Legalizing the Hybrid - California

[olds443]

Knock knock,,Gofstbuick are you in?

A couple of years ago, you offered to help me with my car when it came time to smog it. Well it is up and running and now the smog is due. I smogged it with the original engine before I pulled it because I knew I would need extra time to learn and get it running properly before smog.

In my area we have smog check II.

Car is an 84 Cutlass that originally came with a NA 3.8
Currently has a LC2

Where/how do I find a Referee station?
What all will they check there?
Will the computer need to be accessible?
Are the following parts legal?
K&N AIr Filter?
Billet adjustable fuel regulator?
Liquid intercooler?
Custom burnt chip? I have a new smog chip coming
Coolant lines blocked off from hard heater tube to
throttle body?
Other than that I know I need to remove the valve cover breathers and put on the stock parts.

Will they perform a smog test there? Or do they just check it out to make sure it is legal and correct then send you to a test facility?


Thanks for your time and help.

 

[olds443]

Oh, and will I need to remove the Alcohol injection system?

 

[gofstbuick]

email me tommorow. Referee telephone number is 1-800-622-7733. you must make an appointment. They will check everything on down to the prom id. alky okay, intercooler okay, fix the coolant lines, no k&n cone filter (without an executive order number), non adjustable FPR. You'll probably see the referee near old ARCO arena, in Sacramento.

 

[gndoug]

Just my .02, from another smog tech.

Appendix J - Under items of no concern. Non thermostatically controlled air intakes. Basically, as long as the car does not have a t.a.c., or the t.a.c. is not removed, any intake is legal w/o a carb e.o. #. As long as the applicable pcv and evap lines are hooked up. SO.... youll probably want to put the stock air box back in, for the oil breather.

 

[gofstbuick]

This should create some interesting debate, regarding appendix J. Since the PCV valve is in the intake floor, the breather assembly is attached to the inlet bell of the turbo, the oil cap is closed (no breather) and the dipstick and tube are in place, how does the stock air box have any affect on rest of the emission control systems? Technically, the only issue I see is the repositioning of the IAT sensor. Since ths system is sealed and the mixture is controlled by the MAF, then the only thing the stock air box does is draw air. And the MAF doesn't care it the air is dirty or clean, cause it is just measuring the air temp to determine a density. I know that the Referee will want to see the stock air box, but I still question the motive.

 

[olds443]

I love all this debate stuff! I would love to argue all the points if I was more knowledgeable on all the rules and stuff but I really just want it to smog for now. It would be cool to debate when I have more ammo, I am quite a smart a** myself.

Hey Joe, can you email me the # for the BAR again, I accidently delted the email.
I have some of the parts on order so I thought I would try to set something up soon.
Thanks again.
Jason

 

[TURBOELKY]

huh?

why dont you just take the thing to the smog place and smog it. I've never taken the elky to a refferee, just to the smog shop. They dont need to know what kind of engine you have in it, just that it passes smog

 

[olds443]

Well it "should" flag to the guy smogging it... missing air pump and all the other stuff that didn't come on the car. We have very strict Test only as well as "Smog Check II". Test Only is some BS the state has basically the older cars go through.
Pretty much all GNs in this area now get Test Only notices. Test Only is when you take the car to a special smog station that is not allowed to do repairs or make adjustments and they place it on their treadmill, hook it all up and do a visual check then see if you pass.
Smog Check II which Test Only is a part of is just very strict emissions standards including the treadmill.
I did think about taking it and trying to smog it but if the Test guy is doing his job (and he should be as most of the guys around here that perform the test also own the shop; why risk losing your livelihood?) then it would fail. Even if it passes everything else if it fails the visual you still don't get a smog cert.
My Girlfriends Z/28 had a loose gas filler and that was a fail due to the fact that it was a part of the fuel system that could leak into the atmosphere.

 

[gndoug]

Hey test only is not BS. Its good money

 

[olds443]

Hey test only is not BS. Its good money

You must know of Mike Cherry
Hey , do you do smogs too? I don't know which shop you work in.

 

[TURBOELKY]

drive

it to Los Angeles, and have a hole in the wall smog shop smog the car, they wont know what kind of engine it is.

 

[JSAautomotive]

GN doug.... some test and repair stations might disagree with you. BAR tells us test and repair shops we don't test cars as well as test only. Thus they have given away nearly all of our business. Originally BAR told us that test only would only get around 15% of the smog check business, now it's over 50%. And then you've got test only guys referring people to shops to get cats installed and then come back to re-test and by-passing the legal channels of test and repair. Were you at the BAR meeting in El Monte this past wed about the Evap testing they want to introduce?

