Octane rating on E20 and E30?

[forcefed86]

Just had a new "blender" e85 station pop-up a block from my house. No octane ratings on the e10,e20,e30 pumps.

Trying to decide which to run.

Also since it's winter here now the E85 pump is marked 70% ethanol(we'll call this E70). So are the blends also made from the E70?

Ie I'd probably want to run e30 in the winter and e20 in the summer?

Thanks

 

[novaderrik]

as far as i know, all E85 you buy is blended right at the pump by mixing a certain amount of ethanol with 87 octane gasoline. the blender pumps just let you choose how much to mix in it.

as for the octane ratings, i think E50 is something like 96 octane or so, with E20 and E30 being a little bit lower than that.
i try to run E50 in my T Type- it runs just as strong as a full load of E85, but still gets the same mileage as 87 octane and runs a little better after a cold startup than E85.

 

[supramantrm]

50-50

did you change chips or tune to run 50-50 ?Do you know your air fuels with 50-50 your running?

 

[novaderrik]

i didn't change a thing, other than pulling up to a different pump.
i also don't know what my air/fuel ratios or antyhing like that are- i just know it works.
someday i will do things "right", but in the meantime, i'll settle for just having it work.

 

[b4black]

For the vast majority of retail sites, E85 is blended at the fuel terminal and in the underground storage tank at the station. E20 and E30 would be blended by the dispesner using the 87 regular (E10) and E85.

E20 would be 89 octane and E30 about 91.

 

[usetaboost]

e20 is 92, e 30 is 95 octane. I too am wondering about this. We just got this at the station that used to sell the coveted 93 octane. It's hard to comeby anything over 91 around here unless you go to e85 which obly a few select stations have that are around me. I'm gonna get a chip for 91, but I wonder if that e30 95 can be used with that chip??? Let's get someone in here to shed some light on this blended juice....Ahem!

 

[jdpolzin]

Jesse, have Eric burn the chip for E30.

 

[usetaboost]

As far as I know that is the only station that has that fuel mix around here. 90% of the gas stations on this side are all 87, 89, and 91 octane. Fluckin casey's doesn't even sell premium fuel. A handfull here have E85 and 93 octane at best. Does the higher blend fuel require that much more adjustment and fuel?

 

[usetaboost]

now you got me lookin around the e85 forum. See what you did

 

[forcefed86]

For the vast majority of retail sites, E85 is blended at the fuel terminal and in the underground storage tank at the station. E20 and E30 would be blended by the dispesner using the 87 regular (E10) and E85.

E20 would be 89 octane and E30 about 91.

Where are you getting your octane information from?

Using a race gas mixing calculator heres what I have found. Ethanol according to wikipedia is 116 octane. I was told when calculating E85 this is not the value to use. Actual readings should be (R+M)/2. I was told to use 113 for ethanol octane rating when mixing ethanol fuels.

So mixing 3 gallons of 113 with 7 gallons 87. I come up with 94.8 octane. This would be a 30% mix (E30). 92.2 (E20) 89.8 (e10). If anything these numbers are conservatively low. Seeing as most 91 octane (around here anyway) contains 10% ethanol (e10).


I have since my original post converted my DD 1993 eagle talon turbo AWD to e30.

It can be done with very minimal effort. My chip was burnt for 11:1 AFR's @ WOT and 17* total timing under boost. The ONLY thing I did to run e30 was up my base fuel pressure from 37psi(Stock) To 43psi.

Pre e30 I was able to run 20lbs of boost @ 17* timing. I did run a 7gph 100% meth inj on top of this. Without it I would see knock at 17+psi.

With e30 I run 20* total timing and 25psi. 50/50 mix of meth/water. Zero knock. High and low fuel trims are at 100 (meaning ECU is not adding or removing fuel.

The only issue I've had is my idle fuel trims are now maxed out (139). Once warm, idle is still between 14.5-15.5 AFR's. On initial start the car does require me to slightly depress the pedal and hold it for the first minute or two. Once warmed up the car idles/drives/boosts as normal.

This upcoming spring I plan on starting out with e20 in the buick. Possibly making my way up to e30.

Hope this helps someone.

 

[forzfed]

Here, our 94 is 10%E and has mtbe in it. I and other people have driven our stock TB's with 26' timing chips and 0 knock. One buddy ran a high 12 at 104.5 mph in a stock TB with the Thrasher 100 chip and 94 and 0 knock according to TL. He probably could have gone mid 12's but his 60 ft's were in the high 1.9x range.

 

[forcefed86]

Where are you getting your octane information from?

Using a race gas mixing calculator heres what I have found. Ethanol according to wikipedia is 116 octane. I was told when calculating E85 this is not the value to use. Actual readings should be (R+M)/2. I was told to use 113 for ethanol octane rating when mixing ethanol fuels.

So mixing 3 gallons of 113 with 7 gallons 87. I come up with 94.8 octane. This would be a 30% mix (E30). 92.2 (E20) 89.8 (e10). If anything these numbers are conservatively low. Seeing as most 91 octane (around here anyway) contains 10% ethanol (e10).


I have since my original post converted my DD 1993 eagle talon turbo AWD to e30.

It can be done with very minimal effort. My chip was burnt for 11:1 AFR's @ WOT and 17* total timing under boost. The ONLY thing I did to run e30 was up my base fuel pressure from 37psi(Stock) To 43psi.

Pre e30 I was able to run 20lbs of boost @ 17* timing. I did run a 7gph 100% meth inj on top of this. Without it I would see knock at 17+psi.

With e30 I run 20* total timing and 25psi. 50/50 mix of meth/water. Zero knock. High and low fuel trims are at 100 (meaning ECU is not adding or removing fuel.

The only issue I've had is my idle fuel trims are now maxed out (139). Once warm, idle is still between 14.5-15.5 AFR's. On initial start the car does require me to slightly depress the pedal and hold it for the first minute or two. Once warmed up the car idles/drives/boosts as normal.

This upcoming spring I plan on starting out with e20 in the buick. Possibly making my way up to e30.

Hope this helps someone.

Need to make a few corrections to the above.

Base fuel pressure was close to 45 not 43. I had set pressure to 43. Then installed a hot-wire kit to the fuel pump. I didn't re-check the pressure until now. Didn't think it would effect it that much!

Also I since the addition of 50/50 meth/water vs. 100% meth injection the mid and high fuel trims have richened up the mixture 10 counts each.