Just don't get it!!!

[ski_dwn_it]

OK part 23 of the saga that is about to turn me against EFI setups.

Got the new DFI unit from Accel today in the mail. Upgraded to version 5.02. Uninstalled old version, and reinstalled on laptop. Went out and had the intention to start from scratch - however when I went to the wizard it said unable to open com port. WTF? Went to main screen and hit online to ECM, it connected right up. OK. Went back to wizard same thing....??

Figured I would just upload the sample v50 they have in there and go to configure and set it up for my setup...which I did.

Started up the car and it fired right off, and idled pretty decent. Code 46 came up - manifold temp sensor....what thought I shut that off as I do not run one of them. I went back in and infact it was off??? Thats strange....F8 to clear it and within a few seconds it pops back up. Tried several times turning it on and off and nothing......Went out and verified it was where I left it tucked neatly down in a compartment along the car, all taped off so it can't get crud in it.

Went to VE table and checked the map out, once it went into closed loop. Got idle corrected in about 3 tries to within 2% and it held pretty good. Car idled great.

Now for the next weird thing....Just below the VE map there is a series of readouts - scaled engine speed, map, base volume Effcy, target AF etc.
Then just down below that there are some more readouts - RPM, SPARK, MAP, ECT, A:F, 02 FBK
I quickly noticed that the RPM futhest down with blue boarder had a red box around it and the readings are VERY irratic, going negative then positive values are also WAY WAY out to lunch. Meanwhile the upper readout just below the VE is reading perfect. WTF"????? Starting to really get annoyed now, never had this problem before. Now it even get weirder, when I go back to the main screen, the one that is acting up on the VE table screen is reading perfectly. Go back into the VE table and it gets the red box and acts crazy....

Now for the real kicker.....try to datalog and NOTHING. Can't communicate with the ECM.......meanwhile on the main screens if you exit out your connected with no problems at all.

I am about 1 step away from pulling the entire system out of this thing - putting it on EBAY and cutting my losses.

Was there a NEW harness or repinning of the harness with the new version?

What has me scared is the MST sensor is faulting due to the reading being over 5volts - well in the manual it says that this can cause problems to the ECM. Before on my other ECM before the "fix" it never did this, and I did at one point try to use the MTS and forgot to switch it off and it did code, so I know it worked before properly.

Hate to sound like a RAGIN FOOL, but can someone shed some light on this......

For the record I spoke with the tech today and got the wire schematic for my crank trigger, MSD, etc, and after work tracked it all down.....everything is exactly as they say it should be.............

Thanks for the help..........Don't ya just love something that should be a simple thing to do, and have done it before on numerous cars - can be such a PITA nightmare....

 

[norbs]

OK, a few things to note, the ecm will not accept any changes on the control S screeen until you turn the power off for 20 secsonds then turn the ignition back on. You are setting things up and not doing this looks like. That is why your mst appears to be on when you shut if off. What is your voltage on the dfi screen when the igntion is on, and your trying to program? Is your battery in the trunk? The pinouts are the same.

We have to get to the bottom of this.......I think its a voltage drop problem to the ecu, you need 11.5 volts at least to the ecu during programming

 

[bobc455]

This sure still sounds like the problem I had when I first installed my SpeedPro onto my V8. The pickup wires were too near the coil, so electrical interference caused a really funny RPM signal back to the ECM. My engine showed 11000 RPM during cranking, so it dumped fuel in like crazy. I'm sure the RPM readings were exacerbated by the MSD. Somehow, the ECM was reading the electrical noise as extra revs.

For me, the cure was to relocate the coil away from the distributor. It was a stock HEI setup so I was amazed that it made a difference, but once I relocated the coil away from the distributor my system worked fine.

The only reason I bring this up again is it sounds like the exact same symptoms- crazy RPM readings and dumping fuel in the motor. Just something to think about again. Look at where/how the wires are routed.

-Bob C.

 

[ski_dwn_it]

OK, a few things to note, the ecm will not accept any changes on the control S screeen until you turn the power off for 20 secsonds then turn the ignition back on. You are setting things up and not doing this looks like. That is why your mst appears to be on when you shut if off. What is your voltage on the dfi screen when the igntion is on, and your trying to program? Is your battery in the trunk? The pinouts are the same.

We have to get to the bottom of this.......I think its a voltage drop problem to the ecu, you need 11.5 volts at least to the ecu during programming

Norb,

The voltage during programming is 11.9 on the screen. My battery is also the same when I check it with the volt meter. Battery is in trunk, 00 gage wire used to route it. Also tried the power down several times

Why would one RPM display be dead nuts on and the other be off? On the VE table screen it looks crazy, on the main screen same readout in lower left corner reads perfect. go to any secondary screen, crazy again.

I uninstalled the software last night and reinstalled it again.....waiting till little later to see if it helped before firing up the car and waking the entire neighborhood.

The crank trigger wires do route past the plug wires, but I really do not have any other choice....that is where the connector is I have to tie into. Also my harness wires do come pretty close to the alternator - was going to pop the alternator belt off and give it a try also to see if that helps.

However this does not explain why with the ignition on, motor off, the unit wll not enter into data log mode???????????? Says too many ECM errors like when you turn off the key and have the laptop on.....

Keep in mind fellas - my racing friends have a nickname for me: Schleprock

If there is 1 in 2million chance that I could get 2 boards defective - it will happen to me. Not saying that is the case, but if it were to happen - it would NOT surprise me. However I could buy lottery tickets from now till Hell freezes over and not even win 1 dollar.

