Govt. Idiots with God complexes

[Pablo]

I work on Camp Pendleton, a Marine base in southern California. My commute to work is about 12 miles. For about 5 miles at the start of my commute I have to travel through a section of base called Fallbrook Naval Weapons station. This is a sub base (not submarine, but a small base in a base) of a base near long beach. They keep weapons in bunkers here, and its very desolate. Gates block access to all the bunkers from the main road.

The main road is two wide lanes with very broad shoulders for the entire length except for a small 100 foot section in the middle on one side where the shoulder becomes very small. Speed limit is heavily enforced at 45 mph.

The gate is always jam packed with cars in the morning. There are only two gate guards checking IDs (this station requires 100% I.D. check all the time).
What would normally be a 15 minute trip is a 30 minute trip with all the waiting at the gate. Plenty of gasoline is burned just waiting in line.

So I've known for years they have a sign up that says NO BICYCLE TRAFFIC. As far as I can tell there is no good reason for this. Its not a security issue, the shoulders are wide... seems pointless to me.

Today I decided to call someone about it so I called the office of the base "c.o." who turned out to be a civilian douchebag named Mr Goddard. He right away let me know he had a God complex when I asked him about the rule and whether or not we could have it reconsidered or I could get a special pass
his reply?

"NO BIKES ALLOWED, I RUN THIS PLACE AND ITS MY RULE TO MAKE AND I MADE IT"

Couldn't really argue with that so I hung up. I then decided that I wasn't gonna let that fly so I called back and asked for his name and what his position was (I didn't know who or what position he had when i first called)

At this point the guy is of course flabbergasted, you know when you are God of your little base you aren't used to people holding you accountable to your words. He started stammering and was like "wael werel arew waait before we do that what is YOUR NAME"

and I politely told him my name

He then started to tell me his name as "Monty.. i mean MR GODDARD"

Then he told me he was the acting C.O. of that base and I asked "A civilian C.O.?" and he said yes and that he was there since 2000..
From there he started to just speak and give me unsolicited information on how the bike rule was a rule that was there since before he got there in 1999 (interesting how its not his God rule anymore) and that it had been looked at three times since then.
He went on to talk about how engineers had deemed the road "unsafe" for bikes and that he wasnt going to rescind the rule and be a plaintiff in court when someone got hurt. I knew that this was bull**** and pointed out that 15 years of cycling and I have never seen a public road as safe as that one (huge shoulders, low speed limit) where cycling was deemed "unsafe".

The whole conversation consisted of him talking down to me as if I were his subject in a medieval fiefdom.

Since I wasn't going to take that, I decided to call his parent command which is Naval Weapons Station Seal Beach.

There I got in touch with the supposed X.O.. I thought things would go better until I heard the man speak. I can tell you he was not the most well spoken person I have ever heard and I knew right then the conversation was going south.
This guy went from bad to worse. He reiterated a fact I already knew which was that bikes were currently not allowed. No **** sherlock. I then asked him if we could have that rule reconsidered... he then went on to tell me that that rule is for safety and that the state of CALIFORNIA evaluated the road and told them it was not safe for bikes.
I almost laughed when he made that up.. I asked him "The state of california? They have jurisdiction over a federal installation?" He kind of ignored me and rambled on. I asked him to provide me with the name of the person or the department in California who has the jurisdiction over that road to which he replied "I dont have time for all dat"
and then he said "You are the second person to ask me this question and you are getting the second answer" "beyond that im not gonna spend anymore time on this"

what a bunch of lying douchebags. If you want to make up a rule out of thin air just to stroke your ego, go ahead.. but own up to it when someone calls you on it.
I'm debating whether I should push this issue further. I think what I really need is a newspaper to be on my side and start asking questions for a feature to expose the napoleon complex of these people.

Gas is 4 dollars a gallon for regular and every day I'm pissing it into the wind waiting in line at a gate I could be riding my bicycle through. What a load of ****.

