Methanol Vs Ethanol test results

[TurboSy]

Did some real world testing, comparing methanol Vs ethanol. First pass was with ethanol, went home emptied the container, refilled it with methanol and went to the exact same spot.

Here are the results

Ethanol (4-1mm nozzles) and Pure 92 octane 0-120 mph
Mats went from 84.2 to 99 degrees.
Map was between 249 to 264 (20-23 psi)
Timing was set at 15-16 degrees, picked up 4.4 degrees of knock in 3rd
Datamaster ET was 11.27 @ 116.9 (no tcc, its broke)
Real afr was mostly in the low 11-1's

Methanol (4-1mm nozzles) and Pure 92 octane 0-120 mph
Mats went from 80.4 to 92.5 degrees
Map was between 243 to 266 (20-23 psi)
Timing was set at 15-16 degrees, picked up 3.3 degrees of knock in 3rd
Datamaster ET was 11.23 @ 118.8
Real afr was mostly in the low 12-1's

 

[TurboSy]

In case anyones wondering about the real afr. Its a wideband logged through the stock ECM, I originally tuned my truck to run at 11.0-11.5 on ethanol, but as you can see making no other changes the methanol burn about one point leaner, which is about what I expected with my setup.

 

[Razor]

Thanks for sharing the info..I run the methanol you get at the track and found it to work real well..looks like less detonation and leaner..

I assume the nozzles are the aqua mist 1mm..might you have any pixs how you tied them together?

thx

 

[Steve Hill]

Notice the leaner a/f. Meth has less btu's. That's probably why you picked up hp. These engines like lean.
In the real world it is difficult to pick which one is optimal because it really depends upon your particular method of utilization.

 

[TurboSy]

Originally posted by Razor
Thanks for sharing the info..I run the methanol you get at the track and found it to work real well..looks like less detonation and leaner..

I assume the nozzles are the aqua mist 1mm..might you have any pixs how you tied them together?

thx

I don't have any pictures, but Its pretty simple.

6 mm line from the shurflo to a brass tee (3 ports), one port will be connected to the 6mm feed line, the other two with be quick connect 4 mm adapters. Then use two plastic quick connect tees to make 4 lines. Brad (aquamist guy) can supply you with all these fittings, I just told him I wanted to run 4 1mm nozzles and he sent all the parts.

I actually added one more brass tee to give me an extra outlet, this is where I mounted a Hobbs switch set at 40-50 psi, this connects to my boost controller, basically I get base boost until the alky line is pressurized and trips the Hobbs. I've tested this and it even cuts my boost when your getting low on alky and the pump starts to surge, it also works good for highway kickdowns.

 

[Steve Hill]

I like your boost control idea. Great idea and Cool!
Would you happen to have egt readings we could correlate with the wide-band?

 

[Razor]

Can you post or send me Brads info.. Thx.. Or a cheap(haha) source for aquamist stuff..

 

[TurboSy]

Originally posted by Steve Hill
I like your boost control idea. Great idea and Cool!

Thanks, its the only way I feel safe with 50# injectors, their at 100% duty cycle at 20 psi with the wideband reading high 12-1's, so I'm kind of counting on the alky being there. .

Originally posted by Steve Hill
Would you happen to have egt readings we could correlate with the wide-band?

Unfortunately I don't.

 

[TurboSy]

Originally posted by Razor
Can you post or send me Brads info.. Thx.. Or a cheap(haha) source for aquamist stuff..

George's Imports, Ltd.
8011 State Line Road
Kansas City MO 64114
816-333-6582
816-361-2096 Fax

Just ask for Brad.

 

[Steve Hill]

Mark, re: your maxed injectors, here are a couple things to try. You didn’t mention fuel pressure. Do you have enough fuel pump to go up 3-4 lbs.? This would add a few % fuel, which should allow you to relax the duty cycle about 5%.

You list four 1.0 nozzles, for a total aperture of 4 mm. This might be borderline for the airflow you’ve got.

So, I guess this is what I would try: add another 1mm nozzle, cut the alcohol with 25% water, increase fuel pressure, increase engine timing.
Just kicking some ideas around

 

[TurboSy]

Thanks Steve, right now I'm running base fuel pressure at 42 psi. I'm running a single 340 fuel pump so I'll have to be careful not to go too far with pressure, but I'll defintaly take your advice and add 3-4 psi, and add the extra nozzle.

The goal for the truck is 10's on pump gas, I think by fixing the TCC which is killing the mph, and doing some fine tuning like you mentioned it'll hit those numbers. I'll keep you posted after I get all these issue sorted out.

Thanks for your help.

 

[Steve Hill]

Mark,
I also have the 340 pump. I can vouch it will support 36 pounders at 52 lbs fuel pressure, boost at 30 lbs.
Of course, it has to flow more fuel to feed your 50's. But my point is the pump is pretty stout and should handle 46 lbs.

 

[Razor]

I think what he means about the pump is..1 lb per PSI..so at 42 you add 25 PSI your at 67..under the max rated PUMP pressure..but getting closer to the max rating..why not alter the chip to bring down base to 37 add 25 and your at 62..

Makes sense

I've seen cars static at 52-55 lbs run 30 PSI..but thats asking for it..

 

[Steve Hill]

Razor... I don't follow your logic, so bear with me....
TurboSy needs more fuel. He can't turn down base fp because he said his duty cycle is 100% with the base at 42. If he goes down in fp where does the fuel come from?
Regards your "pushing it" remark: If nobody pushed the limit how would you know where the limit was
But, I agree, you can only do so much with fuel press before you run out of .....everything!

 

[87gnand00ws6]

Hey razor, saw you run your car the other weekend. we were playing with my buddies old supra, I went ahead and got the pt52 turbo, so hopfully ill beat my old times, hope to see you at the track soon, hope my converter wont lag me to much off the line, Oh yea and that was kinda funny how they were bitching at ya because of not having a roll cage, Ive been bitched at myself. Dont want to ruin the car with a cage either. Oh and good runs, your car ran good, and beat that superchaged stang. funny funny

 

[TurboSy]

I decided to try out the bigger shurflo pump (1.8gpm) and upgraded all my wiring, it flows considerably more now, each pass is well over 12 oz, not sure exactly, but its sucking those little 12 oz heet bottles down like crazy. As for fuel I'm running about 85% duty cycle, so basically I got 2 more pounds of boost and I'm running 15% less duty cycle, plus its a tad richer.

Here's the info.

Methanol and 92 octane 0-121 mph
Mats went from 84.2 to 87.3
Map 260-270 (24-25 psi)
Timing 16-18 degrees
AFR low 11's
Knock 1.8 degrees
Data master et: 11.36 @ 121.0

Picked up some good mph, but the alky seems to give it a little too much kick down low, went from mid to high 1.4 60's to 1.70's. I'll have to working on launching later, right now we just need to make a little more power.