 

[ski_dwn_it]

Loaded the software all over again.....still same thing.

RPMS in lower right still acting weird(only on secondary screens).......car NOT even running. Just with ignition on.

tried several times to send data to ECM - same results:code 46

Going to try to download software through their website and load it that way....maybe something is wrong with the program they sent me.....not holding my breath.

Even went as far as unpluggin my water pump fuse so now NOTHING in the car is running other than the DFI........

when i try to log it says too many errors.......

Only thing I can think of to do now is maybe run over to work and get my work laptop, much newer and give it a try....maybe this laptop is too slow???

 

[norbs]

If your voltage is all good, it has to be something else. I know you need a pretty fast laptop. Whats the specs on the one you were using? By the way if you don't have the MST hooked up your Tau table won't work, so i would use it. :frown:

 

[ski_dwn_it]

If your voltage is all good, it has to be something else. I know you need a pretty fast laptop. Whats the specs on the one you were using? By the way if you don't have the MST hooked up your Tau table won't work, so i would use it. :frown:

Norbs.

Well been out there for the last several hours...

Got rid of the code 46 by putting the sensor on the wire. Now before you think I am an idot, before I never had it on there and it never coded?? Had it disabled in the config screen. Seems like to me that the switch is NOT working in on the system. Since even with it off, it still is reading. Before it was always defaulted to 100 I believe when disabled.

Also there still remains the problem with the loggin. Can't figure it out.

Tried my work laptop which is about as good as they come....same thing. not computer related.

Verified once again the supply voltage off the pink ingition power is exactly what the battery is....

Just don't get it.....gonna take the car out for a ride shortly - probably get stranded, and if I do there will be a potential low 10sec vette going up for sale if anyone is interested.

 

[aDFIguy]

Open the software, connect to the ECM with Key on, engine off.

Go to the Help menu and select "about..."

What version of CalMap and ECM are listed on the bottom right of the screen?

If it says the ecm is version 4.0, then you'll need to send it back to be updated PROPERLY .

By the way, do you have a Pro or Standard key -- a dongle that connects to your USB or parallel port on your computer? The newer version of the software looks for the key to be present alot more than the older versions. That could explain the datalogging thing. You may not have needed it for the older version(s) of the software.

Try using your older software -- it should still communicate just fine with the newer ECM as long as it's version 3.0 or higher.

I think the MST sensor thing is just a bug in the software...

 

[ski_dwn_it]

Well DFIguy is dead on! version 5.02 calmap and version 4.0 ECM

Well that was only another f-in 6 hours trying to figure that one out.....I AM DONE! All I can say is someone is gettin an earful Monday morning.

DFI, I am VERY thankful for your help - maybe I should just send it to your attention and perhaps it might get done right.

Tried the 4.02 and it would not work either in log mode....I start to get a red line (rpm) on the bottom of the screen, flatline and it then says too many errors?????????? Thing used to log perfect, never lost communication etc. Both versions also get the flakey rpm in the lower left corner readout...other one reads perfect.

Shut down everything, closed the garage door and am going to forget about it till tomorrow night when I pull out the ECM to package it back up. Nother weekend shot, suppose I might get it right about November when the first snowflakes start to fly.......ALL SUMMER LONG ON THIS....MY PATIENTS HAVE BEEN SPENT.

Could have bought another unit by now with all the money I have spent on this ordeal. Guess thats why they call me SCHLEPROCK :redface:

PS: I am using a pro-key plugged right into the printer port, worked perfect before, still have access to all the tables with both versions now.....

Open to ideas, suggestions, and recommondations on nerve pills.

Thanks all that offered help!

 

[aDFIguy]

DO NOT run the car on that ECM.

Don't waste any more time trying to debug it, just send it back in.

F'ING RIDICULOUS. $^%#&$@%$!!!!

Sorry.

 

[norbs]

Hopefully SKi gets a good ecm this time, or a nervous breakdown. I was just out tuning, no com errors and car runs good, since i am using the MST now and limited the closed loop correction off idle to about 5%, any more and it seems to over correct, and hesitiates. And if anyone is listening at DFI you should be able to log afterstart enrichment and coolant temp enrichment and est intake port temperature. Without logging those things i have to watch the control v screen and see how the car runs, makes it harder to tune. Those variables should be included in the logging , even the new datalogger doesnt; have it. So i am not buying one, just yet anyway

 

[ski_dwn_it]

DO NOT run the car on that ECM.

Don't waste any more time trying to debug it, just send it back in.

F'ING RIDICULOUS. $^%#&$@%$!!!!

Sorry.

No need for you to appologize....I appreciate your input otherwise I suspect that I would be regarded as an idiot next time I call in with more complaints on a new ECM.

Goin racing tomorrow with the carb car -67 chevelle. Thank got I can get my "fix" there, otherwise Norbs is right - I probably would be having a nervous breakdown. Wifey (pregenant w/ twins) said if they don't get it right this time (she's sick of my grumping around here) shes come'in out in person with it to take care of it. All 120lbs of p-issed off pregnant women someone is have to deal with

Any chance DFI you can "dog" this thing through the process for me to make sure its right this time??? If not I understand, I know there may be conflicts.....appreciate your help, otherwise I would be tearing apart the wiring or something thinking it was on my end still......

Again thanks you can shoot me an email if you like with any suggestions.