Got a nitrous kit!

Going to try 35 shot out of the hole for a bit and gradually move on up from hole hits to eventually misting her all the way down with maybe 75. It really depends on my goals. I ran 11.4 consistantly with my stock stuff. Now I have a built motor to handle some HP and hope to run 11.00's on motor alone. I really just want to play a bit and learn as much as I can because not a lot of turbo 6 people are spraying.
 
A mechanic friend of mine sprayed via the up pipe and I'd imagine for us that's more common than the plates ( Don WG's the nitrous guy BTW ). But he also blew the head gaskets 3 times and didn't care much about diagnostic tools for tuning. :eek:

I'd make sure you have a Wideband on the car and then look out. :cool:

BTW, Don how do you feel about the Power Plate and Nitrous via the up pipe etc?
 
A mechanic friend of mine sprayed via the up pipe and I'd imagine for us that's more common than the plates ( Don WG's the nitrous guy BTW ). But he also blew the head gaskets 3 times and didn't care much about diagnostic tools for tuning. :eek:

I'd make sure you have a Wideband on the car and then look out. :cool:

BTW, Don how do you feel about the Power Plate and Nitrous via the up pipe etc?

It scares the heck outa me. I don't particularly like to go back into my engine after it's finished, so I elected to use the safest nitrous system available. There is no argument that port injected nitrous is by far the safest configuration. Distribution problems are not an issue. I see the naturally aspirated guys at the track constantly fighting distribution problems with their plate setups. A plate system has to be better than spraying in the up pipe. Especially if you're talking about a wet system. With a dry system, as long as the nitrous has vaporized by the time it hits the upper plenum, you may have good enough distribution, but still, not perfect.

I don't have any experience spraying a single nozzle, so I'll just say this. Do exactly as you're planning to do. Start out very small and move up slowly and methodically. Check your tune-up very, very carefully with each and every change. Keep the nitrous a/f ratio on the richer side to help combat distribution problems. Remember that liquid nitrous and gasoline does not like to make right angle turns. Consider that very carefully when you're setting up your injection point and any mods to the plenum.

Do not try to do a large shot through a single nozzle, unless you're sure you've solved the distribution shortcomings of a single nozzle system.
 
Hey Don which nozzle setup do you perfer? Does one do anything more then the other? N2o, Zex, NX, etc...

Can the XFI control the nitrous effectively? Does the XFI have the ability to control the N20 progressively or is a progressive controller required?

Does the ability to progressively control the flow of nitrous even matter with such a small shot of 75? Thanx...
 
Hey Don which nozzle setup do you perfer? Does one do anything more then the other? N2o, Zex, NX, etc...

Can the XFI control the nitrous effectively? Does the XFI have the ability to control the N20 progressively or is a progressive controller required?

Does the ability to progressively control the flow of nitrous even matter with such a small shot of 75? Thanx...

I made my own nozzles for the race GN so I really can't give an educated critique of the different available nozzles. I'm currently plumbing a 500 hp port system onto a Hogan's twin turbo Viper V10 intake manifold. Had to make custom distribution manifolds. The nozzles are mounted on the inside of the runners, under the plenum. What fun to plumb. The stainless port injection nozzles we're using on this job are from Nitrous Supply and the design is very nice.

The XFI should be able to control a nitrous system. If the XFI has a general purpose output that is pulse width controllable, it can be used to progressively control the nitrous. I would tend to shy away from progressive control of the nitrous solenoids. The rapid cycling during pulse width control will wear out the sealing seats of the solenoids very quickly. When a seat fails,...OUCH!!! The solenoids found in America are not designed to be pulsed reliably for a long length of time.

For small single nozzle shots, I would not bother at all with progressive control.
 
Dr. DonWG, :cool:
Dumb question, just trying to learn.

What would happen if you sprayed a real small dry shot (30HP max) in the intake tract, about 18" before the turbo inlet?
 
Dr. DonWG, :cool:
Dumb question, just trying to learn.

What would happen if you sprayed a real small dry shot (30HP max) in the intake tract, about 18" before the turbo inlet?

