links that Pat posted and it is an interesting read for sure.
 
So after reading those two articles that Pat posted, I believe there's a few things for me to think about.

1) 50/50 Water and Meth might be the better mix.
2) Lean out A/F ratio.
3) Maybe a smaller nozzle than a M15 would be better.
4) Increase spark advance
 
where is your nozzle at? are you sure you getting and even flow to both sides of the intake. you know its shaped in a ^ right after the turbo.
 
It's on the Turbo to intake adapter, so yeah it's right before the right angle which is probably not the best placement, but kind of even you'd think.
 
should be ok. i have mine in the intake. 2 of them on each side of the ^
 
should be ok. i have mine in the intake. 2 of them on each side of the ^



This is think the the best location for alky or water and the plenum has a higher volume area for mixing and the most heat soak.


Myself and Mark-R were wondering about his gutted intake and the effects it has on the air flow to the runners is now that it has been gutted somewhat.


I'm curious to do some air flow stuff on a stock intake and then look at a mildly ported one (runner ported only) and then compare that to the gutted one that eric is currently running now.

But the water/meth mix is doing more for his combo because he can run 24 psi with no knock and with the straight meth it would rattle some. Also i really like what i seen in the temp reduction.


Brent i think that two m5 nozzles for a water/meth mix would be great on your current combo to reduce the intake temps. I think that you spray the meth on top of the race gas correct?. when doing the water injection you will not have to worry about removing the extra fuel from the tune up.


Letting the wide band do the corrections for you can be a bad thing to it being that far off the chart. you want less that 5 % corrections. The farther away from the actual AFR it has to go meens that it could add too much then take too much away and then it goes lean and pop a gasket.

when using a closed loop system the AFR was ranges a tad bit above and a tad bit below your target AFR. the o2 sensor has to see the motor goes rich or lean before it can compensate so the o2 sensor is alway running behind the engine. so i would play it safe and tray and keep the correction percent from actual AFR to the target AFR to 5% or less.


In my FAST system i only gave it max of 10% to lean it out and 30% percent to richen it up. I don't want the ecm to have a brain fart and take too much out. I Also go to the top of the map and richen the hell out of the VE #'s and pull the timing down just incase it decided to overboost and got into a part of the map that has not been tuned for.

I lost a headgasket last fall due to the wastegate sticking and it made 29psi of boost from 21 while running 110 octane fuel. so always build a safe zone if you can.


i just recently lost a HG again due to a walbro fuel pump failure and it cooked the gaskets and the fast was tring to call for 107% duty cycle and it still was not enuff so things can happen but all you can do is try to prevent somethings.


Also you running a XFI or classic?
 
XFI, i really like the cooling effect of meth but not sure about just ruuning water. i will talk to my tuner about this. i dont want to mix meth and water it will be one or the other. just not sure how well water works compared to meth. the thing i dont like about the meth is it acts as a fuel as well. it would be nice to have the cooling of the meth without the increased octane as far as the race gas is concerned. but it will be kinda nice once it comes to the pump gas. i will keep playing with it. i just need to get the inlet temps down way down without taking to much fuel out. right now i have it set to take a max of 5% and add a max of 25%
 
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