Turbo PeppeR
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- Mar 7, 2002
Has anyone installed a manual transmission in thier turbo regal?
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6-speed turbo regal...
- Thread starter Turbo PeppeR
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Turbo PeppeR
New Member
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2002
Anyone know if Id have computer problems if I installed a 6 speed gearbox?
This question comes up atleast once a month with the amateurs or people that dont know better. The main problem you will have will be stalling anytime the clutch is pushed in. The problem stems from the fact that the computer senses the load placed on the engine by the torque convertor. Many guys have experience stalling when first started with higher stall/lighter convertors. Talking to Joe Lubrant awhile ago about this this I it was explained that removing the load of the torque convertor does many things to the engine controls. Basically the computer does not know when to idle the engine because there is no neutral sensing circuit. You could play around with IAC settings in your chips. It really is a trial and error affair to get it right. Your other issues will be getting a flywheel for a Buick V6 and then getting the adapter plate to bolt a T56 to the Buick block. No, the TCI Chevy to BOP adapter wont work as it is for automatic transmissions. Using it can and will throw off the input shaft alignment causing many destructive problems such as wiped input bearings, worn thrust flanges in the crank, hard shifting or jumping out of gear. Besides the fact that you will have a shallower engagement into the pilot bearing in the back of the crank. You WILL spend more than a bullet proof TH2004r and will also go slower. Check the archives on this subject and you will see. If you want a stick, you picked the wrong engine to do it to.
If you want a reason, ask me, I have a stick behind the Buick engine in my Corvair and have gone to great lengths and expense to do it. Why? I had no other choice of transaxle for this car. Take it from someone who knows. You will be sorry you ever undertook such a project.
If you want a reason, ask me, I have a stick behind the Buick engine in my Corvair and have gone to great lengths and expense to do it. Why? I had no other choice of transaxle for this car. Take it from someone who knows. You will be sorry you ever undertook such a project.
Turbo PeppeR
New Member
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2002
hmmm.about 14 years ago I read an article in hot rodding or car craft where a guy put a four speed manual in a hot air turbo regal,the problem was the article didnt give much info on the swap.I also know a guy that has a n/a 3.8 buick in his 914 porsche ,so Im not sure if Im an amateur or If I just dont know better...I just figure with these two examples that there might be a chance I could do the same....
I have that article. It was Popular Hot Rodding circa June 1985 and from rereading it again, it didnt turn out quite as well as they expected. A N/A 3.8 will run like a totally different beast. Your main problem stems from the fact that you have to try to spool a relatively large turbo, so you will loose a lot in 1st gear. It would work 100% better with twins. But as in my previous post, there are some other major issues to consider. Here is the estimates of prices
T56 gearbox (used $1000-$1500)
Centerforce steel flywheel ($325) + rebalance engine since the flywheel doesnt match the factory balance ($250+)
T56 spec Centerforce clutch ($540.99 in Jeg's catalog)
F body hydraulic slave and master (GM cost is approx $200+)
G body spec pedals (check Ebay, last set I saw went for $150)
Modify driveshaft ($100)
You will still have to make an adapter plate to bolt the T56 to the engine and also fabricate a mounting for the clutch mastercylinder.
This could easily be a $3000+ project that will make the car slower. If you dont believe me, then try it. But dont say I didnt warn ya!
T56 gearbox (used $1000-$1500)
Centerforce steel flywheel ($325) + rebalance engine since the flywheel doesnt match the factory balance ($250+)
T56 spec Centerforce clutch ($540.99 in Jeg's catalog)
F body hydraulic slave and master (GM cost is approx $200+)
G body spec pedals (check Ebay, last set I saw went for $150)
Modify driveshaft ($100)
You will still have to make an adapter plate to bolt the T56 to the engine and also fabricate a mounting for the clutch mastercylinder.
This could easily be a $3000+ project that will make the car slower. If you dont believe me, then try it. But dont say I didnt warn ya!
Manual trans
Lee, if you are having driveability issues and want to 'dig around' in the software
look me up in BG. (if you're going to be there) There are ways to handle this.
As far as the other issues go (besides cost) they are solve-able.
