Hydroboost Nightmare!!

[dz28]

Another 7 hours in the garage and the Hydroboost is still not running right. Finally received another set of braided lines from Bob and put them on the car this morning. Cycled through getting PS fluid up to the Hydroboost so it would not run dry. Checked for leaks and none were found... :biggrin: proceeded to put the tensioner, alternator, intercooler shroud, and intercooler back in the car. Jacked up the front and started the Buick up for the first time in a month... Turned the steering wheel back and forth about 20 times while checking the PS reservoir for milkiness and bubbles. Get everything to settle down, pump is a touch noisier but not crazy. Check for leaks again and none were found ... :biggrin: :biggrin: Now time to play with brake fluid and draw the air out of the lines; this too goes seemingly well and finally button the car up about 3:30PM. Fire the Buick again to drive up and down the street to release any more air in the PS lines. Brakes will not release ... Car in neutral and won't move, car in reverse will move but only with a bunch of throttle, car in drive the car will move but all four corners are engaged in braking. The hyrdoboost is not releasing fully. Now what??????????? For all you guys running hydroboost without install problems and driveability problems I commend you. Not having brakes is a nightmare; not having brakes when you spent a bunch of $$$ on a hyrdroboost system is beyond that by a factor of 10. I'm back where I started many weeks ago... I have a Buick that sits because I cannot get the braking system to work. At this point I'm wishing I went with a rebuilt PowerMaster. Anyone else have a brake lock issue when installing a hydroboost?

 

[V6UnderPressure]

I am having issues but its not that. I am waiting on a response from Bob because he sent me the wrong size feed hose. He was there every day to explain to me why I needed to have this system, and once I bought it, he disappeared and is a bitch to get ahold of. I would like to get mine set up, but I just cant because of these ridiculous delays. When was the last time you talked to bob? By the way, did you have any issues with that spitter fitting on the hydroboost? You have to take that one fitting out and replace it with an -an fitting. It has a little rubber o-ring on it. the first fitting had a space for the o-ring, but the new one doesnt seem to and its getting crushed against the flat part and not seating where its supposed to. Starting to get irritating.

 

[dz28]

Last time I actually spoke with Bob was on Monday the 14th. He wasn't terribly nice but did have new braided lines made up and shipped them to me in time for the weekend. These lines had good fittings and went on the car without any drama. I have not had any problems with the connections to the hydroboost or the banjo fittings; that part has gone just fine. I did not have to change anything on the hydroboost but also did not go with the braided line for the return to the reservoir. I can only assume I must have something wrong in my hookup; Bob didn't include any directions and the little bit he did send via email didn't include any diagrams for the return line. How do you have your return line (the low pressure line) set up? I teed the reservoir line from the steering gear back to the reservoir. My system is obviously not relieving pressure and therefore not releasing the brakes. Needless to say after more than two weeks of messing with this it was not my best decision relative to fixing my Powermaster. I should have just bought a rebuilt PM and stuck it on the damn car; perhaps I'd be driving it by now. 13 miles is my total for 2008 so far....

 

[charlief1]

If I remember correctly you have to adjust the rod both at the pedal and at the MC. Check and see if it's out to far. It would cause a 4 wheel brake lock up.

 

[V6UnderPressure]

Last time I actually spoke with Bob was on Monday the 14th. He wasn't terribly nice but did have new braided lines made up and shipped them to me in time for the weekend. These lines had good fittings and went on the car without any drama. I have not had any problems with the connections to the hydroboost or the banjo fittings; that part has gone just fine. I did not have to change anything on the hydroboost but also did not go with the braided line for the return to the reservoir. I can only assume I must have something wrong in my hookup; Bob didn't include any directions and the little bit he did send via email didn't include any diagrams for the return line. How do you have your return line (the low pressure line) set up? I teed the reservoir line from the steering gear back to the reservoir. My system is obviously not relieving pressure and therefore not releasing the brakes. Needless to say after more than two weeks of messing with this it was not my best decision relative to fixing my Powermaster. I should have just bought a rebuilt PM and stuck it on the damn car; perhaps I'd be driving it by now. 13 miles is my total for 2008 so far....

