Fuel Lines compared, OEM GM vs Aftermarket

[tom h]

Just received new stainless fuel lines from Inline Tube, with whom I (and many others) have had good experience with.

FYI See attached - the swage/bend on the ends of Inline's tubes tapers narrower, and the oring either doesn't stay on or tends to slide off.

The OEM GM tube tapers slightly wider at the tip, keeping the Oring securely captured and in position.

I prepared these pictures to send to Inline, and will contact them today. Hope I don't have a fight on my hands ... IMNSHO, the replacement lines are not quite "equivalent" in design or quality to the OEM.

Does anyone know what Classic Tube's lines are like, in this detail?

Sigh, nothing is easy ...

(note, you may need Acrobat version 7 to properly view the attachment).

 

[FastRegalWE2]

good info, nice job on the pics. I would def want to have that flare on the end to feel more comfortable with the orings placement

 

[TURBOTWIN2]

Looks to me like you could flare it yourself easily with tapered punch. I know what you're about it should already be done bu Inline, though.

 

[tom h]

Looks to me like you could flare it yourself easily with tapered punch. .

Or maybe even a flaring tool. But, I'd rather not risk it, and have Inline say I "broke it".

It also seems to me the straight section of the tube extending beyond the bead, should be another 1/16 inch or so, longer

 

[tom h]

Inline Tube's response is that they won't replace or return the tubing.

In their view, this is "not a problem" and "no one else has complained".

Their web site claims " highest quality parts... guarantee 100% accuracy, safety and fit".

My photos show this is plainly not the case.

As this was nearly $300 of tubing, I'm going to ask my credit card company to arbitrate and reverse the charges. GRRRR !

 

[Lee Thompson]

It is beyond me why

It is so hard to copy a piece. You ask about Classic tube. I just ordered the front brake line kit in stainless. One out of the 4 pieces was correct. One had the last 90 degree bend 90 off. The 2 coming from the master cyl. to the block on the frame were not even close to original. I called and left a message--2 weeks ago--have not heard from them as of yet. I MADE them fit. Lot of chatter lately about bashing vendors--some say we should just suck it up and be quite---I say make a good part and do what they promise and you won't have any bashing.

 

[tom h]

I've bought brake lines from Inline in the past, and those have been of good quality & good fit.

All the subtle bends in the fuel lines seemed correct, it's just their darned oring ends that are "wrong".

But what pissed me off was the "no one else has complained ... take it or leave attitude".

 

[BadAssGN]

I emailed them, Hope it helps. definately an inferior product

 

[wbrophy]

I installed the SS Classic Tube fuel pressure line from front to rear and all their SS brake lines a year or so ago and I don't remember "any" problems. I am one who would notice if the holes where smaller, I always do my best to enlarge the holes whenever possiable.

 

[salvageV6]

Stainless requires different tooling and dies to make the flares from what I've read, so be careful with the/your modifications.

My Classic tube S.S. brake lines so far have been perfect, but I haven't used the whole kit yet.

Nut sizes were different from stock but the line sizes weren't and fit perfectly.

 

[tom h]

update: I filed a claim against Inline Tube and requested a refund through my credit card company, citing defective products as my reason.

As required by law in most states, the credit card charges do not have to be paid until the "investigation" is completed. No one from card card company has yet contacted me for documentation or pictures, they say it can take 6-8 weeks to resolve.

moral: pay with credit cards to preserve maximum legal rights for yourself. I likely would have been SOL had I purcahsed with Paypal or a Debit card.

 

[Devil Car]

I'm not quite sure I see what the problem is here. I have reviewed your .pdf file, and the type of fitting pictured does not use an o-ring.

I could be way off base, but generally these types of fittings just screw into place without any type of packing or o-ring. Unless you are having problems with leaks or the ID (inner diameter) of the tube is undersized (which I really doubt), I believe the part that you have received is perfecly legit...

Just my $0.02!

 

[tom h]

I'm not quite sure I see what the problem is here. I have reviewed your .pdf file, and the type of fitting pictured does not use an o-ring.
I could be way off base, but generally these types of fittings just screw into place without any type of packing or o-ring. ...

Incorrect. These older GM fuel fittings, sometimes also called "Saginaw"-style (used on power steering hoses), most definitely DO require an Oring for safe, reliable sealing.

