Pipedreams

[Shane]

I thought I would bounce this one off of you guys.

My GN has been in a few accidents, only minor cosmetic damage, but annoying nonetheless (CT drivers keep hitting me).

For a while I've been laying the groundwork for building my own ECM. I'm thinking that I could replace the entire ECM with a PC running Win XP.

From how I understand it, the ECM is just like any other computer, it takes a set of inputs, runs some conversions and calculations on them, and makes a set of outputs. This could easily be done with a PC.

The benefits of this would be obvious. Rather than running TurboLink, you could see all the readings in realtime straight off the sensors on a monitor. The computer could be programmed to cut off the throttle when there is too much knock, or activate another fuel pump to get rid of it. Customization of the car would become a lot easier.

Then, you have all the ricey options. You could watch DVD's, or play MP3's right over the stereo. A touch screen monitor could replace all the switches in the car. Imagine touching a screen to turn on the headlights. Or even a custom password to even turn the car on.

Here's what I am thinking. For a while I've dreamed of getting a 1940 Buick Coupe and fixing it up. My uncle had a roadster when I was a kid, and that's what made me fall in love with cars.

Sooooo...... get a 1940 Buick Coupe and put my (tired) GN Motor in it (after a through rebuild). I would put the GN Rims, Badges, and as much of the trim as I could make fit. Paint it black (of course), and then custom build the interior. I'm thinking of putting the GN interior in it, after the leather kit that I see advertised.

Finally, this could be the car that I make my ECM idea work on. Custom dash with a LCD touchscreen monitor instead of a instrument panel anyone?

Obviously this is not a daily driver, and I won't have it finished tomorrow or the day after that. I want to make it a long project where I build up the car into a show car that can still kill some ricers on the street/strip.

1940 Buick Grand National, anyone?

What do you guys think? Is this possible?

 

[strikeeagle]

Sounds fascinating...



And expensive...



You'd certainly stand to learn a lot along the way. And it'd be unique...



I'm more into the Mad Max look. Give me an aluminum dash with 8 or so big, fat Autometer Pro Comps...

 

[1badTTA]

At a recent computer exposition (COMDEX), Bill Gates reportedly compared the computer industry with the auto industry and stated: "If General Motors had kept up with the technology like the computer industry has, we would all be driving $25.00 cars that got 1,000 miles to the gallon."

In response to Bill's comments, GM reportedly issued a press release stating:

"If General Motors had developed technology like Microsoft, we would all be
driving cars with the following characteristics:

1. For no reason whatsoever, your car would crash twice a day.

2. Every time they repainted the lines in the road, you would have to buy a new car.

3. Occasionally your car would die on the freeway for no reason. You would have to pull over to the side of the road, close all of the windows, shut off the car, restart it, and reopen the windows before you could continue. For some reason, you would simply accept this.

4. Occasionally, executing a maneuver such as a left turn would cause your car to shut down and refuse to restart, in which case you would have to reinstall the engine.

5. Macintosh would make a car that was powered by the sun, was reliable, five times as fast and twice as easy to drive - but would run on only five percent of the roads.

6. The oil, water temperature, and alternator warning lights would all be replaced by a single "General Protection Fault" warning light.

7. The airbag system would ask, "Are you sure?" before deploying.

8. Occasionally, for no reason whatsoever, your car would lock you out and refuse to let you in until you simultaneously lifted the door handle, turned the key and grabbed hold of the radio antenna.

9. Every time GM introduced a new car, car buyers would have to learn to drive all over again because none of the controls would operate in the same manner as the old car.

10. You'd have to press the "Start" button to turn the engine off!

 

[cimi4749]

and that my friend is why i use a mac.. talk as much trash as u like but i grew up on a p.c. ..... my mom goes out and gets a mac... i almost killed her,,,, never got any errors.... so i swtiched and i can do everything a p.c. does... everything without the constant blunders

 

[Shane]

You'd certainly stand to learn a lot along the way.

See, the Navy has already taught me quite a bit about instrumentation and how it links up to the computer. What I really need to do is get some chip programming software and maybe another ECM and start reverse engineering it.

I think it could be done.

 

[wagon]

Just a question: What happens if the computer freezes? Would you be better off using a PLC, and just using the computer to monitor and change that, instead of actually running the car?

Brian

 

[NeXuS1]

if you really wanted a custom system running your car. why not build something off a linux core. then you can build the OS exactly how you want it. nice thing about open source software you can change whatever you want if you know how to program.

 

[wagon]

One more thing, whell, actually two:
Running it directly off of the computer, is it going to be fast enough to control things like injectors and timing adjustments when the motor is spinning 5000rpm?

Last thing, for now. If you were running a stand alone computer, you could go out to your car, turn the key and start it. If you do it by computer, you are going to have to wait for it to boot up. Although if it's a custom car, it won't be as bad as doing it in a daily driver.
Don't want to rain on your parade, it does sound like a neat idea, but I was just wondering how you would handle these issues.

