87 MAF in a 84

[84HAGN]

Hey guys i just did the conversion over to a 87 ecm in my 84 GN
and installed the 87 MAF and the car runs really bad when it runs, put the 84 MAF back in and it runs fine
My question is do i have to change any wires to run the 87 maf
I installed the MAT as per GNTTYPE.org conversion stated got no codes either
Thanks

 

[Jerryl]

What chip(s) did you install?
Should be OK with the correct chip.
Some say that the HA MAF runs better on their car while others like the IC MAF. The HA and IC MAF are calibrated differenctly, hence the possible need for another chip. No wire changes needed.

 

[84HAGN]

Thats what i thought

Well the chip is unknown I thought i was buying a stock computer with a stock chip however when i got it the only thing on the chip is a round white sticker with v86 or could be v8b the calpak is correct the guy i bought the stuff from said the maf was working when removed but i cant get it to work and i suspect it is bad pretty sure i been had .
Hey jerrly drop me an email my computer crashed and i lost all my contacts
and i will tell you the rest of the story about the parts
Mike

 

[6SENSE]

Should work better using the 87 MAF. Its probably bad. With the 87 ECM and 84 MAF the car will run okay but will run rich. There is no change in wiring to either MAF.
Cal paks are the same 84-87, so you can take your original from the 84 ECM if you had to (# ends in 503 or 504 I think). Chip in your 87 ECM has to be a chip for a 86/87. If the car runs good with the exception of when you use the suspect MAF, that would make me think that the chip might be fine and the MAF bad. Use a scan tool to look at #s and see where everything is at. Would definately be nice to know what chip you have. If the chip isnt burned for the injectors you have that would throw things off. Problem is your working with some unknown variables here. A scantool should help. Look at AF #s. Does your check engine light come on when the 87 MAF is installed and the car running bad? Check that and scantool readings in that situation. Good luck.

 

[Squid4life]

Mine did the same thing when I had my HA setup, but converted to 87 ECM, MAF, and MAT. I had an unknown chip and 37# injectors. Had Eric burn me a chip for the 87 ECM, non-IC'ed, with 37's. Much better. IF you think you have a bad MAF, list your location and maybe someone can loan you a known good MAF.

Squid

 

[84HAGN]

chip

How do I get in touch with Eric
Thanks
Mike

 

[Squid4life]

http://www.turbotweak.com/

Eric Marshall
eric@turbotweak.com

on the board as "Eric Stage I"

Great guy!

Squid

 

[Jerryl]

.......Hey jerrly drop me an email my computer crashed and i lost all my contacts and i will tell you the rest of the story about the parts
Mike

Mike,
I've had problems the last 2 days with my e-mail. My yahoo does not work but all other sites work. Send me an e-mail, so... when it DOES decide to work, I can reply.

 

[Mr.Buick]

87 Ecu

Caspers can help with the conversion, what did you do about the ambient air temp sensor? I had to get the wiring kit from Caspers, because the 84-85 don't have one.

 

[84HAGN]

Conversion

I already did the conversion got the MAT kit from Caspers and it is installed
The guy I got the ECM and MAF from said I had to rewire the MAF ,that it wasnt plug and play. I never read anything about having to rewire the MAF for the conversion and the maf he sold me is supposed to be for an 87 so
I think its bad .

 

[Jerryl]

I already did the conversion got the MAT kit from Caspers and it is installed
The guy I got the ECM and MAF from said I had to rewire the MAF ,that it wasnt plug and play. I never read anything about having to rewire the MAF for the conversion and the maf he sold me is supposed to be for an 87 so
I think its bad .

Mike,
You read correctly.
I would say that "the guy" may not be fully informed on HA cars. Many on this board have "crossed that bridge" and none had to rewire the MAF. The ignition is a different story.

 

[Mr.Buick]

87 Maf

The only difference is the plug on the 87 is different from the 84-85

 

[84HAGN]

conversion

Thats what I thought bought the ECM MAF and electric fan from a guy on here and because of my ignorance when it comes to buick parts paid to much Oh well lesson learned no have to buy a chip for my set up
Just got my scanner back and tring to get the idle straight BLM's are at 103
and iac is around 35 got to do some research and get the idle straight
car runs great with new stuff never saw any knock with old computer was
beginning to wonder if gauge was working went out last night and saw the gauge lite up for the first time went as high as 1 yellow
Mike

 

[Squid4life]

"87 Maf - The only difference is the plug on the 87 is different from the 84-85"

Mr. Buick~ Not trying to argue, my 85 GN had the exact same harness plug, there was no diff and it fit either my 85 or my 87 MAF. Just want to make sure 84HAGN doesn't get teh feeling he got the wrong parts. Broke maybe, but maybe not wrong. :frown:

Squid

 

[rredalty]

I am the guy that sold him the parts and ALL of the parts worked when shipped out and I have many people on here that will vouch for that. I told you that you might have to rewire the MAF but I was not sure of it because mine was allready on the car when I bought it and like I asked before, what did you do about the air temp sensor? As far as you being uneducated about the parts you bought from me, I answered all the questions you asked me and you never complained about the prices I had listed. I also told you very clearly that the car came with 2 chips when I got it. I had no clue what they are and you would need to check into it to see if they would work with your current setup. I can post a copy of the e-mail if you would like.

