Twin Turbo Better On Engine Than Single?

[ESP Products]

The introductory price for the ESP Twin Turbo kit is $ 6,900.
The kit will include, but not limited to...

2 S&B Air Filters 2 Inlet aluminum tubes
2 T3/T4 turbos* 2 TiAL Wastegates
2 S.S. Headers (Dr/Pass)* 2 3" Downpipes*
2 Turbo Oil Feed & Return S.B. Hoses
1 Twin Turbo Intercooler kit 1 Accessory bracket
1 Belt Tensioner 1 Serpentine belt
and needed hoses and fittings
*All Exhaust components are ceramic coated.

Feel free to call with questions.
John @ ESP
610-970-8944

 

[boosted84]

Wouldnt two smaller turbos working harder to make boost heat the air charges up more, and with two exhaust housings under the hood make it hotter than one big turbo moving the air just wondering it just seenms like more heat from a twin setup

 

[ESP Products]

Wouldnt two smaller turbos working harder to make boost

No. The turbos are smaller and are designed to operate at peak efficiency. That target is number is 18psi. Where the large single turbo works better (efficient) at about 20-28 psi - the two smaller turbos work better at 10-22 psi. So the turbos are working no harder to make more power and are making that power sooner. The ESP Twin Turbo kit is able to support 800+ HP. To operate the kit on the street at 10-15 psi would not be "working harder", in regards to boost. Regarding heat - yes, there is more exhaust under the hood. That is why, as mentioned in our last post, all exhaust components are ceramic coated. All our kits have the headers, 3" downpipes, and both turbine housings coated. This feature greatly reduces any under hood temps.

Hope this helps.

 

[postal]

In my research I found / made a couple of observations on this subject.

Twins start to really shine for high power applications. One for instance is that small turbos are sized real close together. An example would be you might have 5 different turbos to cover a 400 to 600 hp range. So if you want to make 500hp you can really pick a dead on turbo for that application. A pair of these 500hp turbos would be dead on for a 1000hp twin set up ect... As you get into the heavy hitter turbos your choices are really limited because its such a small market. Do to this limited selection you can't really tweak the turbo sizing until you get the right combonation of spool and power. You just have to pick the closest one available and make it work. With some of the GT stuff and single turbo big boy classes this is not as big of a deal now because the selection of big turbos is better.

Another issue about a single is that the big boy turbos usually require big down pipes in the 4 and 5 inch range. In some applications its actually easier to run a pair of 3" down pipes than a single 4 or 5" one. Also sometimes a pair of twin headers is easier to get in a car than singles and a cross over pipe. ect..

I have two stage cars going together one will be twin turbo the other will be a smaller BIG turbo. The twin setup will go in the back halfed "Pro Street" car, and the big single will be in the more stock appearing car. Which in my mind is pretty much in line with my research.... Twins probably arent worth messing with unless you want to build an all out race car, or you're going for that all out race car look.

HTH: Jason

 

[Marc87GN]

http://www.espperformance.com/twins.html

I was reading on this websight the other day and it mentioned this twin turbo setup for the Grand National engine. It claims to generate 500hp while maintaining lower temperature and 10lbs of boost pressure in the cylinder walls. I'm no turbo expert but I would think that 10lbs of boost from one turbo or two wouldn't make any difference to your engine. Wouldn't one turbo at 20lbs of boost be the same as two turbos at 10lbs of boost each...or does air work differently when calculating that? I know the twins would spool up faster but would their actually be such a drop in total boost pressure and still maintain the horsepower?...or are they refering to each turbo running at 10lbs? I'm not trying to make any accusations against the company I'm just trying to gain some understanding. Thanks for any help in clearing up this confusion for me :biggrin:

Would this allow you to make more power on pump gas? I came from a Turbocharged 99 GT that had a T-76 for 3 years. The car ran very well(10.90s) on straight 93 octane, but having the 4.6 allowed it to spool by 3200 rpms. I would like similar power with the GN, but avoid running a turbo near that size on the GN and on the street because of the high stall that would be required. I think this might offer the best street setup without hurting driveability as much as running a large single on small displacement engine.

 

[ESP Products]

Yes. But as is human nature, you always want more. I would at least run alcohol. We ran our first Dyno session on 104 octane to be safe and we usually run 93-94 on the street. 10# of boost is fine on pump 93 octane and is resulting in 11.4's or better. 15# gets you to the 11.0s. I would always take the safer road and run octane or alcohol. The ESP Twin Turbo kit is designed to be driven on the street and be a mid-high 10 second car. As is human nature, we are now going for more power. Only the tire spin effects drive-ability.

Hope this helps.

 

[231V6]

Esp Tt Setup

(esp Products)-can You Post Actual Pics Of Your Tt Setup.
I Was Going To Buy The Atr Setup Before Went Belly Up.
Your System Sounds Nice, Especially At That Price But I Would Like To See What Im Thinking Of Buying.(the Pics On Your Web Site Dont Do Any Justice To What You Say They Look Like).
ALSO CAN OPTIONS BE HAD ON THE TURBOS ie. coolant lines. ceramic ball bearings, or different sizes in general.