Spool at the line: use a 2-step. (buy good u-joints...)
Loss of spool during a shift: power shift, bypass valve.
Stalling: software tweaks, there are no issues here that can't be solved.
Installation stuff: I have no idea..........
TurboBob
Lee, if you are having driveability issues and want to 'dig around' in the software
look me up in BG. (if you're going to be there) There are ways to handle this.
As far as the other issues go (besides cost) they are solve-able.
Spool at the line: use a 2-step. (buy good u-joints...)
Loss of spool during a shift: power shift, bypass valve.
Stalling: software tweaks, there are no issues here that can't be solved.
Installation stuff: I have no idea..........
TurboBob
I am going to try to make it to BG this year, but I am not sure if I will be there with the Corvair yet. I have to see how much I can get done over the next few months.
I am making new headers and fitting twin T3's to mine, so I should have the spool up problem licked. The other issues will be dealt with later. I wasnt trying to discourage the guy, just trying to "advise" that it isnt a practical swap and will most likely hurt performance unless he has a very large wallet to address all of the issues. I know my wallet still hurts.
I am making new headers and fitting twin T3's to mine, so I should have the spool up problem licked. The other issues will be dealt with later. I wasnt trying to discourage the guy, just trying to "advise" that it isnt a practical swap and will most likely hurt performance unless he has a very large wallet to address all of the issues. I know my wallet still hurts.
I have to side with Lee here, and I also am speaking from experience. I have run a 4 speed Saginaw, a Muncie M22 with a vertigal gate shifter and a Borg Warner T5 behind a NA 3.8 and the turbo SFI engine... (and believe me it was a pain in the butt to set it up) The auto tranny is the way to go with the turbo engine. My car is a lot quicker with the auto tranny than it ever was with the stick, even slamming the V-gate shifter.
Bob is right about any software problems being fixable but at what cost... to go slower?
I am going to add that when most think about a stick they see high RPM power shifting like they see the imports doing. That is not the case with the 3.8, it is a relatively low RPM engine that builds torque much lower in the RPM band and does no need to buzz eight grand to make some HP. Unless you want to build a stage motor and have lots of money to invest in heads and girdles etc. I would concentrate on setting up what you have and letting that scare you.
Sorry to rain on your parade and I don't want to discourage you from dreaming. I just think Lee and myself are trying to save you the grief and $$$ that we have already been through.
Paul
Bob is right about any software problems being fixable but at what cost... to go slower?
I am going to add that when most think about a stick they see high RPM power shifting like they see the imports doing. That is not the case with the 3.8, it is a relatively low RPM engine that builds torque much lower in the RPM band and does no need to buzz eight grand to make some HP. Unless you want to build a stage motor and have lots of money to invest in heads and girdles etc. I would concentrate on setting up what you have and letting that scare you.
Sorry to rain on your parade and I don't want to discourage you from dreaming. I just think Lee and myself are trying to save you the grief and $$$ that we have already been through.
Paul
Yes, I have a 3inch LT1 mass air meter on my Corvair with a Translator that is set up for a blow through.
As far as my transmission choice, I have been looking into trying to get a 4L60E transaxle from a C5 Vette as it would work like a champ in my mid engine application. There is a guy on www.pro-touring.com that has an mid engine LS1 powered Corvair with such a set up. I also agree with Paul 100% on the stickshift. It just isnt worth the aggravation.
As far as my transmission choice, I have been looking into trying to get a 4L60E transaxle from a C5 Vette as it would work like a champ in my mid engine application. There is a guy on www.pro-touring.com that has an mid engine LS1 powered Corvair with such a set up. I also agree with Paul 100% on the stickshift. It just isnt worth the aggravation.
Turbo PeppeR
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- Mar 7, 2002
ive had the car since 93 so I have enjoyed it.I had a 64 chevy truck with a muncie m 21 (close ratio) and a decent 350 and I just miss shifting....I also have a best friend with a 86 930 turbo thats a blast to drive...I realize my cars different then both but I just like shifting and as far as drag racing Ive takin my car to the track one time since 93......I was looking at using a getrag 6 speed from a turbo supra in my swap.....Thanks for everyones input,Im officially done with the idea.
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