Routing should go like this assuming your accumulator is on the passenger side of the Hydroboost: Power steering pump outlet to the Hydroboost passenger side banjo fitting. Out of the hydroboost drivers side banjo fitting to the steering rack. Out of the steering rack to the return on the reservoir. The little spitter fitting on top of the hydroboost (one with o-ring) gets "T"ed into the return from the steering rack.

I have mine routed except for the hose I am missing for the Feed line. I went with the aluminum reservoir so I have a separate return from the hydroboost spitter. that is supposed to reduce pump whine.

 

[dz28]

If I remember correctly you have to adjust the rod both at the pedal and at the MC. Check and see if it's out to far. It would cause a 4 wheel brake lock up.

Charlie,

Thanks for a moment of sanity in the nutty process of troubleshooting a "bolt in" replacement braking system. Your advice is the most sensible thing I've heard in several months of trying to get a pristine automobile back on the road. Looks like I'll be under the hood and under the dash again this week. Not sure if there is any adjusting at the MC; I'm guessing all the play is under the dash cause that would be the harder of the two!

 

[incubus2432]

I had the wrong feed hose from Bob as well. He offered to swap it but after all of the waiting for other parts from him I opted to just get the parts from Summit......cost was about $30 or $40 (I forget since I'm trying to block out my Hydroboost installation nightmare as well). It turns out that the feed hose from Bob was a -8AN hose with -10AN fittings. What I got from Summit is -10AN thoughout so the pump is more likely to stay fed properly. Another option while you wait to contact Bob is to just use a cheap rubber hose from a local parts hut so you can at least get on the road.

 

[WINDMILL]

bad

I've already had bad proplems from bob too.try to get with him when he was going to ship mine out too, finally got ahold of his wife to tell me something. they said they was backordered on some fittings. its been 3 weeks so far and no product so far. i hope i dont have these kinda proplems you guys are having. but it dont look to good on my part too.

 

[GO FAST]

Wow , sorry to hear all these problems , i've had mine installed for a couple months with no real problems and the install went really smooth. The brakes are rock solid , dont give up if you can get this system worked out there is no comparison to the factory powermaster unit (nevermind the safety issue of the stock brakes going out at anytime with no warning) I wanted to install Wilwood brakes on the front , now with hydroboost I dont even need it , if I did install them it would be mainly for weight savings and looks at this point. Don't give up , this in my opinion is by far the best braking system for these cars.

 

[dz28]

I hear ya... I plan on one more day in the garage trying to solve the "locked brakes" condition I currently have. Based on feedback from the forum I've come to the conclusion the rod needs to be adjusted in to relieve some pressure off the braking system. I'm not looking forward to taking the system out to adjust the rod; it's a bitch trying to fit 6'2" under that damn dash and my system has the four bolts that fit into the firewall and the four bolts are of course under the steering column. So that means a few hours under the dash undoing most of what I have already done at least once. I'm a decent mechanic and unfortunately a fairly trusting soul. When I was told by the seller this was a bolt on system I didn't anticipate the multiple problems I have had. One would expect with the words "bolt on" that they system was engineered to fit a specific application. I hadn't expected the engineering work to sort out what should have be sorted by the seller when paying $900 bucks for the darn thing. I truly appreciate the feedback in this forum, what I don't appreciate is not having driven my car this summer due to the lovely PM system dropping me on my ass then having significant and many problems installing the hydroboost. Hoping to finish work up a touch early tomorrow to get under the hood when it is not 95 degrees and humid here. I will let the crew know if I get this damn thing to work... how is your brake pedal feel on your system? So far mine acts like a wild hydraulic pump. . . it does stop the car but the pedal feel is far from OEM.

