back pressure check

malibuick231

Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2002
For anyone interrested I done a back pressure check on my car today.Trying to find out were my hp is.At 13 psi the back pressure was 20 psi.At 26psi the back pressure was 40 psi.And at 26 psi with the converter locked the back pressure was 37psi.My combo is t66 turbo,55s,gn1 heads, atr headers,and a comp 210 208 cam.With a 11.9 a/f at 5500 rpms it made 464 hp seems a little low to me.Also running 24 of timming went to 26 didn't make any difference.All in all I think the back pressure looked great the only other thing I can think of is I have the cam out a little.Just wondering what you guys think.
 
What downpipe and exhaust system? That 40 psi/26 psi seems on the high side to me with the turbo/heads/cam that you have, but only a very few people have posted numbers to compare to (thanks).
 
ijames I have a 82a/r garret housing a 3in down pipe and 3in manderel bent exaust with a ultra flow muffler.
 
Malibuick,

I assume this is backpressure after the turbo?

Denis
 
Seems like it is in the reasonable zone to me... Corky Bell's book says a ratio of 2.0 or less is acceptable, with 1.0 being race car territory. You're at 1.5, which sounds decent. I've only gotten a couple of data points over the years, and 1.5 is right in there with those other cars, one of which was a stage I.

John
 
Okay, John, maybe I'm just misremembering Todd's data. He had a 70 turbo with good downpipe and open exhaust, big cam, frontmount, and ported GN1's, and I thought that at 25 psi boost he was more like 32-35 psi before the turbo? Anyway, thanks for the numbers.
 
Hey Carl, I've only got one thing saved from Todd's experiments, and that one email said he had 42-44 psi backpressure @ ~5500 rpm. But I have no idea what boost level he was running or what hardware he had at the time. This was about 4 years ago... I do have some stuff from a guy with a TE-60 on a Typhoon, and all his measurements said he was in the 1.4-1.6 range, but then he was only running ~16 psi boost. Not sure if it would have stayed in that same range if he cranked it up to 25 psi.

John
 
Whats a typical delta P across the hot side of the turbo?

Whats a typical exhaust backpressure? (after turbo)
 
I am assuming you have a P trim exhaust turbine not a Q trim. What is the pressure difference across the turbine, you need to take readings both before and after the turbine. This will tell you if you have a restriction down streem from the turbine.

On the subject of the HP readings @ 5500 rpm (assuming this is at the rear wheels), looks like your VE is low. Could be one of or combination of Intercooler, cam, intake restrictions, leaks, etc.

Some possible tests, leakdown, pressure test intake system (with valves closed), check temperature and pressure difference across IC.

Sorry not much help.

Deep Enough
Donald McMullin
 
Whats a typical delta P across the hot side of the turbo?

Corky's book talks about the ratio of turbine inlet pressure to intake manifold pressure, and seems to indicate that 1.0-2.0 is the typical range, depending on various factors. Lower is better of course, the lower the backpressure the more hp you'll make, but I expect that the lower ratios will exhibit more laginess.

If you are familiar with the pressure ratio across the compressor side, you'll have no problem with the same concept on the exhaust side. A prime driver for the turbine is P2/P1, inlet pressure/outlet pressure, on an absolute scale. What is typical, I can't say. Sure would like to see some turbine performance curves, but those are like finding hens teeth it appears. The new Garrett catalog has some turbine curves though, for the GT-40 the curves start at P2/P1 = 1.2 and go up to about 3.0. Remember this is turbine P2/P1, not turbine P2/boost.

Whats a typical exhaust backpressure? (after turbo)

I dunno, I would expect it to be smallish, something in the 3-4 psi range is what I would guess. Depends on mufflers (or lack thereof), cat converter or not, number of bends in and length of the tail pipe, downpipe size, elbow design (ie TH style vs. stock), and integral or external wastegate.

Suppose your setup required a pressure ratio across the turbine of 3.0 to drive the compressor side. You have 5 psig right at the turbine outlet with a stock exhaust system. The turbine inlet pressure would be = 3.0 x (5 + 14.7) - 14.7 = 44.4 psig.

Now replace the downpipe with a THDP, get rid of the cat, single 3" exhaust, etc... and this reduces the turbine outlet pressure to 2 psig. What is the new turbine inlet pressure? = 3.0 x (2+14.7) - 14.7 = 35.4 psig.

So reducing the turbine outlet pressure by 3 psi made a 9 psi difference in turbine inlet pressure (which is the backpressure the cylinders actually see). I would expect a nice power gain from that reduction in backpressure on the engine.... ah, the magic of the pressure ratio... shows the importance of a good high flow exhaust system to a turbo car.

One of these days I'm going to get around to measuring the backpressure on mine. I have a theory that the guys that seem to need dual deltagates or some mondo big flow single wastegate really have a high backpressure problem that they don't know about. Instead of more wastegate they really need a bigger turbine side. If they've got so much excess exhaust that they need a lot of wastegate to get rid of it, they'll be better off with a bigger turbine and letting it go out that way instead. It'll result in a lower backpressure and mo' power.

John
 
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