 

[Rhinospeed84]

I can vouch for him we've done buisness with no problem, actually gave me extra parts in good workin condition because "I have no use for them"

 

[84HAGN]

Parts

wasnt talking to you just trying to find out about MAF got my answeres MAF is BAD and as far as chips go payment was already sent when you told me about chips Like I said my ignorance about the parts led me to where I am now and you and I have nothing else to talk about I have learned my lesson about buying parts of the groups.
Mike

 

[fritz]

87 ecm conversion

I am just about ready to do the same conversion. I would like to be clear on what I need.
1. ECM / correct part #
2. MAT sensor.
Gm or after market?
3. MAF sensor
GM or after market?
Are all of the sensor changes manditory or just suggested?

I have a 93 chip(for 86-87) on the way from Postons

I know about the pin outs at the ecm to make the mat function.

Planning to do this next weekend.
thanx

 

[6SENSE]

84HAGN, I would borrow a known good 87 MAF and try it. From what youve posted there is no way you can be 100% sure that it is the problem. Like I said before, it SOUNDS like that could be the issue IF there werent other question marks with your setup that have to be taken into consideration. If rredalty did not sell the chip to you as a chip burned specifically for 40# injectors (which is what your sig says you have) then the chip you are using probably is not right for you setup. Its probably a chip for stock injectors (28#) and you are flowing too much fuel causing the computer to try and compensate. A 103 BLM reading says that you are running VERY rich and the ECM is trying its best to lean things out (as a side note Ive seen bad MAFs lock at 90 and 105 I think). Possibly a problem with your MAF but from what you have already said, you need not make a definate ruling quite yet. 1st: Either get a KNOWN GOOD 86/87 MAF and try it without changing anything else to see if there is a difference or get a chip burned for your 40# injectors with '87 ECM setup and try it without changing anything else. You need to go ahead and get the chip regardless, unless you know someone who can read the chips you have to see what they are. Joe Lubrandt does a great job on hotair chips too.
Also, there is nothing wrong with a IAC reading of 35. As far as the MAT sensor.........it does not matter if it is even hooked up. Yes it will trip a code, but will not cause any of the driveability problems that you are having, just give you an annoying orange light

Guys, check out the info at gnttype.org. Many instructions are there, or here by doing a search. Dan Smith was the pioneer on the 87ECM conversion amongst other things for the hotair car and his detailed instructions are over at gnttype that are probably 10 years old.

P.S. plugs for MAF sensors (84-87) are the same. 3" MAF (from LT1, etc) is different.

 

[6SENSE]

I am just about ready to do the same conversion. I would like to be clear on what I need.
1. ECM / correct part #
2. MAT sensor.
Gm or after market?
3. MAF sensor
GM or after market?
Are all of the sensor changes manditory or just suggested?

I have a 93 chip(for 86-87) on the way from Postons

I know about the pin outs at the ecm to make the mat function.

Planning to do this next weekend.
thanx

1. 1227148
2. either one....or grab one from the junkyard off any frontwheel drive 3.8/3800 GM vehicle. 100's of them out there, probably all good. I doubt anyone junked there car because of a faulty MAT sensor.
3. this is the tough one. No more from GM. Only way you will get a O.E. GM unit is used from someone. Too much info on this subject as far as WHERE to get a replacement for me to waste time and space. Do a search in the general tech forum. I will tell you that I have come to strongly believe that a translator and 3" MAF is the best solution period (unless you like going through MAF after MAF until you find one that works right, and lasts longer than 1 year).
You dont necessarily have to change the MAF but I think with the newer ECM the driveability is better overall with the 86/87 unit over the 84/85 (read Dan Smith's instructions at gnttype.org for his views on this).

Here you go:http://www.gnttype.org/techarea/ecmsensors/8487ecm.html

P.S. noticed you mentioned knowing the MAT connections at the ECM. Thats great, run the two wires and do it yourself. The ECM conversion is just too easy. Takes little time (30 minutes if you take your time) and little money (shouldnt cost more than $10-$15! unless someone has already cleaned out all the 7148 ECMs from your local U-pull-it).