Chevman2448
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- Nov 15, 2013
See if i can get this to work..... Looks like it worked. This is the file I made off of the original. I didnt edit too much of it from the original that was in the unit when I got it.
Tuning a Classic FAST
- Thread starter Chevman2448
- Start date
- Joined
- Aug 1, 2003
wow thats some file you got there ( sarcastic)
you need to set your fuel calc parameters
shows 256 cubes, 2 bar map sensor and 56# injectors ???? is this your setup
if not fix those settings
wont comment on crank tables as some of those would be adjusted based on the injector you are running , and the tables for decay arent what i like but if they are working for you so be it its just startup, as long as the aft start decays out so closed loop can operate
you have your knock detection retard turnded ( qouting john lequizamo ) off which would be ok for c16 fuel only
parameters show 0/0/.5
if you want spark retard based on knock sensor youll want to move those up , street until your sure it doesnt knock use 20/2/.5
under idle functions
throttle follower ....at 13% tps its set for 35 steps... thats the min the iac will go so trim that down so the iac can move below 35 if thats where it needs to go to maintain idle
idle params ...you're set iac p 60/d 8 /min 6 , set those to 30/9 / and 1 above your tps at idle
under op params rev limiter is 5200/5000 , move that up... its a fuel cutoff and you should be able to handle more than 5200 rpm..if running alky you never want to hit a fuel cut off so set it really high.
inj opening time in op params is set at 1.5 , that makes the injector opening at idle longer than what you see , doesnt affect boost fuel much but at idle its a lot , like 30% more ... try 1.0
closed loop idle param is set 1000 on 700 off it should be ok but i use 800-700
if the rpm dips below 700 youll need to see 1000 before correction will return
af table needs lots of work off idle its way too rich once you get going, especially boost areas in the 9s
spark table needs work in cruise area (could use more as much as 40 on highway ) and too much timing in all boost areas for pump gas and even more than i like with alky
on your fuel tables ..ALLof the AE tables i looked at are screwed up
open the 'demo ' program that is in your c-com folder (its a stage2 v6 program for 83# race gas) and transfer those values from that programs AE fuel tables,
the tables that enrich with inj % should be adjusted based on your injector vs an 83 injector , so for example you have 42# the enrich values should be doubled to get the same fuel enrich as with 83#
your MAP AE params are AE map limit 78/ threshold 5/ decay 96 , move the AE map limit to 110 or so so its into boost before the enrich for map rise goes away , the threshold and decay settings are ok
all this should have been fixed before turning the key
you need to set your fuel calc parameters
shows 256 cubes, 2 bar map sensor and 56# injectors ???? is this your setup
if not fix those settings
wont comment on crank tables as some of those would be adjusted based on the injector you are running , and the tables for decay arent what i like but if they are working for you so be it its just startup, as long as the aft start decays out so closed loop can operate
you have your knock detection retard turnded ( qouting john lequizamo ) off which would be ok for c16 fuel only
parameters show 0/0/.5
if you want spark retard based on knock sensor youll want to move those up , street until your sure it doesnt knock use 20/2/.5
under idle functions
throttle follower ....at 13% tps its set for 35 steps... thats the min the iac will go so trim that down so the iac can move below 35 if thats where it needs to go to maintain idle
idle params ...you're set iac p 60/d 8 /min 6 , set those to 30/9 / and 1 above your tps at idle
under op params rev limiter is 5200/5000 , move that up... its a fuel cutoff and you should be able to handle more than 5200 rpm..if running alky you never want to hit a fuel cut off so set it really high.
