Carb (?) trouble

[alopeks]

Either I've got a really unusual problem, or the local mechanic is trying to rip me off... again.

I've been hearing an unusual sound coming from undre the hood whenever I've cruising or sitting at idle, but it's intermittent. It sounds a little like a buzzer or a small alarm clock or something, and it's coming from the carburetor and/or air cleaner assembly. Whenever I'vechecked under the hood, it looks like there may be some vibration of the carb, but it 's hard to tell whether that's from the engine or from whatever is making the noise. It also appears that a vapor of some kind is coming out of the air cleaner, but only occasionally. Most of the time it's just noise. As for the vapor itself, I don't think it's gas, because I don't smell gas when that happens. I recently had the choke assmebly replaced, as it was damaged, and this was done by a pro who is a friend of mine. However, since he lives nearly 200 miles from me, it's hard for me to check with him about this problem. The local, whom I'm not too terribly fond of, says that the carb needs to be overhauled, but that was done when the choke assembly was replaced, less than a month ago. Whatever has been making the noise has been doing this on and off for a few months, but lately it has become almost constant. Of course, when the carb was overhauled by the guy I trust, it did nothing out of the ordinary, with the obvious exception of the choke. Does this sound like the carb? A loose gasket? A faulty hose? Something far more serious? Or am I just losing it? I've done everything I know how to do, which isn't much. I'm really more of a "bare basics of automotive repair" guy who doesn't really understand carbs...

e-mail help would be nice...

youduh@yahoo.com

Thanks,
alopeks

Almost forgot:

N/A 231, stock Dualjet 210 carb, e2mc or e2me, not sure which.

 

[83build-up]

sounds like you have a bad PCV valve.which would explain both problems.first the buzzing sound,they can have a small build up of oil deposits which over time can make the valve difficult to close which is done by vaccume.so while the vac.is trying to close the valve at idle the build up of deposits on the vale it self (which is like a little weight being pulled close)has now become heavier and harder to close.so this pushing pulling effect causes the buzzing sound.it may not happen all the time but that doesn't matter.the PCV valve also help for crankcase venting.which if not working properly would cause the pressure to vent else were which usally is the air cleaner because the pipe from the valve cover goes to the air cleaner and that's were it would vent and look like smoke.I would replace the PCV valve first before i did anything else and see what happens.there cheap so if that doesn't fix it not a big loss.the valve is located right behind the carb on the intake manifold which may also explain why it sounds like the carb.I have had this problem a few times at my shop on differn't cars.hope this helps,let me know if this fixes it or not.

 

[turbofish38]

If you can try to isolate the noise. Is it coming from the carb? On some GM vehicles there is a relay in the choke circuit but as far as I can tell you car doesn't use it. They buzz like you describe. The other thing I was thinking was your mixture control solenoid on the carb. When these cycle they usually click instead of buzz. The vapors inside the air cleaner might be coming from the breather(the tube on the right side valve cover). Do you have a SES light on full time or intermittenly? Like you I'm no expert when it comes to electronic carbs but it sounds like the problem came when the mechanic worked on yours. Finding someone to work on a carb is tuff as the last year GM used them was 1990. Good luck and hope this helps. Eric Fisher

 

[Freddie's Buick]

Eric is right dude,

However, if you're not having any drivability problems other then a strange sound, then it might not be the carb or the PCV. If you still have the OEM A.I.R. system then it could be the diverter valve. It releases back pressure out into the air cleaner or out a of a small muffler on the A.I.R. pump during deceleration. This is quite normal. It's activated by the ECM.

 

[alopeks]

PCV valve?

Okay, I've just finished changing the oil, replacing the air filter, and replacing the breather filter... but I can't seem to find the PCV valve...

Am I just stupid? I checked the Haynes book, and the only caption that mentions the PCV valve shows the breather that attaches to the air cleaner housing, and says "the PCV valve is usually connected to the air cleaner assembly." BUT I already have a different part from AutoZone that's actually a valve, labeled PCV valve, with the right part number from the book at AutoZone. Any suggestions? This is embarassing...

I haven't seen a light anywhere, just heard a buzzing sound. That's actually part of what worried me. If there was a warning light and a wierd sound, I would at least know there was something wrong. With nothing but a noise, I have to figure out for myself whether or not my car needs work... again.

BTW, ever since I first posted, the buzzing sound is suddenly very rare... Figures.

 

[Freddie's Buick]

Track out the big vacuum hose from the front of the carb throttle plate. It will lead to the rear of the intake and plug down into a rubber grommet on the intake. (The grommet is probably as hard as a rock by now and no longer pliable).

