Interesting article about zinc additives in engine oil.....more to the story

[turbodave231]

I read this article today and learned a little bit more about engine oil. The article comes from Engine Professional Magazine. The article now makes me question the ZDDP additives I have been using and the detergent content of the oil.

Dave

 

[kidglok]

So what did they say?

 

[Chrisk]

Check this site out. Good info about oil and additives.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php

 

[novaderrik]

I read this article today and learned a little bit more about engine oil. The article comes from Engine Professional Magazine. The article now makes me question the ZDDP additives I have been using and the detergent content of the oil.

Dave

that's not an article- that's an advertisement for Joe Gibbs Racing Oil... even if everything said was true, that's hardly an impartial source..

 

[BILL HAINES]

SO CALL THE OIL SUPPLIER AND ASK THEM WHAT THEY RECOMMEND FOR MY CAR? THIS RESEARCH HAS ALREADY BEEN COMPLETED. ZDDP PLUS IS THE ANSWER. HOPEFULLY RICHARD WILL READ THIS POST AND CHIME IN. MY PROBLEM IS YOU CALL THE OIL SUPPLIER, A YOUNG MIN WAGE DUDE (NO OFENCE ) ANSWERS THE PHONE AND SAYS YES JUST USE "WEEZLE PISSS' IT WILL BE FINE.. JUST SAYING....

 

[kidglok]

So what did they say?

sorry i could not see the attachment on the mobile app

 

[QwuickTurbo6]

I hate these oil articles. I've taken some higher level chemistry courses and the lack of detail, information, and wrong terminology in all these articles drives me crazy

 

[CGASTON]

I read this article today and learned a little bit more about engine oil. The article comes from Engine Professional Magazine. The article now makes me question the ZDDP additives I have been using and the detergent content of the oil.

Dave

Dave,

Where can I get that article or subscription. I would really like to read that.

Sent from my iPhone using Turbo Buick

 

[turbodave231]

Where can I get that article or subscription. I would really like to read that.

http://www.aera.org/ep/index.html

 

[novaderrik]

I hate these oil articles. I've taken some higher level chemistry courses and the lack of detail, information, and wrong terminology in all these articles drives me crazy

like i said, this wasn't an "article".. it was a 2 page ad for Joe Gibbs Racing Oil..

 

[turbodave231]

I am no chemist, but what I found most interesting: The article says that the detergents in the oil compete with the zinc additives. The zinc additives may not be as effective as you think (or need) if you choose an oil with high levels of detergents. So what I'm really wondering about, is the oil I'm using WITH the ZDDP I'm adding.

 

[TURBOPOWERED68]

that's not an article- that's an advertisement for Joe Gibbs Racing Oil... even if everything said was true, that's hardly an impartial source..

like i said, this wasn't an "article".. it was a 2 page ad for Joe Gibbs Racing Oil..

Did you say something??



J/K

 

[forzfed]

I hate these oil articles. I've taken some higher level chemistry courses and the lack of detail, information, and wrong terminology in all these articles drives me crazy

I'm no chemist but I have worked with chemicals and have a little bit of understanding. Passivation is an anionic process, and is much stronger than a cationic protective film. Then there is precipitation, adsorption, and oxidation, ie. magnetite film.

Could you point out the errors? I just woke up and skimmed the article.

 

[QwuickTurbo6]

I am no chemist, but what I found most interesting: The article says that the detergents in the oil compete with the zinc additives. The zinc additives may not be as effective as you think (or need) if you choose an oil with high levels of detergents. So what I'm really wondering about, is the oil I'm using WITH the ZDDP I'm adding.

I think it may be the other way around. The detergents compete for the same sites ZZDP molecules act on. If your valavetrain needs ZDDP, you will need to add more ZDDP in oils with high detergent content to try and overcome the antagonism

 

[1KWIKSIX]

From what I understand, the ZDDP levels quickly get depleted over the first 1,000 mi + of running. This is why it is crucial to ensure the proper ZDDP levels are in the oil during your oil change to begin with.
Different engine oils contain varying levels of this.
I run a flat tappet cam, so I run 1/2 bottle of ZDDP with my oil change (using Brad Penn)....however other oils that do not contain much ZDDP may require a full bottle of the additive at your oil change.
Since our turbo engines tend to contaminate the oil rather quickly (vs NA engines), it's a very good idea to change the oil much more frequently anyways.

 

[Ttype6]

I am no chemist, but what I found most interesting: The article says that the detergents in the oil compete with the zinc additives. The zinc additives may not be as effective as you think (or need) if you choose an oil with high levels of detergents. So what I'm really wondering about, is the oil I'm using WITH the ZDDP I'm adding.

This is old news,but needs to be reiterated. Stop adding ZDDP additives. Let the refineries blend the oil. Thanks for posting this.

 

[QwuickTurbo6]

I'm no chemist but I have worked with chemicals and have a little bit of understanding. Passivation is an anionic process, and is much stronger than a cationic protective film. Then there is precipitation, adsorption, and oxidation, ie. magnetite film.

Could you point out the errors? I just woke up and skimmed the article.

I believe ZDDP molecules have their own unique mechanism that is unlike passivation. My focus is on organic, medicinal, and pharmaceutical chemistry, so I'd like to see more info like structures, mechanisms, SAR's etc. I'm not claiming to be an expert on ZDDP at all, but calling any compound that contains zinc atoms "zinc" makes me cringe and assigning general sweeping properties to "zinc" is clumsy at best

 

[forzfed]

I believe ZDDP molecules have their own unique mechanism that is unlike passivation. My focus is on organic, medicinal, and pharmaceutical chemistry, so I'd like to see more info like structures, mechanisms, SAR's etc. I'm not claiming to be an expert on ZDDP at all, but calling any compound that contains zinc atoms "zinc" makes me cringe and assigning general sweeping properties to "zinc" is clumsy at best

They are basically generalizing. I could see excessive residual causing problems at higher temperature and pressures, basically hideout. People always think, well if a little is good more is even better.

 

[SCOOBY DOO]

ZDDP

 

[L8TRH8R]

Joe Gibbs HR-3 in my car, great product, little spendy, but, so are additives.