 

[ESP Products]

At the moment those are the available photos. Other photos we have are of the prototype and are not what the current evolution looks like. The parts list:
2 S&B Air Filters 2 Inlet aluminum tubes
2 T3/T4 turbos* 2 TiAL Wastegates
2 S.S. Headers (Dr/Pass)* 2 3" Downpipes*
2 Turbo Oil Feed 2 Return S.B. Hoses
1 Twin Turbo Intercooler kit 1 Accessory bracket
1 Belt Tensioner 1 Serpentine belt
and needed hoses and fittings
*All Exhaust components are ceramic coated.
These items are mostly visible in the "Spy" photos without the ceramic coatings. Yes, there is flex in the kit. Most requests have been more for custom kits than the "kit". We can change the turbos, intercooler, and wastegates. If you go with a BB turbo that is liquid cooled; we will address that issue at that time. We are working on a 1,200 hp kit now that features such turbos.

Hope this helps.

 

[87buickracer]

esp twin turbo kit

This is good stuff!!!keep us informed john and keep up the good work..

 

[Rampage]

Personally, for the amount of cash you'd spend for a 2-turbo setup, I'd go with a single turbo, Better heads, throttle body, injectors and other toys...

 

[ESP Products]

Actually, if you calculate the cost on all the components you get in our ESP Twin Turbo kit and compare that to the same components of a single turbo kit, it's only $1,500 - $2,000 more. Now consider the drive-ability and the broader power range and other benefits. I said it before, you've got to drive it. If you do, you'll change your mind. Your more than welcome to check it out at our shop. It's a different sensation. BUT.... there's chocolate, vanilla, and strawberry, pick your taste.

Hope this helps you.

 

[blackstallion]

What about two stock turbos on the twin kit?Should spool quick I want to go twins wish i had the money for the kit .

 

[ESP Products]

Sure. We can customize the kit for almost any application. Matter of fact, we have a gentleman from Md. interested in our kit for his Prowler. Changing any part of the kit will change the general characteristics of the kit. We would simply need to make sure we adjust for that change. Also 2 stock turbos would provide less power than our ESP Twin Turbo kit currently offers, and I don't think it could spool too much quicker. Our soon to release 1,200 hp kit should spool as quick as the current 800 hp kit.

Hope this helps you.

 

[blackstallion]

But the stockers would spool quick though and have good power numbers right?I have two stock turbos ported that i want to use.Can i buy your headers seperate from the kit if so how much. :smile:

 

[Reggie West]

There are a few things here that need to be clarified.

Twins are overkill on most street set ups. You cant really use the amount of air being flowed through both turbos.

The ESP kit is nice but is expensive. For that kind of bank, I can build a stock motor with aluminum heads, one 66 dual bb turbo, matched injectors, a 9 inch converter and a FAST B2B computer.

I would make more horsepower at the same rpm levels, more torque too.

It has been proven many times on here that a single turbo can work well on these cars up to high 10s all day. And they are completely street worthy.

Twin turbo kits seem to work well on cars with little space under the hood. The LS1 cars, Vettes, GTOs, Camaros and Firebirds are using them but that has more to do with space under the hood.

 

[blackstallion]

It is pricey but i think being able to run 10 psi on pump gas and have mid 11 sec capability is great,running 15 psi and being able to run high tens even better mid 11's on 91octane quick spool,no high stall converter and less psi your motor will last longer.All the really fast cars use twins like whiteracings twin buick almost took out dan millen in his turboed stang.

 

[ESP Products]

I cannot agree with Reggie, but that's what keeps things interesting. The Twins would be a better street car than a large single turbo IMO. Again, I refer to things like lag, response, and such. I don't suggest stock turbos, kinda because of what Reggie said. The ESP Twin Turbo kit does cost money. To use stock turbos would lower the power output. If so, then why spend the money. Our current kit was designed for a street-able 10 second car that can reliably drive to the track and back. We did that with this kit. Now we are pushing a little harder. The thing is - when to stop. We don't want to cross over to Racecar, we want to stay streetcar.
As a note - I would never suggest lowering the octane number when making power.

Hope this helps.
Have a nice weekend.

 

[wild vr clubby]

hi im doin a twin lpg set up i have an australian holden vr commodore 3.8ltr ive been told stock it can handle 8psi. so if i want 8 psi what would i have to set each turbo to?

 

[ESP Products]

If your running external wastegates, simply set the wastegates at the lowest setting. ie. Run a hose directly from the turbo to the wastegate. Take it easy on the throttle and roll into the boost. Watch the gauge. Adjust as needed. We are running two TiAL wastegates at the factory setting (out of the box). I would guess they are set to 7-9 psi, regardless. With a manual boost valve installed, we just adjust the boost as we see fit. The "boost" is read at the intake and you really need to just drive the car; don't sweat the set-up. I hope I explained that OK.

Hope this helps you.

 

[BandAid]

If your running external wastegates, simply set the wastegates at the lowest setting. ie. Run a hose directly from the turbo to the wastegate. Take it easy on the throttle and roll into the boost. Watch the gauge. Adjust as needed. We are running two TiAL wastegates at the factory setting (out of the box). I would guess they are set to 7-9 psi, regardless. With a manual boost valve installed, we just adjust the boost as we see fit. The "boost" is read at the intake and you really need to just drive the car; don't sweat the set-up. I hope I explained that OK.

Hope this helps you.

Can you tell me the specs on the motor that you are using for your add of the Twins,is the motor stock,cam ,caps girdle...or is this a stock off the assembly line 3.8 motor,,,