Brian

 

[SinistrV6]

I've got a suggestion...

Come on down and experiment with this idea in my '36 Chevy (just don't get in the way). Set it up and see if it'll work. If it does, leave the prototype in my car (for free, of course) and then build a new one in your '40 Buick with your experience from building the one in my car!

Deal? OK. Just tell me when you want to strart


Just kidding with you. It does sound like a neat project. Good luck!

As for the '40 GN idea, I've got a jumpstart on you. My '36 (I know, it's a Chevy but '30's Buicks are next to impossible to find). The whole "what if they'd built a GN in the 30's/40's?" was my concept from the beginning.

There's a guy over on the www.T6P.com forum (TURBO DAVE) who just finished putting a full GN motor setup in a customer's '39 Buick 4-dr. The car is beautiful! Only the drivetrain is "GN" but the car is silver ('39 T-Type?)

Links to pics of my "work in progress" at the WWW button below.

 

[Pronto]

Maybe a hybreed system that keeps the ecm for some basic functions but the computer can take over for higher info?

 

[Shane]

What happens if the computer freezes? Would you be better off using a PLC, and just using the computer to monitor and change that, instead of actually running the car?

I want the computer to actually run the car.

I've thought about it, and I realize that the computer crashing is a possibility. However, you have to remember that Win XP is more stable when it is running on its own, or just with a few programs. Its when you start piling the programs on that the computer gets confused and crashes.

Crashing would obviously be a bad thing, so I think I would include a regular ECM for just such an occaision. Throwing a switch to go over from the PC to the ECM for emergency driving. I think that this would be possible. It would be similar to switching the key off and then right back on. The engine stumbles, but returns. While going 80 mph on the highway, I wouldn't mind a stumble if I had to wait for the reboot.

why not build something off a linux core.

Thought about that, and tried it.... well kind of. I spent about 6 months trying to teach myself how to USE linux, let alone program in it. I couldn't fathom it, so I moved on. On the other hand, I am damned windoze savvy, so I took a few programming classes in college, and I think I have the foundation to start.

Running it directly off of the computer, is it going to be fast enough to control things like injectors and timing adjustments when the motor is spinning 5000rpm?

This I do not know. I think that it could be, but it would require some testing. I think that serial may be a little too slow to take all the input in, so I would have to figure out how to do it over a USB input. That complicates things. I understand how to program in serial inputs, but USB confuses me.

Last thing, for now. If you were running a stand alone computer, you could go out to your car, turn the key and start it. If you do it by computer, you are going to have to wait for it to boot up. Although if it's a custom car, it won't be as bad as doing it in a daily driver.

That's exactly true, and I've realized it from the start. It would be kind of an annoyance, but computers today tend to boot up in less than a minute so its not that annoying. Like you said, its going to be a custom car, a weekend cruiser, so an extra 50 seconds waiting to start it wouldn't be that bad.

As for the '40 GN idea, I've got a jumpstart on you. My '36 (I know, it's a Chevy but '30's Buicks are next to impossible to find). The whole "what if they'd built a GN in the 30's/40's?" was my concept from the beginning.

Hmm, I like your idea then! Or perhaps, great minds think alike? I'll have to check out your site.

Finally....

Don't want to rain on your parade, it does sound like a neat idea

Don't worry about it. I can stand the critisim. I came up with this idea about a year ago, and have been rattleing out the in's and out's in my head ever since.


One of the guys on *ahem* the unmentionable board recommended using an eprom emulator. I never thought of that, but it's a great idea. That's why I posted here, to hear other people's inputs.

 

[Little6pack]

Yeah an ECM/Computer controlled car..

As you drive away & your computer is up & running correctly
you could have an ECM cutout.. If the Computer dies or the Software chokes the ecm comes back on as backup.

Or to make it simple why not just run the whole setup on the ECM & make life easy on yourself?

Don't forget to add some POWER 6 Logos on the car when you are done.

 

[Shane]

Or to make it simple why not just run the whole setup on the ECM & make life easy on yourself?

For the most part.... I spend months underneith the ocean clicking away on a laptop to kill some time. I already have my dream house designed in AutoCAD, it's time for a new project.

It would be unique too, something not everyone has. It wouldn't even have to be in the coupe, it would be cool in my GN as well.

Think of the possibilities. With a few touches you could change the timing, up the boost (with an integrated Boost Controller), turn on the headlights, open the wastegate, turn on alky, etc.

 

[salvageV6]

You need a Real Time Deterministic hardware/software package to do everything safely.

Labview and National Instruments hardware.

http://sine.ni.com/apps/we/nioc.vp?cid=3304&lang=US

You could run the whole car on this stuff.

Amazing how good that little silver box was back then.