Starter/Flywheel on the way out?

J

JustABuick

Active Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
Hey all,

My car has had an issue where if it's not up to operating temperature (about 160), and it goes into drive or reverse, it stalls out. No problem, it would always start right back up. Last month I switched over to E85, the mods are in my sig. Ran fine the first few times I had the car out testing it. I dropped the fuel pressure 5-7psi down to 43-44 per Eric's instructions for a new chip. First time after the fuel pressure was adjusted, the car stalled (it was before it warmed up to operating temp). No big deal, I go to start it and it cranks but doesn't fire. Try it again with the same result. It cranks and has a rapid clicking/grinding sound and doesn't fire. Waited about 5 minutes, then it finally fired and idled very low, I blipped the throttle and it sped up to normal idle. I reset the chip today and it still did the same thing. It starts fine on cold starts, but it will grind/click when it dies from not being up to operating temperature. I'll try to get a video later today to demonstrate. Any ideas?

Thanks,
Kelly
 
Battery is good. It's just odd that it only makes the noise and has trouble starting after it stalls out. It never has issues on cold starts. The car has made the battery click before, and this is another sound entirely.
 
A bad module will cause the motor to just crank when it gets hot...or sometimes the car won't even crank. I've had both happen. Doesn't explain the grinding noise, so maybe you have more than one issue. Maybe bad fuel pump? How many miles on the car?
 
Sounds to me like one of your issues is a fueling problem . On my sd2 chip I can pull fuel durning cranking . With e85 when my motor isn't up to temp it has a hard time starting . When u drop it in gear it puts a load on the motor so it seems to me as you are runing to rich and need to pull fuel . What is your plugs gapped to? Ohm the coil pack I believe it should be around 12-13ohms
 
It's your torque converter!! Everyone I know that has a multi disk precision TQ, including me, and my Son-In-Law have the same issue. Putting the car in gear when cold will stall the engine. The combination of cold fluid and that stack up of disks is what kills the engine.
 
GNRick said:
A bad module will cause the motor to just crank when it gets hot...or sometimes the car won't even crank. I've had both happen. Doesn't explain the grinding noise, so maybe you have more than one issue. Maybe bad fuel pump? How many miles on the car?
Click to expand...

The pump is a brand new DW300, it sounds like it's running fine. The true mileage of the car is unknown and I bought it as a roller, the engine I bought for it had 90,000 on it, and I've maybe put 1,500 miles on it.

dank GN said:
Sounds to me like one of your issues is a fueling problem . On my sd2 chip I can pull fuel durning cranking . With e85 when my motor isn't up to temp it has a hard time starting . When u drop it in gear it puts a load on the motor so it seems to me as you are runing to rich and need to pull fuel . What is your plugs gapped to? Ohm the coil pack I believe it should be around 12-13ohms
Click to expand...

The plugs are still gapped at what I needed for my 93 octane combo, I know I'll have to change those, but thought it wouldn't make a difference until I go out and race/ get some WOT blasts in.

TurboDave said:
It's your torque converter!! Everyone I know that has a multi disk precision TQ, including me, and my Son-In-Law have the same issue. Putting the car in gear when cold will stall the engine. The combination of cold fluid and that stack up of disks is what kills the engine.
Click to expand...

Hmmm, very interesting, I've never heard that before. Thanks. I wonder what could cause the grinding noise? Maybe since the plugs don't have the E85 gap, once it stalls out, they aren't hot enough to fire it up again quickly.
 
Having some issues embedding the videos. I tried to do it from Facebook, how do you all embed videos on here? Sorry for the rookie question!

Kelly
 
Well, until I figure out how to correctly embed them, here are links to the videos I posted on the Facebook page. First link is cold start in 5 degree temps, so it cranks longer than usual. 2nd video is when it's put in gear before up to operating temp, so it dies, then it makes the odd noise on the restart.
https://www.facebook.com/kelly.orsborn/videos/g.160486600651072/1247975368550343/?type=2&theater
https://www.facebook.com/kelly.orsborn/videos/g.160486600651072/1247975368550343/?type=2&theater
https://www.facebook.com/kelly.orsborn/videos/g.160486600651072/1247991405215406/?type=2&theater
 
JustABuick said:
Well, until I figure out how to correctly embed them, here are links to the videos I posted on the Facebook page. First link is cold start in 5 degree temps, so it cranks longer than usual. 2nd video is when it's put in gear before up to operating temp, so it dies, then it makes the odd noise on the restart.
https://www.facebook.com/kelly.orsborn/videos/g.160486600651072/1247975368550343/?type=2&theater
https://www.facebook.com/kelly.orsborn/videos/g.160486600651072/1247991405215406/?type=2&theater
Click to expand...
Videos didn't work for me
To recap: grinding is separate issue from the stalling most likely. And as said before bad grounds can cause strange starter behavior. I'd check for damaged flywheel teeth also.
The starter drive gear has a one way clutch in it, I've heard those make a hell of weird noise. That could be it if everything else is good.
 
No disintegrations said:
Videos didn't work for me
To recap: grinding is separate issue from the stalling most likely. And as said before bad grounds can cause strange starter behavior. I'd check for damaged flywheel teeth also.
The starter drive gear has a one way clutch in it, I've heard those make a hell of weird noise. That could be it if everything else is good.
Click to expand...

Hmmm, I wish it would let me upload the videos directly on this post. I may have to get a youtube account just to embed them here. I'll check the grounds and flywheel, but the reason I mention the stalling is because it ONLY makes the noise after the car has stalled, cold starts are fine.
 
It sounds like the starter is dragging. With the problems you are having you are probably working the starter a lot more than usual and it is probably hot even though the engine temp is not. It also sounds like it needs a little shim adjustment. I ended up having a 10/1000th thicker shim on engine side of mine to make it quiet.
 
DarthBuick said:
It sounds like the starter is dragging. With the problems you are having you are probably working the starter a lot more than usual and it is probably hot even though the engine temp is not. It also sounds like it needs a little shim adjustment. I ended up having a 10/1000th thicker shim on engine side of mine to make it quiet.
Click to expand...

Thanks, so do you think a shim adjustment would help it out? Or is this a situation where a more powerful aftermarket starter would be worth it?
 
I've tried that method, and I've tried the "embed" method, and I get errors for both. I will try it again tonight when I get home
 
The starter may be on the way out and I would take care of it before you damage the flexplate teeth. Or it could be the battery because they can do weird things like the amps can drop but you still have 12 volts. As a starter starts to go out it will draw more amps. That is how they test a starter is they see how many amps it takes to turn.
If it was mine I would do the cheapest and easiest 1st
#1 I would borrow a battery or use a jump box to see it it helps.
#2 Check cables and ground
#3 Starter
This is just for your starter problems
 
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