inj opening time in op params is set at 1.5 , that makes the injector opening at idle longer than what you see , doesnt affect boost fuel much but at idle its a lot , like 30% more ... try 1.0
closed loop idle param is set 1000 on 700 off it should be ok but i use 800-700
if the rpm dips below 700 youll need to see 1000 before correction will return
af table needs lots of work off idle its way too rich once you get going, especially boost areas in the 9s
spark table needs work in cruise area (could use more as much as 40 on highway ) and too much timing in all boost areas for pump gas and even more than i like with alky
on your fuel tables ..ALLof the AE tables i looked at are screwed up
open the 'demo ' program that is in your c-com folder (its a stage2 v6 program for 83# race gas) and transfer those values from that programs AE fuel tables,
the tables that enrich with inj % should be adjusted based on your injector vs an 83 injector , so for example you have 42# the enrich values should be doubled to get the same fuel enrich as with 83#
your MAP AE params are AE map limit 78/ threshold 5/ decay 96 , move the AE map limit to 110 or so so its into boost before the enrich for map rise goes away , the threshold and decay settings are ok
all this should have been fixed before turning the key
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Chevman2448
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- Joined
- Nov 15, 2013
"you need to set your fuel calc parameters
shows 256 cubes, 2 bar map sensor and 56# injectors ???? is this your setup
if not fix those settings"
Yes this is basically how the car was setup in the tune when I got it. Ive changed the idle characteristics, and some numbers in the VE table but otherwise this is how the original tune looks.
As far as the settings go for cubes, yes this is correct. It is a 4.1 .060 over. The 56 lb injectors are also correct. With a T60 turbonetics turbo. I bought the car like this. I bought fuel delivery parts (FPR, PUMP, Tank, Larger lines and a few other things. I was aware that it was a CLUSTER when I got it. But I was unaware it was THAT bad. It was supposedly tuned by a PRO shop. Apparently it either wasnt or they really didnt have a clue as to what they were doing. Either way I cant point fingers. I have the hardware to fix it so I will.
shows 256 cubes, 2 bar map sensor and 56# injectors ???? is this your setup
if not fix those settings"
Yes this is basically how the car was setup in the tune when I got it. Ive changed the idle characteristics, and some numbers in the VE table but otherwise this is how the original tune looks.
As far as the settings go for cubes, yes this is correct. It is a 4.1 .060 over. The 56 lb injectors are also correct. With a T60 turbonetics turbo. I bought the car like this. I bought fuel delivery parts (FPR, PUMP, Tank, Larger lines and a few other things. I was aware that it was a CLUSTER when I got it. But I was unaware it was THAT bad. It was supposedly tuned by a PRO shop. Apparently it either wasnt or they really didnt have a clue as to what they were doing. Either way I cant point fingers. I have the hardware to fix it so I will.
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Chevman2448
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- Nov 15, 2013
Ok I pretty much reset everything to these specs. I can find the demo program (says "demo" I assume) but how do I transfer those fuel tables over to my program without going through each and individually writing them down?
Also on the spark table. Where would I start on that? It has 3.42 gears. So where would a best guess be as to the cruising rpms?
The only time I have driven this car anywhere is around the block and back.
Also on the spark table. Where would I start on that? It has 3.42 gears. So where would a best guess be as to the cruising rpms?
The only time I have driven this car anywhere is around the block and back.
- Joined
- Aug 1, 2003
are you running a 2bar map sensor , or a 3bar ? the program is set for a 2bar and it matters
the 2bar will only register up to 15psi boost
light cruise with 4 speed will be around 1600(locked) -2200 not locked , higher with three speed, little lower with 28" tires and at kpa around 50-60 ( about -5psi or 10 in/hg vac)
and at light throttle cruise you can run more timing and leaner (aka lean cruise ) in the area of 40-45 degrees and 15.0-16.0 A/F though i usually set that area at 40 deg and 14.5
the 2bar will only register up to 15psi boost
light cruise with 4 speed will be around 1600(locked) -2200 not locked , higher with three speed, little lower with 28" tires and at kpa around 50-60 ( about -5psi or 10 in/hg vac)
and at light throttle cruise you can run more timing and leaner (aka lean cruise ) in the area of 40-45 degrees and 15.0-16.0 A/F though i usually set that area at 40 deg and 14.5
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Chevman2448
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- Nov 15, 2013
Im not exactly sure on the map sensor, I figured since it was working it was good to go and the only numbers I found in it were 8867299. It was on the car when I got it.
