Craig at FAST???More e-Dist and Oddfire SP questions

[OddfireV6]

OK big thanks to the FAST crew for getting my Speedpro modified to accept Hall Effect signals and back to me in two days!! Lance, Craig, Tony, and Mike have all been great. Unfortunately we still don't have a running truck...here is what we have and don't have...we installed the MSD Cam Plug PN 8514 which gives us the Hall Effect falling edge signal to the eDist and the SP which has been converted, we are seeing RPM on the SP and we are definitely getting fuel, we are also seeing Points signals out of the SP as the eDist lights for cam and Points are lighting up. Checked the power and ground to the coils and we are good there, but we don't have a signal coming out of the eDist...the dip switches inside the eDist box are set to the following per the eDist tech sheet. 1 is Off, 2 is On, 3 is Off, 4 is On, 5 is Off/NA, 6 is Off, tried 7 On and Off, and 8 is Off. And as far as the harness pinout goes here is what we are doing C1 is not used, C2 is the Points input signal from the SP, C3 is not used, C4 is the Discreet Cam Input signal +, C5 is a ground, C6 is the EST signal out to Cyl/Coil #6, C7 is the EST signal to Cyl/Coil # 4, C8 is the EST signal to Cyl/Coil #1, C9 C10 C11 C12 C13 C14 and C15 are not used, C16 is 12V switched. D1 is not used, D2 is Points ground from SP, D3 is not used, D4 is the Discreet Cam Input Signal -, D5 is the EST signal to Cyl/Coil # 2, D6 is the EST signal to Cyl/Coil #5, D7 is the EST signal to Cyl/Coil # 3, D8 is not used, D9 is a ground, D10 D11 D12 D13 D14 and D15 are not used, and D16 is a ground....anyway we are aware that the cam and Points signals cannot be within 10 degrees of one another otherwise the eDist gets confused, we will be verifiying that this is not the case tomorrow with a 2 channel o-scope...

So my questions are as follows:

1) Are the Dip switches and eDist harness correct?
2) Does the eDist box need to have the dwell time adjusted?
3) What if anything could keep the eDist from sending a signal out to the coils?
4) Do we still use the Points pin out X3 for our firing instructions to the eDist or do we need to use say K3 which is EST? Are EST and Points the same thing? If not what is the difference?

And Craig if this is too much to respond to by typing please feel free to call me at home 312-575-0104. And Thanks in advance to anyone who can answer all these technical questions

 

[Craig Smith]

If the power, points, and cam LEDs are lighting, I think the eDist is working. The EST outputs switch from 0 to 5 volts to trigger the coils. This would be the first thing I look for with the scope.

Do you have any of the wires labed AGND on the pinout chart grounded? You should. I don't have the pinout info in front of me but I'll look at this tomorrow at work and throw something back up here. I think it's pretty much right though.

 

[OddfireV6]

Hi Craig thanks a million for the quick response...we already verified that their are no signals coming out of the eDist with the o-scope, we only had one good lead for the scope so we could only check one thing at a time but tomorrow we will have 2 leads so we can make sure that cam and EST signals are not overlapping, we've moved the cam plug to move the cam signal around but no go...we're pretty lost at this point and we're trying to get it running by Thursday as the SYTY Nats is this weekend I talked to Tony on the Tech line today and when I started talking about dwell time in the eDist and pinouts he felt we should talk to Lance...anyway if you could verify the eDist pinouts and that we are using the right signal from the SP that would be a great help, maybe ask Lance what could keep the eDist from firing despite getting all the signals? I just thought of something, on the eDist box we were seeing one Cam light then only two EST pulses when we should be seeing six EST pulses....we can verify this on the scope for sure tomorrow but if this is the case why would this happen? Should we be using EST or Points out of the SP? Thanks again man...

 

[OddfireV6]

Yet another night of frustration...we did have one wire incorrect, we didn't have the negative side of the cam signal going into the eDist but we fixed that and we did see spark but it was very inconsistent and very very weak. At times we wouldn't even see 3 EST signals on the O-Scope for every 1 Cam signal....other times we'd see 5, regardless we are definitely getting really weak EST signals from the SP, any idea why? This is consistent with the way the truck ran on the MSD 6A and cap and rotor, at lower RPMS the truck really struggled, but once the RPMS rose above say 1500RPM things would work great. Its like the EST signal strenght rises significantly with RPM, I've also noticed when everything was cold temp wise it ran fine but once it got hot it would run a lot worse...anyways, if we can't fix/check the SP somehow I'm gonna have to sell the set up and go with another system, I really don't want to do this but this set up has really been a big disappointment...hopefully we can get everything sorted out....Thanks for you help.

 

[OddfireV6]

Well I hate to be the bearer of bad news but an Oddfire SP and eDist do not work together...we have tried everything imaginable but the best the set up would do is give a very very weak spark to plugs...despite being told if the eDist box is getting both signals then the eDist is working, well I have 2 eDist boxes thanks to Lance and neither one works....the signals that come from the SP are very weak and inconsistent so it is no wonder my truck never ran good on a consistent basis...the signals coming out of the SP are barely 2volts and we don't even see 6 EST signals for every 1 cam signal...while the FAST crew has attempted to rectify the situation I am really disappointed in this set up especially for the ~ $4,000 for the SP and eDist set up...I am giving up on this set up and going TEC3...if anyone is interested in an Oddfire SP let me know Please note that I am not knocking FAST their evenfire systems, eDist, and Trans controllers are great they just have issues getting the Oddfire stuffs to work properly, its just my opinion but if I were them I would track down all Oddfire customers and offer them a refund if they so desire...anyway I hope everyone else out there has better luck...

 

[Craig Smith]

Well, I wish I knew what to tell you here. I simply cannot for the life of me think of a reason that the outputs from the eDist would be anything other than 0 or 5 volts to the LS1 coils. These signals are coming from devices not capable of running at 2 volts, and if you have 2 of them doing the same thing, there absolutely must be something else in the equation that just hasn't been found yet.

I don't know where you are, but I bet if you bring the whole mess to us, we can make it work. I'd hate to see you can the whole setup out of frustration. I understand that it's frustrating though and I'd like to help, but I think the only way for us to help you through this one is to bring the whole car to us. Kick the idea around for a while and let me know. Now is a decent time to arrange something like this because I don't have any work-related travel plans for a few weeks yet.

 

[OddfireV6]

That would be tough to do, I haven't worked in over a year so $$ is tight. I'd love to take you up on the offer but I just don't see it happening. I live in Chicago, if you are in the area anytime soon let me know What if I sent you/Lance my SP and e-Dist and see if you can even getting it working on a bench??? I could send you my harness and coils as well so we could rule them out as well??? Let me know what you think? Thanks for the offer it means a lot, I've been through hell with this truck especially when it comes to electronics.

 

[Roland Black]

hey Ryan;

Sorry to see your post here, and that you, Rich and BG are still having major headaches. It's been a long rough road for you guys paving the way for others getting that odd fire - Edist working on your way kewl Typhoon.

Keep the faith...... trucks gonna be BAT when it's gets running right. Wishing you the best,

 

[Craig Smith]

I understand it's tough both time-wise and financially. But, I think bringing it here would certainly be a lot cheaper than buying another engine management system, would you agree?

Here at our shop, we have every resource we need to fix virtually any problem. Not only do I not have travel plans to Chicago for quite some time, but it's always more of a gamble that way anyhow. You never know what you'll find or what it will take to fix it, and being here instead of there will cover those bases.

If it looks like you can make it sometime, please let me know and we can arrange something.