Where's the power? Part duex.

[Ttype83]

Let it go down to 1/4 tank, then you only need to get robbed for 5 gals...it's almost $8 here..glad mine is a meth head :biggrin:

 

[scojack_2001]

If that 102 octane is leaded, it will kill the o2 pretty quick. I'd suggest picking up a Denso o2 sometime and swap out the old one. Denso's are lead resistant and work better than a Delco does. Just a thought.

If your getting knock, I'd say the IC is probably lined with oil. You can clean it out with any number of solvents, but Ive found kerosene works best for me. Seemed to help my car a bit.

You can go to your local paint store or Home Depot/Lowes and get some zylene. Mix a gallon or two with you 93 pump gas and see it the knock goes away. Also check (or recheck) all your mounts to see if anything is banging around. The zylene may be a bit more expensive than the 102, but its an option for you at the least.

BTW, I agree with Ttype83; having a meth head TR is great...

 

[meanchicken]

I really appreciate all the great ideas guys. I'll go chase a few things and post back my findings.

How do I get the IC out of the car. I know it hasn't been cleaned in 20 years. It looks simple enough but I'm the kind of home mechanic who will unbolt 10 things I didn't need to in order to get something out...you don't wanna hear what I went through trying to get the air filter out of the stock inlet can the first time out....talk about drama.

It's also worth mentioning that I still have a 180* thermostat and the car runs at about 185- 190* +/- a few.
I know, I know....get a 160* in there...

Tim

 

[scojack_2001]

I really appreciate all the great ideas guys. I'll go chase a few things and post back my findings.

How do I get the IC out of the car. I know it hasn't been cleaned in 20 years. It looks simple enough but I'm the kind of home mechanic who will unbolt 10 things I didn't need to in order to get something out...you don't wanna hear what I went through trying to get the air filter out of the stock inlet can the first time out....talk about drama.

It's also worth mentioning that I still have a 180* thermostat and the car runs at about 185- 190* +/- a few.
I know, I know....get a 160* in there...

Tim

Taking out the IC is cake. Its only four bolts. One on the drivers side, two on the passengers side, and one on the bottom. Im pretty sure they are 10mm head. And you'll need a 7mm for the IC shroud as well. You can remove the screen while its out. Just disconnect the turbo hoses and take the up-pipe off and have at it. Only takes a little time. The IC will come right out the top.

If you good with a die grinder you can port that to give a free airflow improvement. Ive found kerosene works best to clean it out, two gallons should be plenty. Get the inside real good and do the fins on the outside. Then rinse it out with the garden hose. Turn it upside down to let it dry for an hour or so. You can use a shopvac if you want as well. After thats all done, give it a rattlecan paintjob while its out. High temp engine paint works best, in my experience.

Get some new IC hoses as well, if you need to or just want to. I got a set last week from Darin @ RacePartSolutions - Fast Parts At Discount Prices, and he'll set you up. Not exactly the cheapest, but HIGH QUALITY hoses and T-bolt clamps.

Changing the serp belt is cake with the IC out of the way as well. Goodyear Gatorbacks are great belts. Also try to look over everything while its out as well. Pay particular attention to the IC fan, it may be cracked after 20yrs.

Have fun, and good luck.

P.S. Swapping the thermostat will be so easy with the up-pipe out of the way. Get a new 160° and a new neck if you want to. I got mine from Metco. Really nice. Get some new clamps for the upper rad hose and S-hose as well. The S-hose may take some convincing to get out. I know mine did yesterday...

Let us know how it works out. Hope all this helps.

If your IC scoop is separating, Ive got a fix for that for under $10. PM me for details...

 

[buzzman]

i am surprised that you are only getting 5degkr at 16 lbs of boost if you are only running 91oct. you are getting some good advice here, but add some octane before assuming you have a kr issue. i run a basic stock setup and must add at least one gallon of 100 unleaded to 6 gallons of sunoco 94. if i don't if get slight kr also.

