Look at my mods and suggest a turbo

[tonysmach]

I have a Precision P trim 70 turbo with slow spool-up. Looking for a better street turbo. Don't really go to track but once a year. Yesterday dyno #s showed 427 RWHP and 457 RWT at 25 lbs. Seems like it should be higher. I need some tuning. I purchased car in August 2009 and the previous owner only had it for a short period and did not add much to it or know much about the car. It definately has Stock bottom end and I have no current plans of upgrading bottom end. The following list is what I know of for sure. So which turbo would give me better immediate response while maximizing the modifications of the car? I added a few pictures of my work over the winter so you can see what I am working with. Sorry for the long post but wanted to provide you guys with pertinent info so that you can provide me with good recommendations.

· Mild ported stock heads, decked (previously was O-ringed), valve job with new Manley big valves 177/150
· Mild ported intake with EGR block-off plate
· Flat Tappet stock Cam (not sure but believe it is stock)
· Ported Kenne Bell 70MM Throttlebody and Plenum
· RJC power plate
· MAF Translator
· LS1 3.5 inch MAF
· 3.5 inch MAF pipe - polished aluminum
· Innovate LC-1 Air/fuel gauge
· RJC “Bullet Proof” Head Gaskets
· RJC oversized oil pan
· 65lb Precision injectors
· 70 mm P-Trim Precision turbo
· Quad Air Volt Booster
· 10MM Magnecor spark plug wires with NGK UR5 gapped at 32
· Big-Mouth Cold air kit with K&N filter
· IAC Angle Boss
· GN1 Super Extreme Front Mount Intercooler
· Hot wired Walbro 340 fuel pump (that's what I was told but not sure)
· Precision Turbo Saver
· ATR headers
· 3” Stainless Steel downpipe with bung for Wide Band sensor
· 2.5" Stainless Steel exhaust, test pipe with Cutout and ATR Pitbull Mufflers
· Boost Commander - Bstc in-car boost controller w/ dual stock solenoids
· Razor’s Alky Control methanol injection
· TT 5.6 Alky Performance chip
· Liquid filled adjustable fuel pressure regulator & gauge
· Scanmaster 2.1
· Upgraded 200r4 Trans - not sure of stall but was told 3500 (probably more like 3000 - 3200)
· Art Carr Deep Trans pan
· 3.42 posi rear end

 

[Beamer]

A couple suggestions...

First, drop you plug gap to .028, you are probable blowing through what you have set up now.

It sound like you are definately needing a good solid tune. You have some very nice parts that should produce appreciative power. Very nice looking setup.

What type of WB #s have you been getting under WOT?

I would hang on to the turbo you have now and try to optimize your combo, just a suggestion.

Mike

 

[tonysmach]

I appreciate all suggestions. WB #s at WOT are 10.8 - 11.0

 

[tonysmach]

"First, drop you plug gap to .028, you are probable blowing through what you have set up now."

Could this be why the engine was stumbling at the high end of the RPM range when it was on the dyno yesterday?

 

[Boost231]

yes, very well could be.

 

[tonysmach]

Another question. With my set up, what is the maximum RPMs? My valve springs are 100 lbs.

 

[Beamer]

Your cam will probably stop making power around 5600-5800 RPMs, which your springs will not work past that most likely.

Most will shift around 5200-5400 RPM range.

It is most likely your plug gap that was causing your motor to stumble. Absolutely nothing wrong with the UR5, they are a great plug for our motors.

Let us know how it goes if you get back out to the dyno. As you will see in my sig, I have a tiny little PT54 turbo and similar other mods and I ran a 10.81 at 24#s boost with more in it if I had a better wastegate actuator. That time at 124.8MPH and weighing 3640 with me in the car, calculates to be between 550 to 575 HP at the wheels. I do have a roller cam, but that turbo really blows mine away... LOL, it blows ! ! ! Get it ?

Sorry, I thought it was a fun wordy situation.

Mike

 

[FLGN]

Depends mainly on the selected camshaft. If it is a stocker with good springs you are probably in the 5200 - 5500 range.

 

[tonysmach]

Thanks for the replies. Beamer, your car must be tuned very well to run 10.8. I do have aluminum bumper core and supports. I have a weigh ticket and the car weighs 3320 lbs. without me so would be about 3490 with me. I also forgot to add that the car has T&D 1.65 rocker arms. So you think with the right tune, I can make this P trim 70 turbo, streetable?

 

[Beamer]

That is a big turbo and will be streetable if you are willing to handle slower spool times. That turbo is not an easy one to get going, but once it is - look out. There are many out there running that turbo on the street, and many smaller and many larger also. The big question is how you want your power to be. There are bigger turbos that will spool faster due to having ball bearings to spin easier etc. This is what you have now, and you can spend lots and lots of money on anything for our cars. I was only suggesting that you try to get the car tuned better to feel what power you can before jumping into a different turbo.

You may want to think about a powerlogger. It allows you to connect to your ECM and record your parameters to optimize your tune even better. Back in November (the same day that I ran the 10.81), my first run off the trailer was a 11.47, with a base street tune. After looking at logs through several runs, I brought it down almost .7 seconds. It is a wonderful tool for us running stock systems.

Keep the ball rolling forward.

Mike

 

[street6]

Just curious what size converter you are running? do you know if it is a lock up unit? was it locked for the dyno?

I would not be too concerned with dyno numbers since the same car can run far different numbers on different dyno's. Unless your simply using hp numbers for a base tune.

What kind of timing? And I take it this was with pump gas and alky?

