Have you gone Roller?

[Amelio]

Well here we go again.....

I got the sputtering and popping fixed along with the overbossting issue, I put a new crank sensor on and I also swapped out my GEN2 colipack and module for a stock one I had laying around. I am unsure which fixed the car because I did not put the GEN2 pack back on it.

Anyway After I put those two parts on I cranked up the car for a test drive, right away I had a pretty loud top engine knock. I was pretty sure it was just a collasped lifter. I got the car up to temp and drove it in the neiborhood and though the lifter would pump up....IT did not. I got back to the house and immediately though the cam was wiped

After about ten minutes of sitting I wanted to hear the noise again to see if I cpould determine which side it was coming from. When I cranked the car back up it was quite So I thought sweet it was just a lifter.

The next morning I went to go drive the car and see how it was running, it seemed to pull good on a low 10psi but tehn I started to get a loud knockiing again the same as the day before, I drove the car about 10 miles and brough it back home and the noise never went away.

I have a hard time beleiving I possibly bent a pushrod or wipped a cam but that is what is sounds like, it could still be a bad lifter but I ran out of time and did not pull the valve covers.

I also noticed a faint ticking in the very front of the car which leads me to think there may be a timing chain / gear issue.

Now I am going to have to wait until the weekend to pull the covers and see what the problem is. If the cam is wiped I was think of a Roller but I do not think my wallet can handle it right now.

I also drove my vette Saturday and broke the rear end on a hole shot those 325/50/15 MT drag radilas are bad a**! Rough weekend I though I had one car fixed and broke the other:frown:

Any way since I now have two broken cars I have to figuer which is going to be the easiest and least exspensive to fix?

What is the average cost for a roller cam set up? When I was building this engine 5 years ago it was like $800 just for the cam and lifters. I know I still need to change springs so I was wondering who has done a swap and what was the total cost?

Also if anyone could chime in on a roller they would recommend for my set up....mods are in my sig.....



Thanks

 

[gossamer]

As far as cost, $800.00 is about right for a complete roller set up. With your combination, I would go with the same cam I'm running. It's a Competition Cams part # 69-300-8. The part # for the kit is K69-300-8

 

[Amelio]

As far as cost, $800.00 is about right for a complete roller set up. With your combination, I would go with the same cam I'm running. It's a Competition Cams part # 69-300-8. The part # for the kit is K69-300-8

Was that with springs and a new timing set too? I am not 100% sure the cam is wipped out but from the sound of the lifter clacking it can't be much else?

I was figurenig about $1,000 after all gasketsand everything complete....

If that is the case I don't have the extra cash for that now, I would like to go roller being this i the second cam in this car.

Did you start with a roller or did you make the change?

If you changed just the cam how were your results?

 

[gossamer]

Hopefully you just have a piece of crap stuck in the lifter or something simple like that. You'll have to pull the intake and take a look. That cam kit does come with a timing set, but it is a stock replacement type. Go with a double roller if you do this. With gaskets and all, about $900.00 - $1,000.00 sounds right. I did run a Kenne-Bell flat tappet a while back, but that was on a different set up. This engine was full roller from the start.

 

[SPOOLFOOL2]

I'm going through the same thing.

First thing you want to do is drain the oil, and cut open the filter. If you wiped a lobe, you'll have lots of metal in your motor. If you've got a magnetic drain plug, it'll be covered in metal. If this is the case, you need to completly tear the thing down and clean it out. If it's just a sticking lifter, you could try some Marvel's mystery oil to "try" and unstick it, or just do a roller package. I got mine from Jack Cotton. I feel your pain...

Good luck.
Mike

 

[Amelio]

Yeah unfortunately I have to wait until the weekend to do any investigating, I don't get home until about 9:30 which kills me because I am really curious as to what the problem is.

I really do hope it is a bad lifter or rocker arm issue, I have had two cams go in this car before and yes it did take out the bottom end bearings and wiped out my brand new turbo ( that was before I bought a turbo saver)

One cam I had wiped on break in that really sucked.....I pulled the dipstick and most of the time the oil will be mettalic because cam metal is usually very fine....welll it seemed to have no metal but I know that is not a %100 check.


I wanted to go roller when I built this engine but just did not have the extra $$$$ for it.

I was looking at some rollers and was thinking about the comp 212/212 this may be a good cam for my set up. I did some searching and I have seen a couple different responses about the rockers?????

Would a stocker rocker assembly work with this cam? Would I also have to change the springs or do they come in the kit? If I can get away without having to buy new rockers or springs and keep the price right at or just under a $1,000 I may just park the car and save up some cash.

 

[Tom Tom Turbo]

if you have the luxury of time.....watch the board and see if you can find a used setup. I managed to score a Comp 206/206 billet roller, brand new lifters, pushrods, and T&D roller rockers for under $600 and they only had about 200 miles and a few passes on them.

You will love the power, throttle response, etc of the roller setup, but they are a little noisey, until you get used to them. For the first few hundred miles, I thought there was a problem....but after 3 or 4 people convinced me that's how they sound, I was okay with it.

 

[Amelio]

if you have the luxury of time.....watch the board and see if you can find a used setup. I managed to score a Comp 206/206 billet roller, brand new lifters, pushrods, and T&D roller rockers for under $600 and they only had about 200 miles and a few passes on them.

You will love the power, throttle response, etc of the roller setup, but they are a little noisey, until you get used to them. For the first few hundred miles, I thought there was a problem....but after 3 or 4 people convinced me that's how they sound, I was okay with it.

