BP Fuels with Invigorate.....

[Tom87GN]

This may piss of some folks if the topic has already been discussed......so I'll just apologize up front before the storm! :biggrin: I tried the search engine for about 15 minutes and came up with nothing, so here goes.

I have been wondering for a while what the hell "invigorate" was in BP fuels. They tell you their fuels are "better" because of the invigorate, but don't ever tell you what the hell it really is. The majority of the U.S. population just automatically think that it's better and go buy it without asking questions. I frequently purchase my fuel from BP because they don't buy foreign oil (at least that's what I've come to know through research) but never really paid any attention to the whole invigorate thing.

Anyway, I came across this article about higher-performance engines and boosted motors that is concerning to me.

What is BP Invigorate?

Just wondering if there is any validity to the article or if there is anything to be concerned about. There is talk about Shell fuels containing the same nitrogen technology as BP as well and that it is not good for highly boosted motors.

Once again, sorry if this topic has already been beaten to death. If anyone knows of a good thread or threads on this forum that have already dealt with this issue, if you could point me in that direction, it would be greatly appreciated.

 

[JDEstill]

hey Tom -

I don't know much of anything useful here, but I do know this: In a refinery they typically send the stuff that becomes gasoline through some treatment processes that remove sulfur and nitrogen. When I first saw the Shell banners promoting their new gasoline with nitrogen in it, I thought "WTF?". We go to a lot of effort to get the nitrogen out, and now you are putting it back in? Granted, the nitrogen may be in a different form that makes it useful, but still - on the surface, without additional knowledge, it seems dumb. On the other hand, there is a ton of nitrogen already present in the combustion process - air is 78% nitrogen after all. And that's all I have to say about that.

John

 

[Tom87GN]

hey Tom -

I don't know much of anything useful here, but I do know this: In a refinery they typically send the stuff that becomes gasoline through some treatment processes that remove sulfur and nitrogen. When I first saw the Shell banners promoting their new gasoline with nitrogen in it, I thought "WTF?". We go to a lot of effort to get the nitrogen out, and now you are putting it back in? Granted, the nitrogen may be in a different form that makes it useful, but still - on the surface, without additional knowledge, it seems dumb. On the other hand, there is a ton of nitrogen already present in the combustion process - air is 78% nitrogen after all. And that's all I have to say about that.

John

There then HAS to be a decent reason why the refineries would try to get the nitrogen out of the end product. I realize that there is a buttload of nitrogen in the air our motors (and our lungs) breathe in regularly, but maybe there is a reason to be concerned over adding an additional amount of some form of nitrogen to the mix.

Maybe I should just convert my car to run on natural spring water so that I know there isn't anything crazy in there.....

 

[XLR8]

I think their new additive is salt water.

 

[ijames]

The nitrogen and sulfur that they try to get out in the refinery is mostly in the form of polynuclear aromatics that make soot and NOx and SOx smog when they burn, and tend to deactivate catalysts in the converters. The nitrogen that Shell is bragging about is in their newest detergent package to keep the valves and combustion chambers clean, and apparently it doesn't make much if any "bad" stuff when it burns, compared to the benefits of keeping everything clean. The Invigorate article linked to above, and the Shell article linked to in that article, are pretty light on details, speculate on one possible chemical structure that they then go on to speculate might be bad, and keep making the same mistake people who think alcohols provide oxygen to the combustion process just like nitrous oxide does (a pet peeve of mine ). They also confuse adjustments the ecm might make for air fuel ratio with adjustments for octane. To me the real bottom line is that even if Shell and BP are using more than the minimum required amount of detergent it is still going to be a pretty tiny fraction of the gasoline, and the gasoline still has to meet the R, M, R+M/2 octane specs, and all the other EPA volatility and other specs so I doubt seriously if you could tell any difference in fuel mileage (if you could, they would have trumpeted that in those articles). It may run cleaner, and anything past that is just marketing hype.

 

[Turbo V6 Camaro]

i can't run BP in my car, it gets knock and i have run 4-5 less degrees of timing then gas i get at shell

 

[S10xGN]

There then HAS to be a decent reason why the refineries would try to get the nitrogen out of the end product...

I work on a catalytic reformer unit (converts naphtha to gasoline), the actual reformer section has platinum catalyst that can be poisoned by any trace amount of sulfur, nitrogen or metals (0 to 5 ppm's) or larger amounts (100 ppm's+) of water. We have a pretreater that removes all those.

I, too, have no idea what the nitrogen additive "concept" is all about...

 

[novaderrik]

first they got people to put nitrogen in their tires... now they are putting it in our gas.

 

[Whut]

I run Shell pretty much exclusively in my Buick and it seems to like it more than any other fuel. If Shell is not around I will get just enough gas to get home from another station.

I have been looking for an alternative, if anyone has suggestions and why they use it please let me know.

 

[Turbo V6 Camaro]

I run Shell pretty much exclusively in my Buick and it seems to like it more than any other fuel. If Shell is not around I will get just enough gas to get home from another station.

I have been looking for an alternative, if anyone has suggestions and why they use it please let me know.

same here, if no shell I'll use sunoco

 

[Whut]

same here, if no shell I'll use sunoco

That would be nice if it werent for the closest Sunoco to me being 119 miles away. :frown:

 

[GNWANTED]

I have used BP 93 for many years and going on 2 years in the Buick and never a problem I will not use any other

 

[aminga]

Anyway, I came across this article about higher-performance engines and boosted motors that is concerning to me.

What is BP Invigorate?

Just wondering if there is any validity to the article or if there is anything to be concerned about. There is talk about Shell fuels containing the same nitrogen technology as BP as well and that it is not good for highly boosted motors.

That article was big on speculation about what COULD happen and a little short on fact.

Like any other combo change if you back of the tune on a gas switch and start over you'd be OK.

 

[we4Mateo]

Gasoline has slowly gotten worse since I started driving many moons ago. We had 93 or better everywhere then, and all we have here now is 91 BP. No Shell, no Sunoco, unless I drive significantly over state lines and then it's still just 92. I think BP is the best alternative here though. My GTP Grand Prix and the Buick have all indicated via scangauge a benefit to BP gas, although that's not compared to Shell or Sunoco. When I drove to the Nationals in '08 and could get 93 everywhere in Shell and 94 in Sunoco, they both performed awesome and I added 4 degrees of timing in all gears when I was down there with 0 knock and then no alky; great backroads driving around Bowling Green BTW to use the extra timing. With alky now though, the 91 BP works fine, all the time.

 

[87Turbo-TWE4]

I have to use either BP or Chevron. My car hates Shell.

 

[rhunt]

BP Gas

I used Amoco gas in my Duster 340 back in the dark ages with no problems. I use BP in my GN and my Camaro Z-28 with no knocks or problems. Both cars run super fast and furious!!!!!!!

Roger

 

[Roger]

I think their new additive is salt water.

You may be closer to correct in your analysis than anyone else.

 

[Roger]

i run shell pretty much exclusively in my buick and it seems to like it more than any other fuel. If shell is not around i will get just enough gas to get home from another station.

I have been looking for an alternative, if anyone has suggestions and why they use it please let me know.

lp.