These style fittings are used on the fuel filter, on the fuel rail Supply, and on the fuel Return (at bottom of the back-pressure regulator).

 

[Devil Car]

Incorrect. These older GM fuel fittings, sometimes also called "Saginaw"-style (used on power steering hoses), most definitely DO require an Oring for safe, reliable sealing.

These style fittings are used on the fuel filter, on the fuel rail Supply, and on the fuel Return (at bottom of the back-pressure regulator).

Interesting... Thanks for the clarification!

 

[turbodave231]

Interesting thread.

I just purchased a complete set of fuel lines from InLine tube. I am converting a 307 Regal over to the LC2 engine.

I ran into the same problem keeping the o-rings in place. The original style fuel lines do have the taper to retain the orings.

I carefully installed new orings and quickly assembled the line to the hose end fitting. The taper isn't critical to tube sealing but does help keep the oring in place. I didn't see this as a show stopper.

Overall, the lines are high quality. Some of the swaged ends are not identical to factory and their hardware is not correct. They do fit relatively well.

Here are a few pictures of the lines installed. BTW, They are a Pain to install. I had to lift the body off the frame to run the lines

86 Regal Limited pictures from cars photos on webshots

 

[tom h]

... I carefully installed new orings and quickly assembled the line to the hose end fitting...

That is is my big concern, that an Oring would get installed askew, or if it falls out and is not noticed. This is especially worrisome on connections that are frequently reconnected (eg, fuel filter) or if someone less familiar with the car attempts these services. In my case, I considered these problems as "defects". My existing fuel lines are in decent shape, but I was looking forward to the permanence & looks of shiny new SS lines.

... BTW, They are a Pain to install. I had to lift the body off the frame to run the lines .

The vent line does look difficult, if not impossible.

I had read the Supply & Return possibly could be done with body-on, but that some clamps might need to have the bolt head ground-off for removal.

I did install an SS rear brake line with body-on, that was a PITA but eventually worked out.

By chance, have you tried the Kirban SS fuel line segments that run from the frame up to the fuel rail? If so, how was the quality & fit?

 

[jim we fan]

Buyer Beware

WARNING

Do not buy GM fuel lines from Inlinetube.com.
The crimp for a GM factory line is stepped down at
the end to allow room for the o-ring seal to be compressed
against the female fitting. The set of lines they sent me do not
have this reduced diameter step at the end of the line. Their tube
has the same outside diameter on both sides of the flange and
and there is no room for the o-ring. When I assemble the fittings,
the o-ring are getting into cut into little bits which will cause the fittings
to leak. They claim 100 percent accuracy, safety and fit.
They will not back up that claim. My lines were not made right,
They refuse to take them back, they said I am the only person in
years to complain about the poor quality of their work.
Although I am finding more people on the web that have issues with this
company everyday.
My fuel Lines are a fire hazard because of the damaged seals.
Their solution for my problem was to have me only hand tighten
The fittings so the o-rings don’t get cut and then put loctite
on the fittings so they won’t come loose.
Because of their arrogance, stupidity, rudeness, lack of customer service,
And overall negligence, I am out of two hundred and thirty dollars.

BUYER BEWARE

 

[wbrophy]

From looking at pic I would try a smaller "O.D." o-ring, that "may not" cut.

 

[turbotman]

Mine did not fit right either, and chewed up the stock size O-ring on every attempt to seal em up.
As has been suggested above, I went to a smaller O-ring and it worked just fine. Can't remember what size as this was two years ago, lucky for me that I have a ton of viton O-rings around the house ( I fix scuba gear on the side).
The new lines are not perfect , but can be made to work....with a bit of work.

 

[jim we fan]

I worked on it for over a week before I started to to make phone calls
to Inline. I tried thinner o-rings and different diameters. The smaller
o-rings only leave smaller pieces. Sometimes the outer edges will get
cut of, and the remaining o-rings looks like it might seal. other times
it will get cut completely through. The truck has eight o-ring connections
on it.
Right now I am starting to file all the complaints that I can.
I will also check to see if I can file a complaint with the National
Highway Traffic Safety Administration.

I will keep everyone updated as this plays out.