Actually, that would be a very safe way to do it, and probably the way I would go if I were trying to use a single nozzle. The nitrous would have plenty of time to change state from a liquid to vapor and get mixed with the air very well. You would then only have to worry about the injector being able to supply the needed extra fuel. A device that would raise fuel pressure a certain amount whenever the nitrous was activated could be used. Old school, but affective with a small shot. If you were running an ECM that had an auxiliary fuel map that could be switched to whenever the nitrous was activated, that would seem to me to be the better way to go. I would try my best to figure out a system that introduced the extra fuel through the existing port injectors. There may be a timing problem that would have to be hashed out though. If both the nitrous and the extra fuel were activated at the same time, the fuel would definitely get to the cylinder before the nitrous. And when the system was shut down, there would still be nitrous in the intake system that would need to pass through the engine still, but the fuel would be shut down. I'm not sure about depending on the O2 correction to do it for you.

See, the big problem I see with a wet system on a GN is the dog house intake. Introducing the nitrous and fuel in the up pipe is going to be a distribution nightmare. The 2 front cylinders are a right angle flow path after the throttle body. If the nitrous AND fuel haven't vaporized by that point, there is very little chance you will have good distribution. If you make sure that the nitrous to fuel ratio is on the rich side, you may keep from going too lean. I would go at least one fuel jet size richer than the chart suggests. Do some very short testing and check plugs.

That's another thing. I would not run a single nozzle system long duration. The engine can tolerate a lean nitrous/fuel mix for a very short time. If that time can be enough to get on the turbo, then mission successful. If you try to run the nitrous full pass or maybe 2 to 3 seconds with a few cylinders too lean, you're going to have problems.

The more I try to figure out a safe single nozzle system, the more a port injection system looks to be the simpler, easier and safer way.

If you study it, you'll notice the nitrous companies will start suggesting a port system at a certain system hp level. They realize that with the larger percentage of nitrous/fuel to normal air/fuel, there is a far greater chance of engine damage from the inherent distribution problems of a single nozzle system. The intake charge is much cooler because of the greater amount of nitrous being injected and the coolness of the mixture does not do much to help vaporize fuel. As I stated in an earlier post, liquids do not like to make turns.
 
subscribed to this thread..

you and me both. i would like to hear more info on spraying alky or nitrous pre turbo. like spraying right after the air filter so it has lots of time to go from a liquid to a gas or however you look at it.
 
Ok. What about spraying in the MAF pipe pre turbo? Would ther be any ill affects from doing that?
 
Yes, you will get an effect of about 1/2 the advertised jet rating.


scott wile

About time you chimed in here! These guys are hungry for some single nozzle tech.

Guys, Scott is the man to ask about single nozzle tech. He's done very well with his ride.
 
ok so half the rated shot thats fine. but hows the cooling effect? Scott and Don im just asking due to the short distance from my turbo to intake to the ports. i dont think my alky is going to a gas so its not cooling as much as it should. also just wondering about nos or alky hitting the blades of a turbo spinning at crazy speeds.
 
ok so half the rated shot thats fine. but hows the cooling effect? Scott and Don im just asking due to the short distance from my turbo to intake to the ports. i dont think my alky is going to a gas so its not cooling as much as it should. also just wondering about nos or alky hitting the blades of a turbo spinning at crazy speeds.

I wouldn't even think about trying to spray alcohol through your turbo. It wouldn't make it through the intercooler very well. Oh...nevermind I just saw that you are a hotair car...It might work out well for you then. I would be wary of it still...liquids are bad about puddling, but maybe the turbo would keep it moving the right direction :confused:

Nitrous, when it comes out of the noids/lines turns into gas lickety split. It would make it through the IC because it would just move with the pressurized charge. However if you do that you are going to lose some of the effect because it's moving a really long way and it's going through a very warm intercooler, which is going to heat up the nitrous. You also wouldn't want to try a wet shot through a turbo on an intercooled car. You would have a really tremendous backfire and immediate problems.

I spray mine in the up pipe about 6 inches away from the tb. I ran a 75 shot single NX nozzle and it hit like Mike Tyson with the boost coming on. I can't imagine how violent Don's must be. Mine went from 23 psi to about 28 psi on the spray up high. 35 makes a very noticeable difference as well, I picked up 8mph in the 1/8th on a 35!!!

If you have money or can fab, do a direct port. If not, IMO single wet nozzle is super easy and very affordable.

Disclaimer: I am not a nitrous expert, but I have sprayed pretty much every car that I have owned except for a few crappy beaters (and I thought about hosing them too). I just am using my experience and some common sense :)
 
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