So I have a 85 Grand National hot air, I blew up the turbo it started smoking reality really bad. so its been sitting for about 3 years. I'm getting around to working on it, and I want to build it up. The engine has pretty low miles about 70,000 or so. I want to make it into a Mid 10's car or low 11's. Im not going to go with a factory turbo, im thinking on the lines of a 60MM and put it were the battery is and then just run custom piping to the intake and exhaust, and Intercool it with Alky. What is the difference between the 85 Engines and 86-87? Sorry if its a newbie post but just trying to get all my info upfront.
85 GN build up some questoins for you
- Thread starter kosonen04
- Start date
Jerryl
Tall Unvaccinated Chinese Guy
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2004
BIG differene between low 11's and mid 10's.
To run low 11's you will need supporting mods and a GREAT tune and run around +6000 rpm / +30 PSI boost on a HA set-up.
My opinion?
Easier to sell or convert to the IC'd set-up.
But before you do that or take my advice, do a LOT of reading.
BIG Goals = BIG Money
To run low 11's you will need supporting mods and a GREAT tune and run around +6000 rpm / +30 PSI boost on a HA set-up.
My opinion?
Easier to sell or convert to the IC'd set-up.
But before you do that or take my advice, do a LOT of reading.
BIG Goals = BIG Money
BRAD_PADGETT
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jan 22, 2004
The stock hot air stock pistons are not forged. Based on your goals you should convert to the 86/87 setup from the beginning along with a 109 block. Posting here will give you a much smaller audience. The General section will give you alot more traffic. Use the search function and do your homework. Good Luck. Brad
Jerryl
Tall Unvaccinated Chinese Guy
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2004
You big Meanie!
Let me attempt to provide some info in this thread.
If you swap to an intercooled set-up, you will not run mid 10's automatically.
Even 12's will not fall in your lap with an IC'd set-up.
And, "if/when" you get to the 10's, it will cost you a bit of money.
Not going to say "a lot" because that is relative.
Don't take this the wrong way, but based on the questions you are asking, I would suggest that the "easiest and simplest way" is to buy a car that has run mid 9's, detune it, and run your mid 10's goal.
If you choose the hard road you are in for a GREAT learning experience, both technical, resource management, and patience.
Just be sure to build a mid 9 second car to run the 10's, consistently.
As to your question; "How much boost can you run . . . "
Technically, as much as you want, as long as your set-up can handle it.
Whatever boost you run may last 2 seconds, or 10,000 runs down the track.
I am also not going to type another book on this conversion / mid 10's subject for two reasons;
1 - I have not run the number and have no desire to do so.
2 - Pretty much all the info is out on the boards, and on the net.
Best of luck with your project and let us know how you make out.
Thanks man. This isent my first time down the road. I just finshed up building a 11 sec SRT8. I say I want to run 10's but I would be happy with 11's. I know I cant just strap on a big turbo and go. I need the suporting mods. I already have the Walbro fuel pump, hotwired, acufab FPR, valve springs, Im just not sure how far these 85 Engines can be pushed. I know it would be EASYER to go out buy a 9 sec car, but when im at the track and they ask about the build, I have NO clue about it, or when they ask who did it. There is just somthing for me to be able to say " I DID".
Jerryl
Tall Unvaccinated Chinese Guy
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2004
There is a LOT of satisfaction you get out of "I build it", no doubt about that.
There is also a LOT of difference between an SRT and a little 231CI V6.
One thing is for certain; I sincerely admire your aspirations.
If you want to run mid 11's, you can do that in HA format.
Get a GREAT motor, GOOD heads, upgraded turbo, good gas, good headers/downpipe/exh, good scantool and GREAT tune, Alky Injection . . . and $5,000 of other mics stuff . . . . and you should be good.
There really isn't that much of a difference between the two designs except the SFI has a little more control of the fuel and timing. Your intake is better for sure and you have turbo options that I don't, but I'm working on a newer design that will help.:biggrin:
You big Meanie!
Let me attempt to provide some info in this thread.
If you swap to an intercooled set-up, you will not run mid 10's automatically.
Even 12's will not fall in your lap with an IC'd set-up.
And, "if/when" you get to the 10's, it will cost you a bit of money.
Not going to say "a lot" because that is relative.
Don't take this the wrong way, but based on the questions you are asking, I would suggest that the "easiest and simplest way" is to buy a car that has run mid 9's, detune it, and run your mid 10's goal.
If you choose the hard road you are in for a GREAT learning experience, both technical, resource management, and patience.
Just be sure to build a mid 9 second car to run the 10's, consistently.
As to your question; "How much boost can you run . . . "
Technically, as much as you want, as long as your set-up can handle it.
Whatever boost you run may last 2 seconds, or 10,000 runs down the track.
I am also not going to type another book on this conversion / mid 10's subject for two reasons;
1 - I have not run the number and have no desire to do so.
2 - Pretty much all the info is out on the boards, and on the net.
Best of luck with your project and let us know how you make out.
Yea Jerryl, I'm a real meany for sure.
LOLJerryl and I have combined our knowledge on an idea that may come to fruition soon, and several other have helped as well. As a group, if the HA guys and the C/T guys started talking more between each other I think it would benefit both groups a great deal. We both have limitations on what power level we can reach so with the combined knowledge of "the old guys" and the newer members we should be able to suprise the IC guys soon.
There is a LOT of satisfaction you get out of "I build it", no doubt about that.
There is also a LOT of difference between an SRT and a little 231CI V6.
One thing is for certain; I sincerely admire your aspirations.
If you want to run mid 11's, you can do that in HA format.
Get a GREAT motor, GOOD heads, upgraded turbo, good gas, good headers/downpipe/exh, good scantool and GREAT tune, Alky Injection . . . and $5,000 of other mics stuff . . . . and you should be good.
You're very right about satisfaction Jerryl, and there is a huge difference between an SRT and a Buick V6. The Buick engine is finniky to say the least. If you don't have a good machine shop that knows the engine and how to build it and keep it together, you'll just be beating yourself up when it blows up. (yes I do know how it feels when this happens)
As far as costs, I think I have ar least $5k in parts alone and not to mention the time I've spent working on the plan to get the set up I want.