Thanks for the advice I have never really considered a used cam set up but then again I hve never used a roller cam either. I need to do a little more research to find out what the best cam for my set up would be. It seems like a lot of guys are using your cam the 206/206 I do not want to put in too large of a cam or too small so I need to research rollers a bit more but I will watch the board....Thanks

 

[SouthernCal GN]

if you have the luxury of time.....watch the board and see if you can find a used setup. I managed to score a Comp 206/206 billet roller, brand new lifters, pushrods, and T&D roller rockers for under $600 and they only had about 200 miles and a few passes on them.

You will love the power, throttle response, etc of the roller setup, but they are a little noisey, until you get used to them. For the first few hundred miles, I thought there was a problem....but after 3 or 4 people convinced me that's how they sound, I was okay with it.

+1!! My setup was about $450 for an Anderson 214/214 roller setup.

Looking at your sigg- is your cam really 223/223

 

[forcedfedv6]

Thanks for the advice I have never really considered a used cam set up but then again I hve never used a roller cam either. I need to do a little more research to find out what the best cam for my set up would be. It seems like a lot of guys are using your cam the 206/206 I do not want to put in too large of a cam or too small so I need to research rollers a bit more but I will watch the board....Thanks

Dude your cam is way to big for your setup, it is causing the lifters to collapse or floating the valves and that could be the interminent Noise you are hearing, i had the same problem a long time ago when I did a motor with a huge cam that the top end couldn't handle, throw in anything between a 206 to a 214 cam and you will not have any more problems, what where you thinking when you put in a cam that huge on a TB car!!! , turbo buicks dont need huge cams, that is why they are called forced fed engines, we have a turbo to push the air through the valves no matter how small they are given that a little porting would help things a whole bunch, that is why you see many stock cars running in the 11's with stock cams and stock heads. .

 

[Amelio]

Dude your cam is way to big for your setup, it is causing the lifters to collapse or floating the valves and that could be the interminent Noise you are hearing, i had the same problem a long time ago when I did a motor with a huge cam that the top end couldn't handle, throw in anything between a 206 to a 214 cam and you will not have any more problems, what where you thinking when you put in a cam that huge on a TB car!!! , turbo buicks dont need huge cams, that is why they are called forced fed engines, we have a turbo to push the air through the valves no matter how small they are given that a little porting would help things a whole bunch, that is why you see many stock cars running in the 11's with stock cams and stock heads. .

LOL....funny that you ask what was I thinking.....LMAO

well back when I built this engine I pretty much bought everything a local very well known GN guru told me to buy ( I know my own mistake for trusting...) well at the time I had a lot of money and little knowledge of these TB set ups.

I understand very much how turbos work and engines in general I have a very large cam in a small block Vette I have but it is an N/A engine. At the time I thought this cam was TOO LARGE but I thought the Guru new more than me so I did not research it and I took his word.

The car does make great power (it has been on a dyno) but it has eaten a few cams. Out of all the people that I have showed thses specs to you are the only one to say that it is too big. In a way I do agree but the cars preformance does the talking:biggrin:

I do not know your expserience and you may be correct 100% but I would like to hear from some one else if they think it it too much cam.

If in fact my cam is wiped I will need to research more on roller sizes and if I can not afford a roller then which flat tappet to go with.

I do appreciate the advice and no offence to you but I would like to hear from other people that have been through this and know for a fact that the cam has too much duration.

Thank you

 

[forcedfedv6]

You must have no vacumm at Idle whatsoever with that huge cam. LOL I dont see anything about bigger head valves on your setup if that is the case then trust me, your cam my friend, is way too big, another thing to ponder is that once you go over 520 lift on any cam, the stock ECU has a hard time keeping up with the flow at idle and the car will hardly idle or idle very very rough most of us keep the lift on cams for our cars under 500 , also if you keep whipping cams lobes ethier the spring pressure for your valves is set too high or you have an oiling problem..

 

[Amelio]

My vacum is actually pretty good I do have a vacum brake setup on the car....I got tired of replacing brake accumulators....LOL

The cam only has 502 inches of lift I have seen most rollers be more than that but with less duration.

The first cam that wiped happend because I put on fresh springs....that led to a rebuild

The second cam that wipped happed on break in, not sure but I think it was oil starved...I had to rebuil the engine again and this time I went to a high volume front cover and pump. That was about 5 years ago and I have not had a problem until now?

 

[psycho6cyl]

I just did a roller cam package from Cottons.. The whole kit was 800 bucks I believe.. On his site it says it comes w everything from dbl roller chain to valve hp springs.. Im gettin it tomm and ill let you know how she looks...

 

[Amelio]

I just did a roller cam package from Cottons.. The whole kit was 800 bucks I believe.. On his site it says it comes w everything from dbl roller chain to valve hp springs.. Im gettin it tomm and ill let you know how she looks...

What cam did you have before and which cam are you replacing it with?

I think if I do go roller I may go with the comp 212/212 it looks like a pretty good cam for my set up and other guys on the board say it is a great cam.

Let us know how your swap goes and the power increase, the more and more I research I really want a roller so I may just have to park the car and save up. That is if my cam has wiped a lobe which I won't know until the weekend.

Good luck with your install

 

[psycho6cyl]

I wont be doing the install for a while.. But once it goes in I will report back.. I have what is believed to be a stock cam right now.... Not 100 percent sure but at this time it dosnt even matter...Psycho 6..