 

[alopeks]

Okay, just did another replacement of all the filters, oil, etc., even cleaned the EGR valve (which is in the worst possible location!), and ran the car at idle for about ten minutes, then drove around the neighborhood for a few, then made a quick run to the 7-11, and no sounds, no problems, nothing but good old-fashioned Buick performance. I went inside and washed up, came back twenty minutes later, started her up, and whaddaya know! Buzzing's back, louder (I think, I might just be pissed off...) and constant unless I hammer the gas, which once again isn't responding like it used to/should. I'm about fed up with this. There is obviously something wrong, but I can't for the life of me figure out what! Oh, and sorry about not posting for a while, it's been a very busy couple of months trying to graduate, etc. As always, e-mail help is good

youduh@yahoo.com

alopeks

 

[alopeks]

Okay, now I have an SES light...

This is beyond irritating. Whatever this problem is, I need to fix it soon and cheap. This isn't a project car, this is my only means of motorized transportation.

I have a feeling that rollerblading to downtown for my finals next week would be a bad idea...

alopeks

 

[b4black]

SES lights are good. They tell you why they are unhappy.

Retireve the codes with a paperclip:
http://www.gnttype.org/maint/malf.html

These codes might be more appropriate for a NA V6:
http://home.flash.net/~rjgeorge/ecm.htm


Sometimes an Oxyegn sensor code is cause by a vacuum leak, not a bad sensor.

 

[alopeks]

Okay, the only code that comes up is 53. It's still very intermittent. Code 53 wasn't on either of the Buick code charts you gave me, but according to my GM Code book it's one of the following:
1. Over voltage Condition
2. Exhaust Gas Recirculation system problems or EGR Solenoid #1 problem.
3. Voltage Reference Error
4. Vehicle Anti-Theft System Error.

I don't think my car even HAS an anti-teft system except the alarm I installed after I got it back from the idiots who stole it (it ran out of gas 2 miles from my house...). I don't see how it could have an over voltage problem since I have a CD changer and a small amp running off the stock eletric system. I'm not sure what "voltage reference error" means, and my Haynes manual says practically nothing about the EGR. Any of this sound like progress? As always, e-mail help is good.

alopeks

youduh@yahoo.com

 

[Ttype83]

Originally posted by alopeks
even cleaned the EGR valve (which is in the worst possible location Oh, and sorry about not posting for a while, it's been a very busy couple of months trying to graduate, etc. As always, e-mail help is good

Okay, the only code that comes up is 53.

2. Exhaust Gas Recirculation system problems or EGR Solenoid #1 problem.


alopeks

The code came up when you cleaned the EGR, Are you sure that you have it in tight?
Did you cross any vac lines?
Yes it is in the worst spots, I have removed my without removing the carb and had a tuff time.

Look here first
HTH
Jim.

 

[alopeks]

Since I know everyone missed me, and because it's so good to be back!

It's about freaking time!

In case anyone was wondering (and I'm sure no one was...) I just now got internet access again. And my car trouble was solved two months ago. After a third round of replacing EVERY SINGLE FILTER AND VALVE I COULD FIND, again with no luck, I went to get an oil change. The very nice man in the pit asked me if I knew there was a broken pipe going into my cat. This entire time that stupid buzzing sound was a broken pipe from the AIR pump. This was, according to the very nice man in the pit, causing not only the buzzing sound, but also the sluggish performance, because the ECM was never getting an accurate pressure reading and, therefore, trying to adjust things that didn't need to be. Now, how true all of that is, I'm unsure of, but since my car works much better now, and since I haven't had any more SES lights, I'm inclined to believe the very nice man from the pit. Just thought I'd thank you all for your help. All that aside, it's great to finally be back online. And I had more than 1500 spam messages in my bulk mail, but they didn't close my account. I'm not sure whether that's a good thing or a bad thing... Anyways...

alopeks

 

[Ttype83]

Re: Since I know everyone missed me, and because it's so good to be back!

Originally posted by alopeks
It's about freaking time!

In case anyone was wondering (and I'm sure no one was...) I just now got internet access again. And my car trouble was solved two months ago. The very nice man in the pit asked me if I knew there was a broken pipe going into my cat. This entire time that stupid buzzing sound was a broken pipe from the AIR pump. This was, according to the very nice man in the pit, causing not only the buzzing sound, but also the sluggish performance, because the ECM was never getting an accurate pressure reading and, therefore, trying to adjust things that didn't need to be. I'm inclined to believe the very nice man from the pit. Just thought I'd thank you all for your help. All that aside, it's great to finally be back online. And I had more than 1500 spam messages in my bulk mail, but they didn't close my account. I'm not sure whether that's a good thing or a bad thing... Anyways...

alopeks

I didn't check my mail for almost a week and had 360 spams
Glad to see you back and that you got the car fixed...it's almost allways the small stuff. I would believe the nice man in the pit too.

Jim