How is your idle quality? In closedloop the idle surges or "hunts" as the a/f drifts from 14.7 and the ecm corrects. In openloop with fuel taken out to maintain 13.9-14.1 it pretty much idles like glass.
Mike
LC1 install getting #8 error code. Faulty 02?
- Thread starter darkred87T
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How is your idle quality? In closedloop the idle surges or "hunts" as the a/f drifts from 14.7 and the ecm corrects. In openloop with fuel taken out to maintain 13.9-14.1 it pretty much idles like glass.
Mike
Pretty good actually. Not perfect, as they never were from the day they were built. :wink: Smooth enought that it doesn't bother me.
Idling in open loop with the A/F ration at around 14.0:1 should be smoother than closed loop.
Like most of our cars, they're all different. Some idle in closed loop well, some don't.
Idling in open loop with the A/F ration at around 14.0:1 should be smoother than closed loop.
Like most of our cars, they're all different. Some idle in closed loop well, some don't.
yep in closed loop idle it would often stall out and AFR was going from 19-9 when I switched to open loop it purs like a kitten.....and WB controls the idle fuel and i have it set for 11.5...
Fair enough. I guess I got use to that silky smooth openloop idle since my Thrasher days and stuck with it through the trans +/extender setup and now the MAFPro.
Mike
darkred87T
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- Oct 27, 2003
Absolutely. My last oil change was like water so I now I won't even drive it until I can fugure out what's going on with it.
You say 13.9?
My AF ratio is all over the place so all I can tell you is that it's somewhere between 10:1 and 12:1 during warm up (black smoke out the exhaust) and closed loop it's high 13's to high 14's but hunting all over the place. I don't know what the heck to do with it.
Sorry man I sorta highjacked your thread.
With you idle...
That powerlogger file shows cell 12 set to 0 which is closed loop. Do you have the MAFpro setup to part throttle tracking using the wb? Something is going on that resembles both nb and wb being in control (notice how when the wideband goes rich the nb reports lean). How do you have the mafpro wired in? Are you using the Casper's harness? If so I have the fix.
Like it was said earlier, either set cell 12 to 8 or set PTT gain to 0. I recommend setting PTT gain to 0 for now. Do that and post another PL file.
Mike
With you idle...
That powerlogger file shows cell 12 set to 0 which is closed loop. Do you have the MAFpro setup to part throttle tracking using the wb? Something is going on that resembles both nb and wb being in control (notice how when the wideband goes rich the nb reports lean). How do you have the mafpro wired in? Are you using the Casper's harness? If so I have the fix.
Like it was said earlier, either set cell 12 to 8 or set PTT gain to 0. I recommend setting PTT gain to 0 for now. Do that and post another PL file.
Mike
darkred87T
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- Oct 27, 2003
According the maunal, the ECM will attempt to correct any changes you make with the T-Pro while it's in closed loop. It will always try to maintain a 14.7:1 AF ratio. So if I try to lean it out with thte T-PRO in closed loop, the ECM will ad fuel to compemsate. So I guess the advantage of running open loop would be to take control away from the ecm and give it to the T-Pro.
BTW, I don't see anywhere where I can adjust "PTT" gain. Do some of us have different versions of the PRO?
BTW, I don't see anywhere where I can adjust "PTT" gain.
Do some of us have different versions of the PRO?darkred87T
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- Oct 27, 2003
Thanks, I'll try and run open loop see what happens. I wish I knew Capsers sold a plug and play harness before I cut and spliced my original wiring harness. Everthing but the MAF and IAT wires are tapped. MAF and IAT are cut and spliced for Speed Density. Pretty simple anyhow. I don't think my problem is WB is fighting NB because it ran like this before I even hooked up the T-Pro. I just thought I might be able to correct it once I got it hooked up.
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- Feb 18, 2006
What version do you have in the pro? It flashes when you power it up.
IMO your better off to let the ecm do it's thing (closed loop) for idle and cruise. Running open loop idle would be fine if you can't get it smoothed out in closed loop.
Generally you will see radical swinging afr's if you have a exhaust leak.
Vin7 I really don't think 13.9 AFR is rich enough to put raw gas in the oil.
