Ideal cooling system setup question.

Ideal meaning whatever components you think is ideal to maintain ideal temperatures for the coolant, trans, & oil in these street driven cars.
In case it changes any opinions....Assume FMIC & working A/C.
 
I have a $500 alum radiator in my GN and a $78 fbody radiator in my T. Both work. The GN runs 155-160* on the interstate and 178 max after 10 minutes in 95F heat in a drivethru and city traffic with A/C on. Stock fan. The fbody hit 180F cruising around in some traffic, haven't spent much time behind the wheel of it yet but it seems like it should last a couple years.
 
TurboTnZ06 said:
I have a $500 alum radiator in my GN and a $78 fbody radiator in my T. Both work. The GN runs 155-160* on the interstate and 178 max after 10 minutes in 95F heat in a drivethru and city traffic with A/C on. Stock fan. The fbody hit 180F cruising around in some traffic, haven't spent much time behind the wheel of it yet but it seems like it should last a couple years.
Click to expand...
Are you running internal or external trans & oil coolers in the GN?
It would be interesting to know the trans temp at the same time.
 
NEVER ENOUGH said:
Are you running internal or external trans & oil coolers in the GN?
It would be interesting to know the trans temp at the same time.
Click to expand...

I don't know the trans temp.

GN- I run an external only tranny cooler. I used the factory oil cooler lines into the alum radiator's built-in oil cooler.

T- no oil cooler, bar and plate tranny cooler. I don't use the fbody radiator's built-in tranny cooler.
 
I have to admit. This is confusing.
So if I ran an all aluminum radiator it seems if I run internal coolers all I do is add heat to the coolant and isn't sufficient for the trans anyway. And if I run external coolers it's not enough cooling (ideally).
So run both internal and external? If so, run the fluids through which first?
I am most likely going to run a P/S cooler too.
Now I'm also wondering where the heck all these externals are going to fit (and look like they belong) and even more so if each of them needs it's own fan if they can't be in there own "cool" air stream.
 
I'd just drop in on you as usual, but this dam cold weather keeps the doors closed.;)

I'm thinking I need to build my own setup. Anyone local into aluminum tubing. :D
 
If you aren't running a 9" converter and your coolant temp is following your thermostat, an internal cooler is sufficient on it's own. All the talk about heating the coolant too much is BS. A quality radiator and fans will shed more than enough heat to keep it all at your thermostat's rating. PTS xtreme's aluminum rad. actually has a bigger than stock internal cooler, gotta stretch a few lines but it's mostly drop in. If you ARE running a 9" converter, especially a non lock, i'd consider an external cooler WITH the internal in series. If you do stoplight to stoplight action, the biggest external cooler in the world won't see enough air to overcome a loose converter. Even one with a fan would be marginal.

But hey, what do transmission guys know? Nothing, apparently. :rolleyes:
 
INEEDAGN said:
If you aren't running a 9" converter and your coolant temp is following your thermostat, an internal cooler is sufficient on it's own. All the talk about heating the coolant too much is BS. A quality radiator and fans will shed more than enough heat to keep it all at your thermostat's rating. PTS xtreme's aluminum rad. actually has a bigger than stock internal cooler, gotta stretch a few lines but it's mostly drop in. If you ARE running a 9" converter, especially a non lock, i'd consider an external cooler WITH the internal in series. If you do stoplight to stoplight action, the biggest external cooler in the world won't see enough air to overcome a loose converter. Even one with a fan would be marginal.

But hey, what do transmission guys know? Nothing, apparently. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

You know exactly whats going on. Very well said. Thank you!
 
Yes 9.5 here nlu.
I'll look around for something that catches my eye in aluminum with internals with -AN and dual Spals and try to figure out where all the externals could fit.

Any thoughts on the deep trans pans with "cooling tubes" running through? Added benefit or just a gimmick?
 
Oh and if they are put in series, which should the "hot" fluid hit first, the external or the internal? Do you think it matters?
 
As far as "all the externals" goes I would not worry about an air/oil cooler if there's one in the radiator. Also the PS cooler idea is excessive unless you plan to road race it or something.