 

[T- Type Tim]

Gotta love the red tape, I hope your efforts get some results

 

[Rodney87GN]

Why am I not surprised, sounds like your typical government employee with a small penis on a power trip. Good luck getting through all the BS trying to get a straight answer, but I have a feeling you won't get very far.

 

[T- Type Tim]

I'm sure a lot of this has to do with " job justification" IE: "I don't do anything in my position but, I make a lot of noise to make it seem so to others"

 

[SS_Sean]

I'm sure he will do whatever he feels is necessary to protect his base, discharge his duties in an appropriate manner, and as effectively as he can, and will make any necessary changes based on the situation on the ground. You do not have the big picture, and you do not have the intelligence which is provided to him. You pass through his base. God complex? Perhaps. But the fact of the matter is that military bases are federal complexes, and are not subject to state or local standards. They are a creature unto themselves, not bound by state, local laws. It's the same thing with any federal complex, or Bureau of Indian Affairs reservations, etc. etc. You need to grasp the largess of the situation, understand the laws involved, and then perhaps you will see a little bit of the 'big picture'. If I were him, personally, and my asz were on the line to protect my base, I would be VERY restrictive, as well. I would protect my people and my base with every tool in my toolbag. But then perhaps you would say I would have a 'God Complex', as well. Maybe so, but my base would be safe. Have patients. It's not a conspiracy. It's just good people trying to do the best they can do, protect the people, and get the job done. Americans have NO patients....try to grow some.

 

[Pablo]

First of all I have plenty of PatienCe

I spent 5 years in the Marine Corps. A lot of that time was spent on Camp Pendleton and driving through Camp Pendleton, cycling through Camp Pendleton. I've driven through Naval Weapons Station Fallbrook an innumerable amount of times.

I am aware of the security risks insofar as that it is obvious that a person on a bicycle is no more a security risk than a person in a car or on a motorcycle. Anyone in a car can drop off a passenger on their way through the weapons station. Just recently I saw a person pull off to the side there, get out, and start wandering into the brush wearing hunting attire.
Furthermore, anyone can take photos (though they are prohibited) from the comfort of their vehicle, look up an aerial view on google earth.. or, if I felt so inclined, just walk onto the base through the lightly guarded fenceline. If I could even make it to one of the bunkers where weapons were stored, I would probably need to crap a plasma torch to get in, and then it would look pretty funny riding my bicycle out with a stinger missile strapped to my back.

Actually it would be easier to do things far far worse where I work, which happens to be on an active flight line with around 9 helicopter squadrons. FYI that is a whole ****load of aircraft. I'll spare you the details.

I think if you were in the military you would know that its easy for people in positions like this to get a God complex. They arbitrarily make rules to satisfy their own egos and never have a good reason behind them. Consider that as the commanding officer of a base of lets say 5000 people, you have 5000 "yes" men. Not very hard for me to see how that would inflate your ego.

I saw it at the shop level in USMC aviation.

The largess of the situation is this, neither individual I spoke to had a cogent or factual response to my inquiry. One of them flat out lied and violated the terms of the Freedom of information act. Both were immediately aggressive, one de-escalated the situation when he learned I wasn't in the military. It's a lot easier to push someone around when you have a rank to hide behind.

Actually, as much as I hate the twinkle toed communists at the ACLU I wonder if they would like to hear about this one.

 

[Pablo]

Update:

Today I called the League of American Bicyclists which is the largest bicycle advocacy organization in the US that I am aware of.

I got in contact with their advocacy representative in Washington D.C.

The conversation went well. I explained the situation and he sounded like he had a positive outlook when he told me the steps that needed to be taken.

He is putting me in touch with a local cycling advocacy group who he says will need to go through the steps necessary to take care of the problem, and then, if that doesn't work, he says they (the L.A.B. ) can contact with the DOD there in Washington about it.

So hopefully I can stick it to these clowns. Today I measured the distance at just a hair under 4 miles, there is between a 2 and 8 foot shoulder for the entire stretch on both sides except for 1 downhill stretch where bike speed would be about 30 to 35 mph on a road bike. I estimate total time on this stretch for a bike to be about 20 seconds. The lane is very wide and traffic can pass easily without exiting the lane. My car hugging the middle yellow line provides about 4 feet of clearance from the side mirror to the white line.