 

[GO FAST]

I can honestly say mine was a bolt on deal , thats what confuses me , sounds like these systems wer'nt all made the same. Mine used the existing two studs on the firewall that held the powermaster unit , I was even impressed with how the hydroboost unit slid right on. The only thing I had to modify was to make the hole slightly bigger (in the firewall) were the unit slid through , about 5 min. with a grinder. The brakes have a solid feel , not soft and mushy as with the powermaster , almost like a slight manual feel initially but with power as you give more pedal and absolute positive stopping power at the end.

 

[dz28]

Sounds like many were a touch different; I don't mind so much as I think the four bolt set up is probably more robust. I would have liked to have received instructions at the time of sale, schematics for the PS lines, schematic for the reservoir return line, you know, that sort of EXPECTED documentation for a "BOLT ON" system... really not happy there was no indication or instruction on how to determine end play for the brake rod going into the Hydroboost. It would certainly simplify the install if you considered the possibilities ahead of the install. Getting the clevis back into the brake pedal once I shorten it up should be a root toot hooting good time...

 

[kingots2004]

my car has hydrboost also and the only problems ive had is blowing the braided line while building boost and my passenger side brake locked alittle bit one time and smoked the shoes but hasnt done it since so i dont know what caused it but this system holds really good

 

[dz28]

found the problem but still do not have a solution. measuring the face of the hydroboost to the center point of the clevis and found 5 - 1/4 inches. measured my Powermaster and the same distance is 4 - 3/4 inches. needless the extra half inch is activating my four corners and keeping the car from moving. have been in contact with Power Brake Service and they are searching for a solution... in the mean while it's been 3 weeks on the hydroboost install and nearly two months without driving the car due to lack of brakes.... amazing...

 

[V6UnderPressure]

I am concerned as I thought the powermaster pedal mates right up to the hydroboost without modification. Which master cylinder are you using? Maybe that is the issue?

 

[dz28]

The brake pedal from the Powermaster works fine for the hydroboost. The master cylinder is the one from the kit that is offered by Power Brake Service. Bottom line is the 4 bolt flange hydroboost they sent me has a brake pedal rod that is long by 1/2 inch. This causes the brakes to actuate making it difficult to move the car. Bob is supposedly working on a solution; I'm not comfortable cutting the rod to length as the threads are not consistent across the rod. Right about where I would need to lop off 1/2 inch there are no threads; just a flat spot for about 1/8 - 1/4 inch... such fun... bolt in...

 

[kingots2004]

that sucks you will probly wind up cutting the rod and running a die on it.can you post a pic of how its setup?

 

[kingots2004]

or what about a half inch spacer between the fire wall and brake booster?flat piece of aluminum i wonder if maybe whoever makes his kit put to thin of a block on the back of it

 

[dz28]

Not going to do anything until I hear back from Power Brake Service Bobby... once I hear his solution I'll snap a couple of pics. No way to put a 1/2 spacer, the 4 posts going into the dash aren't long enough and it would blow out the power steering reservoir which is already extremely tight to the master cylinder. I'm going to have to move the power steering reservoir at least a 1/4 inch forward to eliminate the interference and have the ability to undo the cap. I'm also not going to make any significant changes to what may eventually become my braking system. I'm a believer that when a reputable vendor says the system is bolt on they have done their due diligence to ensure the kit will install. We are talking brakes here; I don't want to find a way to get them working, I want them to work as this company intended. What really frosts my cupcakes is the amount of downtime this car has incurred. I don't drive it more than 200-300 miles a summer and the grand total so far this year is 13 miles. I will update as things hopefully move forward and I do appreciate the interest and the responses, they have helped keep my brain from exploding ...

 

[WINDMILL]

bob

You prob wont here from him(bob). i call yesterday and she said it was going out(my hydroboost) yesterday or today and give me a tracking number. so i'm at work she calls and said the parts was not all their yet and it will a few more days. i think this is alot of bull if you ask me. its been 3 weeks so far. they wont return your calls. the first one today after 3 weeks. so maybe the people that read this might have second thoughts of buying one from him. his service is like crap. sorry for raving on but he has my money and have not got anything from him yet, but excusses