IMO your better off to let the ecm do it's thing (closed loop) for idle and cruise. Running open loop idle would be fine if you can't get it smoothed out in closed loop.
Generally you will see radical swinging afr's if you have a exhaust leak.
Vin7 I really don't think 13.9 AFR
is rich enough to put raw gas in the oil.I agree with Rick. You're MUCH better off leaving the ECM in closed loop!! and getting that working properly first and only then letting the TPro take over PTT.
After a LOT of testing both ways, I have found that leaving the ECM in closed loop (which controls idle and cruise A/F) and letting the Pro handle WOT A/F is a MUCH better alternative.
As for adjusting PTT, how do you make changes in the pro now? Are you making changes on the TPro front panel or are you making changes via Tuner Pro software on your laptop?
After a LOT of testing both ways, I have found that leaving the ECM in closed loop (which controls idle and cruise A/F) and letting the Pro handle WOT A/F is a MUCH better alternative.
As for adjusting PTT, how do you make changes in the pro now? Are you making changes on the TPro front panel or are you making changes via Tuner Pro software on your laptop?
But still.... That's rediculously rich for any idling time to speak of, and for the cruising time from your pit to the starting line!!!!
Even with a stone cold open loop start up (what the stock ECM does), my A/F never go much richer than mid 12's, and that's only for a minute or two while it's warming up.
darkred87T
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- Oct 27, 2003
What version do you have in the pro? It flashes when you power it up.
IMO your better off to let the ecm do it's thing (closed loop) for idle and cruise. Running open loop idle would be fine if you can't get it smoothed out in closed loop.
Generally you will see radical swinging afr's if you have a exhaust leak.
Vin7 I really don't think 13.9 AFR
I wish it would run smooth in closed loop. It's supposed to right? I do have a pretty good exhaust leak between the turbo and header which I guess would screw up the WB being it's in the DP. The surface of the header flange is all eaten away and I get water spattered all over the right side valve cover from it spitting.
Rescue is on the way though. My ATR headers should be arriving today. :smile: I'm gonna try lowering the BLMS which should take fuel away and raise the INT. It hovers around 107.
I don't mean to go off topic here but I keep wondering if I have the cam sensor set right. I'm pretty sure I do but if it's not adjusted properly would it cause a rich condition like this?
Vin7 I really don't think 13.9 AFR
I agree, but it is rich enough that you can smell the exhaust at idle. :tongue: I guess I left that part out. My oil's thick
I was referring to 11.5 afr diluting the oil even if Sean doesn't daily drive it, what do you think about that?
Mike
I wish it would run smooth in closed loop. It's supposed to right? I do have a pretty good exhaust leak between the turbo and header which I guess would screw up the WB being it's in the DP. The surface of the header flange is all eaten away and I get water spattered all over the right side valve cover from it spitting.
This is a bit of information to leave out. Yeah, I would wait until you get the exhaust situated and wait to see how that affects the sensor readings.
I would also take Sean up on his offer to stop by. That way he can help you make sure you have the latest mafpro update and download all your settings so we can see what the mafpro is trying to do. You can just take the mafpro box over there and he can plug his harness in so you don't have to drive you car.
Mike
- Joined
- May 28, 2001
Yep..
"I do have a pretty good exhaust leak between the turbo and header. .
I keep wondering if I have the cam sensor set right. I'm pretty sure I do but.."
117 posts, and now these "revelations"???
Mike, I agree!
"I do have a pretty good exhaust leak between the turbo and header. .
I keep wondering if I have the cam sensor set right. I'm pretty sure I do but.."
117 posts, and now these "revelations"???
darkred87T
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- Oct 27, 2003
I can tell you first hand 11.5 AF dillutes the oil.
I was just thinking. If the car is running off the NB02, any exhaust leak after the header should'nt effect how it runs becuase it's after the 02 sensor. However, the NB02 is right near the leak!! I wonder if that's what the problem is.
Eh, it runs rich in open loop also so I guess that shoots that theory.Sean, I'll send you PM, maybe I can stop by sometime. It would be nice to get this straightened out before Island opens up. They might even already open.
- Joined
- Feb 18, 2006
If the leak is at the header/turbo flange it will effect the nb.