About two miles from exiting the base the traffic came to a crawl as usual and I was doing about 10 mph. This continues past the rear gate for another mile or so. On a bike I would have passed everyone.

I'm mostly posting this for my own personal record but any advice or commentary is appreciated.

 

[imjoesnuffy]

Get in contact with the Garrison Commander, or whatever the Navy equivalent is. In the Army they are very responsive to things like this. Don't know how it works with the semen, I mean seamen.

 

[ChavoLC2]

Biking

Yeah it's a bummer at times when you have to go the long way around because they only allow government vehicles to utilize certain roads that lead in to "Restricted areas". Here at Kirtland AFB/Sandia Base they store H-bombs in the Manzano mtns in deep bunker type storage areas that go deep into the mtn.. The base backs right up to the mountain and There are 4 fences you gotta cross if you come in the back door i.e climb down the mountain and one of those fences are electrified. So with the treat of Terrorism at an all time high you don't want some Terrorist , Islamic sympathizer, bleeding heart, radical enviromentalist having access to roads that lead to Restricted areas . They can pack quite a wallop/bomb in a backpack, panniers, on themselves.

What gets me is there is an area on top of the Manzano mtns. called Otero canyon a kick ass mtn biking area that we've used forever. Now there are signs warning you that you are in a restricted area. If you step off the trail to the right your trespassing if you step to the left your not in violation. Been stopped by by military personnel with all there weapons on you. Some of these guys can be all gung-ho. We can arrest you for trespassing . We will have to see what are Captain says see what he wants to do with you. We got our hands slapped /verbal warning and told not to wander those trails no more. It's BS when you've had access to an area for decades then they slam the door shut.

They run mock anti-terrorist exercises up there on a old mtn. road/fireroad, ,where they retake a hijacked truck carrying a warhead as well as other exercises. Back in the late 70's early 80's An old friend of mine a Navy S.E.A.L. used to come here on occasion to train/practice different anti terrorist scenaios/ war games(laser guns with sensors on your body games). It's stupid because where we actually ride isn't that close to where they're playing. Maybe they're using live ammo now It's been a few years but they caught 3 guys coming down off the mountain they managed to get around the fences they actually were lost. They thought they had a handful of Al Queda terrorists turned out to be Manny, Mo and Jose some lost illegal immigrants from Mexico.. Guess they figure if a terrorist wanted to they could come in the back door from the mountain i.e from Otero canyon. As it would be almost impossible to come in the front door from the guarded non civilian access road that leads to the nukes. We had a group called Friends of Otero Canyon that petitioned the Base to allow us to ride Otero think it just pissed them off and they now enforce trespassing in the area more then they ever did. That's a bummer because that was a knarly place to ride... Good Luck Pablo..

 

[gordyzx9r]

I'd be willing to bet that the rule was put into effect for long forgotten security measures that the current leadership just doesn't realize. For example, when I was stationed in HI, on Schofield you can go through Kole Kole pass to get to Waianai; you had to pass by ammunition and bunkers and so forth. But you had to stay in your car, and you couldn't stop, if you did stop it wouldn't take long for an MP to arrive. They didn't allow bicycles either.

 

[Pablo]

I'd be willing to bet that the rule was put into effect for long forgotten security measures that the current leadership just doesn't realize. For example, when I was stationed in HI, on Schofield you can go through Kole Kole pass to get to Waianai; you had to pass by ammunition and bunkers and so forth. But you had to stay in your car, and you couldn't stop, if you did stop it wouldn't take long for an MP to arrive. They didn't allow bicycles either.

That would make sense but in this case, the rule was enacted in 1999. The Commanding director told me the rule was for safety, he emphasized that the road was not safe for bicycles, not security or anything like that. In the time that I have been on this base the security has actually slackened at the weapons station quite a bit. So I dont think they have anything there now that they didnt have before. There used to be an ID check entering from both sides, and they used to hand out numbers to cars to make sure they were in order exiting. They dont do this anymore.