The trans is a 200 4R 4 speed trans. Car has DOT MT street tires on it. 275/50 R15
Here is my map sensor
ACDELCO Part # 2131520 More Info {#12569241, 16009886, 16040609, 213184}
SENSOR,MAP(Engine) 886 STAMPED
The trans is a 200 4R 4 speed trans. Car has DOT MT street tires on it. 275/50 R15
Here is my map sensor
ACDELCO Part # 2131520 More Info {#12569241, 16009886, 16040609, 213184}
SENSOR,MAP(Engine) 886 STAMPED
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Chevman2448
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- Nov 15, 2013
Checked. It reads 101 Kpa. Ignition on not running.
Based on the numbers it is a 2 bar map sensor.
Based on the numbers it is a 2 bar map sensor.
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Chevman2448
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- Nov 15, 2013
I switched the injectors to the 1.0 duty cycle and the engine stopped running immediately. I did adapt some of what you stated in your earlier post and the idle doesnt surge anymore between 850-1000 rpms. The IAC is also now hitting its target consistently. So its getting closer. I just have to figure out how to get those fuel tables transferred.
Honestly it runs but if its going to be easier to tune and work with, with larger injectors, I will buy a set of them. I figured they were a bit small for what the engine is.
Honestly it runs but if its going to be easier to tune and work with, with larger injectors, I will buy a set of them. I figured they were a bit small for what the engine is.
Chevman2448
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- Nov 15, 2013
FP is 40lbs at hot idle. It pretty much stays there unless I rev the engine.
But yes this thing runs WAY too rich.
But yes this thing runs WAY too rich.
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Chevman2448
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- Nov 15, 2013
Would putting larger injectors in the engine make the tuning process a bit easier? Every time I change the injector cycle it dies and wont start unless I change it back. Its like the engine needs that to even operate since the injectors seem to be smaller than they need to be. I know my VE table and spark tables are way off from what they should be. It just seems like they just cant keep up with the demand. Which is why the settings in the tune are so rich and so far out there.
Chevman2448
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- Nov 15, 2013
Ah.....that makes sense. Sorry computer tuning isnt something that I have extensive or more appropriately have any knowledge about what so ever.
You knew that already though.
And based on your previous questions...should I be running a 3 bar map instead of the 2?
You knew that already though.
And based on your previous questions...should I be running a 3 bar map instead of the 2?
Chevman2448
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- Nov 15, 2013
Well I changed the INJ DC to 1.0 and changed some of the VE table numbers. I took pictures of the screen vs writing the damn stuff down. SO much easier. I realize the rest of the numbers need to be adjusted but this was just to get it running. The numbers I changed in the program is what it took to get it running and in the 13.1 A/F range with no correction in the O2. From the 52 (5 lines up 3 over from the bottom L) 5 lines to the last 52 down three spaces to the 44 and back to the left where there is another 41 is what I changed to get it to run (15 squares). Hindsight says I could have highlighted the area but then you wouldnt be able to read the numbers. Those numbers were in the mid 20's before. Hope that is easy to understand.
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Chevman2448
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- Nov 15, 2013
I dont even know where the boost is set at now because I havent really driven the car.
Chevman2448
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- Nov 15, 2013
Aft. Correction is at zero. Is the second picture not showing up? Its a picture of the Dash.
I actually just happened to shoot it when it stated zero. Just letting it idle the range moves around. If i move a number too high in the VE table the correction tells me its removing fuel or if the VE is too low it adds. So it moves just at idle. And no I havent watched what happens when I blip the throttle.
Aft. Correct is on the left side of the screen between Air Temp and VE %
I actually just happened to shoot it when it stated zero. Just letting it idle the range moves around. If i move a number too high in the VE table the correction tells me its removing fuel or if the VE is too low it adds. So it moves just at idle. And no I havent watched what happens when I blip the throttle.
Aft. Correct is on the left side of the screen between Air Temp and VE %
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