More B.S. from the BAR that we get to endure.

 

[gofstbuick]

Were you at the BAR meeting in El Monte?

No, I heard about the EVAP meetings (and could not attend), but I recently took a promotion to DCA. So I'm now BAR outreach / public affairs coordinator.

 

[JSAautomotive]

I had to laugh at the meeting when the BAR engineer said, "we're going to handle the consumer education about the new EVAP program". When I got up to speak.... I asked, "If you guys think you're going to HANDLE the consumer education regarding the EVAP test, then you'd better backtrack and re-educated them regarding the difference between Test Only and Test and Repair.... because nobody seems to know the difference between the two".

I applied to work for BAR as a level II rep. Never got hired. I guess the interviewers didn't understand my response to what criteria was required for closed loop operation. And these are the guys in charge of smog check

 

[gofstbuick]

I applied to work for BAR as a level II rep. Never got hired. I guess the interviewers didn't understand my response to what criteria was required for closed loop operation. And these are the guys in charge of smog check

Do you know the way hiring for state service is conducted? Usually you have to be on a hiring list. Program Representative 2 is promotional, meaning you're required to be a current state employee, on the current list or able to lateral from a postition that is within 5% of your current state salary. Most recently, an announcement went out for Program Representative 1 (6-8 months ago). A test given on one weekend day ranked all candidates. Only those candidates within the first 3 ranks are eligible to be hired off the list and as those candidates are appointed, those in the lower ranks move up. But this is really off topic to the original post, so if you need additional information, please email or PM me a telephone number and we can talk about this further. Especially if you're still interested in an appointment to state service.

 

[gndoug]

I was thinking of going to the BAR meeting, and then thought.... I dont really care about it that much. It will however make for a lot more repairs. I work at a test and repair during the week, and at a test only on saturdays. So I understand both sides of it. Whenever I have someone fail, I just tell them to take it to a repair shop, but I dont refer them to any specefic one, not even to the shop I work at... which most people would say is stupid, but I believe in keeping the game fair.

 

[gndoug]

You must know of Mike Cherry
Hey , do you do smogs too? I don't know which shop you work in.

Jims automotive, Advanced smog.
Good old cherry pit... haha.

 

[olds443]

I was wondering can you take a car to get it pre-smogged without sending all the info to DMV / The state? Just thinking it would be nice to know if the car needed more work before it gets flagged. Not just the car in question but any car?

 

[JSAautomotive]

Yes.... They can run an official pre-test. The data still gets sent to the DMV's VID (Vehicle Identification Database), but you won't be flagged as a gross polluter, modified or missing componants, etc.

Then there's always the ASM test, which will give you loaded mode readings, but will not give you the allowable cut-points for emissions.

gofstbuick..... My mistake. It was a level I rep.

I'm currently going to be working as a part time instructor for the City of L.A. A buddy of mine that works for DWP put me in touch with their trainer that apparently has to travel quite a bit to teach computer controls, new diesel systems, and other various technologies. Says it's gotten too much for him, so they need someone else to split up the workload. I guess I'm glad I never got into BAR because I would have to committ suicide because of how screwed up the program is.

GNdoug??

Does Jim post on IATN?? (Internation Automotive Technicians Network). I seem to remember an Advanced Auto.

Regarding the Evap testing. I was suprised as others at the meeting that we will not be dynamically testing the evap systems on OBDI cars!!

The BAR wants to implement testing the hoses and system for leaks... but forget about if it can actually purge.

So.... thats another thing for the Buick guys to be aware of IF the BAR manages to get this next phase/addition through the beauracracy.

 

[olds443]

Firts off I want to Thank Joe (gofstbuick)!
I took the car today to the referee and it passed! I was prepared to fail, if not from the visual (which was as close as I could make it) but derinitely from the tailpipe.
I used a turbotweak chip and had an old 3" cat. I turned the fuel pressure down to approx. 33 psi and added 2 gallons of alky to 7 gallons of 91 Chevron.
This was to try and help compensate for the BLM's which I couldn't seem to get down. (Checked everything been thru it all, can't seem to find it; possibly the crossover but I replaced it yesterday with the Postons and I still have low vac )
Anyway, I had to take it in soon as I couldn't get another extension to try and sort it out any longer.
Here are the results;