Vacuum brakes * intermittent issue

Tori

Active Member
Joined
Nov 4, 2013
About a year and a half ago, I converted to 10.75", Dual diaphram, vacuum assist brakes.

Initially they worked great. Almost too good IMO at the time of the conversion. I felt they were too "touchy" gave too much assist.

I seemed to get used to it, and drove it randomly for the past 1.5 years without any issue. Over the past couple months it began to question their effectiveness, and definitely didn't think they were too touchy anymore.

I wondered if i'd done damage to the booster in that amount of time if the check valve was failing slightly ???

I ended up installing a second check valve just to make sure, and as protection against the first one.
No difference noticed after adding the second check valve.

Last week backing out of the garage i completely lost all assist, and almost hit the neighbors street parked car as a result. Pedal was super hard to push and little braking.

Over the past week i drove the car to my shop where i'd be doing the work to swap the booster. During that short 2 block drive, the brakes worked normally. Power assist worked fine. Later in the day i was moving the car again, and the brakes failed again just as before. Hard pedal, no assist.

Today i swapped boosters and gave it an initial test drive. Power assist was back, and it felt normal. I did a couple panic stops from a cruising 40mph and the stopping performance is poor IMO. Cannot lock the wheels and if it were a real emergency, i'd probably hit whatever i was trying to avoid.

An hour later, moving the car back into the garage, i get the same symptom- No power assist, hard pedal, hardly any braking.

WHAT AM I MISSING HERE ? This seems like such a simple system. Vacuum gauge shows 17" of vacuum at idle, and about 15" at cruise so i know i'm making vacuum. Pulling the vacuum source from the intake manifold you can feel suction.

Looking for suggestions as to why this system isn't working like it once did, and any thoughts on why it's intermittent.
 
Where did you hook up the booster vacuum line to? Also, if this extra check valve did nothing, I'd remove it from the system. Hard pedal means no vacuum assist, of course. As far as your brakes not stopping you as well as you think they should, it could be your pads, or perhaps the rear brakes need to be adjusted closer to the drums.
 
Good call, i'll remove the additional check valve and see what happens. It's the same valve a buddy runs on his '86 with vac. brakes. Although he has the smaller booster.

Vacuum source is the top of the dog house where all the other vacuum lines source from. I bought the correct new style vac. manifold that has a larger port for the vac. brake conversion.
 
Oh, I got ya. You have the TTA vacuum block. I have used those but I didn't like the big nipple on it so I got rid of them and put a vacuum 3/8" T fitting right above the PCV valve. Be sure you're not leaking vacuum around that hose.
 
I do still have the filter, and will give it a suck/blow test to see if anything feels restricted. I have the valve out, but now the Olympics have distracted me.
 
I've never run one of those filters in several TRs I've had for over 15 years. They're unnecessary. Throw it away!
 
Looking for suggestions as to why this system isn't working like it once did, and any thoughts on why it's intermittent.

Check the vacuum hose. It may have gotten soft or the liner is collapsing cutting off vacuum to the booster.

RemoveBeforeFlight
 
3 test drives since removing the 2nd check valve and all seems back to normal. At least as far as not loosing the power assist. I still think the braking performance sucks, but that may be another issue. Thanks guys for the help.
 
3 test drives since removing the 2nd check valve and all seems back to normal. At least as far as not loosing the power assist. I still think the braking performance sucks, but that may be another issue. Thanks guys for the help.

Did you check your rear brake adjustment? Also, maybe you need to upgrade your pads. When I changed over to LS1 discs all the way around I bought inexpensive pads, and car didn't stop well. Couldn't figure out why, and I changed to performance pads and the problem was solved.
 
Tori, my GN did the same thing last week when pulling out of the garage. Only did it once . I had just started it, it was in high / cold idle, put it in drive and no vacuum assist. Hasn't happened while driving, just after I started it. Scared the bejeebers out of me. And I only have the one check valve.
My stopping power also isn't what I'd like, so I'm going to take the advice of going to performanc pads / shoes. Just don't know which ones to get. Any suggestions?
 
On my LS1 brakes I upgraded to Hawk pads, from the cheapest Autozones. Worked awesome but they're quite overpriced. I must admit, I went with the cheapest pads from Advance, 5 years ago with my turbo El Camino (also converted to LS! 12" rotors)-- didn't want to pay for the Hawks again, and they work quite well -- no complaints and still on the car. I'd recommend at least changing to something other than what you have on the car, and make sure your drum brakes are adjusted up tight.
 
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