 

[87buickracer]

I have a Precision P trim 70 turbo with slow spool-up. Looking for a better street turbo. Don't really go to track but once a year. Yesterday dyno #s showed 427 RWHP and 457 RWT at 25 lbs. Seems like it should be higher. I need some tuning. I purchased car in August 2009 and the previous owner only had it for a short period and did not add much to it or know much about the car. It definately has Stock bottom end and I have no current plans of upgrading bottom end. The following list is what I know of for sure. So which turbo would give me better immediate response while maximizing the modifications of the car? I added a few pictures of my work over the winter so you can see what I am working with. Sorry for the long post but wanted to provide you guys with pertinent info so that you can provide me with good recommendations.

· Mild ported stock heads, decked (previously was O-ringed), valve job with new Manley big valves 177/150
· Mild ported intake with EGR block-off plate
· Flat Tappet stock Cam (not sure but believe it is stock)
· Ported Kenne Bell 70MM Throttlebody and Plenum
· RJC power plate
· MAF Translator
· LS1 3.5 inch MAF
· 3.5 inch MAF pipe - polished aluminum
· Innovate LC-1 Air/fuel gauge
· RJC “Bullet Proof” Head Gaskets
· RJC oversized oil pan
· 65lb Precision injectors
· 70 mm P-Trim Precision turbo
· Quad Air Volt Booster
· 10MM Magnecor spark plug wires with NGK UR5 gapped at 32
· Big-Mouth Cold air kit with K&N filter
· IAC Angle Boss
· GN1 Super Extreme Front Mount Intercooler
· Hot wired Walbro 340 fuel pump (that's what I was told but not sure)
· Precision Turbo Saver
· ATR headers
· 3” Stainless Steel downpipe with bung for Wide Band sensor
· 2.5" Stainless Steel exhaust, test pipe with Cutout and ATR Pitbull Mufflers
· Boost Commander - Bstc in-car boost controller w/ dual stock solenoids
· Razor’s Alky Control methanol injection
· TT 5.6 Alky Performance chip
· Liquid filled adjustable fuel pressure regulator & gauge
· Scanmaster 2.1
· Upgraded 200r4 Trans - not sure of stall but was told 3500 (probably more like 3000 - 3200)
· Art Carr Deep Trans pan
· 3.42 posi rear end

I would change cam or put roller rockers to get more lift out of cam..That is one area that's hurting your horse power numbers..with this combo I would run a roller cam set -up anywhere from a 206 to 212 roller cam...and replace used torque converter,as I'm sure you are loosing some power there..as for turbo a I would run a 66 or 67 with this combo..hth

 

[tonysmach]

Just curious what size converter you are running? do you know if it is a lock up unit? was it locked for the dyno?

I would not be too concerned with dyno numbers since the same car can run far different numbers on different dyno's. Unless your simply using hp numbers for a base tune.

What kind of timing? And I take it this was with pump gas and alky?

I was told converter is a lockup and a 3500 stall. Timing is 21/23 stated on TT chip. Yes 93 with Alky.

 

[tonysmach]

I would change cam or put roller rockers to get more lift out of cam..That is one area that's hurting your horse power numbers..with this combo I would run a roller cam set -up anywhere from a 206 to 212 roller cam...and replace used torque converter,as I'm sure you are loosing some power there..as for turbo a I would run a 66 or 67 with this combo..hth

Without built bottom end, do you think one of the new billet DBB 6765 or 6768 turbos is too much or not a good fit?

 

[jlat]

hello people; I know nothing about all that higher end hi po stuff but I heard a line whitch was (you build a motor for a turbo and not a turbo for the motor) if that means any thing. I would work with what you got and talk to some pro race people. Also did you mention what chip you got? I don't think I read that.
good luck
IBBY

 

[3.8L V-8 eater]

I have this same turbo and thought it did ok spoolin up...I bent a push rod tore the motor apart to find it had several issues. Once the motor goes back in it with a roller cam it should spool even better. Have you verified the converter is a 3500. I ask because mine did ok stalling at only 3000 with issues... What about your exhaust housing is it an .63 or .085??? The bigger the exhaust housing the slower the spool.

 

[tonysmach]

I have this same turbo and thought it did ok spoolin up...I bent a push rod tore the motor apart to find it had several issues. Once the motor goes back in it with a roller cam it should spool even better. Have you verified the converter is a 3500. I ask because mine did ok stalling at only 3000 with issues... What about your exhaust housing is it an .63 or .085??? The bigger the exhaust housing the slower the spool.

exhaust housing is .63. Not sure how to verify the stall on the converter. Do a brake torqueA?

 

[street6]

"I was told converter is a lockup and a 3500 stall. Timing is 21/23 stated on TT chip. Yes 93 with Alky."


where are the rpm's @ zero boost?.........hold the brakes tight or set the e-brake and slowly give er some gas while watching the boost gauge. when the boost gauge needle begins to move out of vac or starts to move toward boost pressure note the rpm's.

 

[Grumpy]

hello people; I know nothing about all that higher end hi po stuff but I heard a line whitch was (you build a motor for a turbo and not a turbo for the motor) if that means any thing. I would work with what you got and talk to some pro race people. Also did you mention what chip you got? I don't think I read that.
good luck
IBBY

not the way a lot want to think now.. Some want a good bottom end to take a beating. Stock stuff is getting old!!
....We run a close combo BUT we do have a 212/212 roller.. as far as RACE guys lots of them are not good on car manners on the street . Street stuff is a completely different game .. I want to jump in an GO !! Has to idle in traffic for a long time.
We have run both the 66 (low 10s) and 67 (high 9s) turbos in our street trim car... We like the 67 a little better

 

[jlat]

hello people; Hijack!!!! Grumpy lets here what combo you runnin. I want to be able to go when I want and also handle the traffic idling.
thanks
IBBY