 

[corsair231]

Mount a chain saw engine to your bike frame and then it becomes a motor vehicle.

 

[klrv6]

That which is not managed with decay into chaos.

Bicycles then unicycles then you will have an ice cream van driving around selling stuff to the pedestrians. Where do they draw the line. The point is to monitor and control the flow of traffic through the gates. How long would it take before they couldn't keep up with all the people on bikes? Maybe adjusting your schedule to avoid the peak traffic times would be best?

 

[benoitthegr8]

Fight stupidity with the pen....

My suggestion is find out who the most left wing, tree hugging Senator or Congressperson for your state. Write them a well worded letter, explain how you’re trying to save the environment/lowering your carbon footprint by bicycling. Let them know that you also have several other co-workers that would want to be involved. Let them know that the Military personnel you had dealt with had a distasteful attitude towards you and your radical ideas. The Military is not proactive, but very reactive. The best way to influence an idiot Commander is to have a Congressperson or Senator's office calling and sniffing around. It's amazing how policies and or SOP's will be changed in a matter of no time.... I've been in the Army for 17 years and have seen what happens when Big Government gets involved.

 

[Pablo]

That which is not managed with decay into chaos.

Bicycles then unicycles then you will have an ice cream van driving around selling stuff to the pedestrians. Where do they draw the line. The point is to monitor and control the flow of traffic through the gates. How long would it take before they couldn't keep up with all the people on bikes? Maybe adjusting your schedule to avoid the peak traffic times would be best?

What?

A bicycle is a vehicle, just like a motorcycle, or a car. Only difference is that a bicycle's engine is its passenger. Just about every state in the union has very unambiguous language stating this fact. The gate is restricted access to people with DOD Identification. Fairly simple concept to understand that access is easily restricted based upon DOD credentials. So sorry, no Ice Cream trucks.
They allow bicycles on Camp Pendleton and every other base I have been stationed at in the 7 years I have been involved with the military.
I have yet to see the base devolve into insecure chaos because some guys ride their bike to work through other gates.

If you want to understand the security risks youll have to travel through this road to see that only drivers are checked for ID's, cars arent generally searched, and many non DOD people making deliveries pass through this gate in large trucks. What passenger is a bicyclist going to hide? What weapons of mass destruction is a bicyclist going to hide? He has no trunk, carries no passengers, and cant make any quick escapes. If you think about it, having more people ride bikes is a security improvement.
Thats not the issue at hand though, the issue as stated by the moron running the show was that he felt it was not safe to ride bikes on that road. I know from personal experience that your average sedentary American knows such a staggeringly small amount about cycling and rules and rights for cyclists that they are quite incapable of making an ill-informed decision like the one he made. As a serious cyclist of over 15 years I can say with confidence that his safety concerns have no merit whatsoever.

There is no flow of traffic through the gate as it is precisely BECAUSE the only mode of transport through this gate is via car. If 20 people ride their bike a day that is 20 less cars waiting in line. 20 less cars that have to pass through 1 gate with two guards having to service hundreds of cars. People should have the option to be able to use a bicycle as transportation as it is done in just about every other base and road in the country.


Benoit,

I hear what you are saying, I might be able to make use of these dopes even though I'm so right wing I scare people.
You are absolutely right about the military being reactive instead of proactive. I spoke with the local cycling coalition director and it turns out she tried to deal with them already on this issue, turns out the record holder for the race across America, and multiple champion, used to use this route for training. (He set the record across the USA on a bike: 8 Days and a few hours). They hit the first roadblock (the idiot I talked to) and thats where they stopped. So It helps I know military command structure and we are gonna give it another go to hopefully force their hand.

Your idea is excellent. Thats an angle I hadn't thought of. If I can get someone like that left wing lunatic Dianne Feinstein to help I'm sure she would jump at the chance to stick it to the military and show how much of a tree hugger she is.