Which way to route the fluid? I've heard both sides of that story, but since I have never bothered to test THAT aspect of it, i can't comment on it. Any difference is likely trivial. I do know that any cooler works most efficiently when the fluid runs upward through it. This guarantees that no air is trapped in it and it fills all the way with fluid, maximizing surface area and therefore heat transfer. And yes I know that radiators get the hot coolant in the top and sucked out the bottom, but it's apples to oranges since the coolant is sucked out of the rad. and is not pushed through it with lots of PSI. Stay away from the tube and fin style $35 parts store special coolers. They won't make enough difference to justify the extra plumbing. Get a good "plate style" cooler such as a B&M supercooler or a long manufacturing brand, others have similar designs and are probably as good. Look at the images before buying. Another benefit of the plate style is that they resist stone chips and bird strikes, etc. better. If you DO run an external oil or PS cooler make sure it has big enough fittings and hoses and doesn't choke the system, IE most trans coolers will not work for oil coolers, the hoses are too small.

hope this helps
 
Boost231 said:
red, is this the same one bruce sales?

http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/ad...radiators-all-aluminum-bolt-replacements.html

If so i love this cooler. Car never goes above 180 even in arizona heat.

Also for the ideal cooling system.

Alum Rad. like listed above, with ramchargers dual fans

Then i have a external B&M cooler with fan for the trans. Running a N/L converter and works great.
Click to expand...

Bruce did a great job with the radiator. He really knows turbo Buicks and has been a huge asset to our community :cool:
 
BTW, my car had a PTE front mount. I would drive the car around on a regular basis in 90-100 degree temperatures and even sit in bumper to bumper traffic. NEVER over heated. I also had a trans brake and it never got hot either. You don't want your oil too cold either, everything should be at operating temperature.
 
I'd like to hear some feedback about not running the oil cooler at all and just using the internal tranny cooler like more people do with the f-bod radiator. How will that affect temps and is the oil cooler (internal or external) really necessary or just a good idea?
 
I have a f body rad with no oil cooler. My oil gets too hot for my liking. IMO oil and trans should follow the coolant temp. I plan to make the plunge into one of the higher end aluminum ones come spring.

The big problem is the trans. Like already mentioned, the smaller non locking converters are heat makers from hell. Hard to keep cool on the streets.

Funny thing is, I don't think half the people in this thread even know what their oil & trans temp is. :eek:
 
Truthfully there needs to be a lengthy tech article written about trans coolers. There's good reason for debate: Half the builders out there will tell you to put an external only on it. They are not crazy or stupid for doing so, they are simply choosing the lesser of two evils. THEY don't know what's in your internal cooler, or if anyone local can flush it, or if the customer would be too lazy to remove the radiator and take it somewhere to be flushed. They also don't know what your coolant temp is, or if it runs away from the thermostat in traffic, or if the radiator is old and gunked up around the cooler, etc. A brand new external certainly removes most of their doubts and is adequate for most applications. A trans cooler would have to be REALLY bad for it to not get the trans out of warranty. Fluid life is greatly shortened as it gets progressively hotter, but even at say 220 degrees, it'd take a few thousand miles for it to lose it's lubricating properties and eat bushings. BUT, fluid at 170 or so can protect highly stressed clutches better by carrying heat away from them more effectively than fluid at 200 plus. So a trans that's coupling 300 crank HP may live while running warmer than ideal, but put it behind 500+ crank hp and the clutches are more likely to burn and cone. It's the same scenario as the rest of the car: As it gets more powerful and farther away from its intended design and usage, you have to be more and more concerned with the details, to keep it together. The edge gets a lot sharper and steeper, and easier to fall off.

I should start the rough draft sometime. I'd post it for the experts to dissect, and then edit accordingly. Put it up as an archive post and be done with it. There's probably little debate between them when all scenarios are considered. But there's no doubt that both designs have drawbacks, and the ideal route is influenced by several factors that need to be considered in every case.
 
If someone created such an article. I'd read it.:D

Request - Include flow charts of the plumbing with int & ext coolers and recommended sizes please.;)


I think Rick has convinced me to install a trans temp gauge so I can post in this thread. J/K:wink:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

T
  • Locked
  • Sticky
TSM 2024 Official Rules
Replies
0
Views
670
Tweeked6
T
B
New guy, Help me spec my resto build!
2 3
Replies
42
Views
4K
BagliviNY
B
L
86 GN Roller fs
Replies
9
Views
4K
ladodgers8
L
WE4TP
FOR SALE: 1987 Buick Turbo-T WE4/WO2 $60,000 Package Deal
Replies
0
Views
2K
WE4TP
WE4TP
1000MileStylez
1986 Buick Regal Street car
Replies
1
Views
2K
jay dcpt
J
Top