 

[alb84]

The whole story sounds to me like a leak in the intake hoses on the boosted side. Is your IC mounted solidly with all bolts and brackets intact? Sounds like it is moving under boost, and sealing to different degrees when it goes back to vacume. That would also explain the varied idle counts. When you park it for a while it can stabilize to a degree, then it does fine until a few WOT pulls, and building heat in the engine bay. I have chased that particular gremlin several times on a number of boosted cars. Just a thought.
Danny

 

[meanchicken]

Taking out the IC is cake. Its only four bolts. One on the drivers side, two on the passengers side, and one on the bottom. Im pretty sure they are 10mm head. And you'll need a 7mm for the IC shroud as well. You can remove the screen while its out. Just disconnect the turbo hoses and take the up-pipe off and have at it. Only takes a little time. The IC will come right out the top.

If you good with a die grinder you can port that to give a free airflow improvement. Ive found kerosene works best to clean it out, two gallons should be plenty. Get the inside real good and do the fins on the outside. Then rinse it out with the garden hose. Turn it upside down to let it dry for an hour or so. You can use a shopvac if you want as well. After thats all done, give it a rattlecan paintjob while its out. High temp engine paint works best, in my experience.

Get some new IC hoses as well, if you need to or just want to. I got a set last week from Darin @ RacePartSolutions - Fast Parts At Discount Prices, and he'll set you up. Not exactly the cheapest, but HIGH QUALITY hoses and T-bolt clamps.

Changing the serp belt is cake with the IC out of the way as well. Goodyear Gatorbacks are great belts. Also try to look over everything while its out as well. Pay particular attention to the IC fan, it may be cracked after 20yrs.

Have fun, and good luck.

P.S. Swapping the thermostat will be so easy with the up-pipe out of the way. Get a new 160° and a new neck if you want to. I got mine from Metco. Really nice. Get some new clamps for the upper rad hose and S-hose as well. The S-hose may take some convincing to get out. I know mine did yesterday...

Let us know how it works out. Hope all this helps.

If your IC scoop is separating, Ive got a fix for that for under $10. PM me for details...

Good stuff, Scott.
Thanks!

i am surprised that you are only getting 5degkr at 16 lbs of boost if you are only running 91oct. you are getting some good advice here, but add some octane before assuming you have a kr issue. i run a basic stock setup and must add at least one gallon of 100 unleaded to 6 gallons of sunoco 94. if i don't if get slight kr also.

I hear you loud and clear, but facts are, this car has needed a lot of spring cleaning since I bought in in October. It's in great overall shape, but aside from regular fluid changes and keeping the car covered or garaged, the previous owner did not do much to keep the maintenance up and did absolutely nothing to improve the performance. I think a lot of these things that I'm finding flew under his radar since he rarely pushed the car in the 16 years he owned it.

The IC hoses are original (as were the fuel pump, injectors, spark plug wires, shocks, etc. before I replaced them) and I know that the IC has never been out of the car for a cleaning. The stuff in my signature has all been done by me since I bought the car a few months ago. He did recently do the radiator, heater core, fan belt and headliner, but other than that....it was all original.

The whole story sounds to me like a leak in the intake hoses on the boosted side. Is your IC mounted solidly with all bolts and brackets intact? Sounds like it is moving under boost, and sealing to different degrees when it goes back to vacume. That would also explain the varied idle counts. When you park it for a while it can stabilize to a degree, then it does fine until a few WOT pulls, and building heat in the engine bay. I have chased that particular gremlin several times on a number of boosted cars. Just a thought.
Danny

Entirely possible. I'll find out when I get around to yanking the IC.

Thanks, Danny.

Appreciate all the great guidance, guys!
Tim

 

[Ttype83]

I got my IC hoses at Napa, no waiting :biggrin:
Your's is one of the few threads that I look for

 

[meanchicken]

I got my IC hoses at Napa, no waiting :biggrin:
Your's is one of the few threads that I look for

Thanks for that tip.
I'll check NAPA tomorrow....maybe they have my 160* stat also.

Actually good to know that folks find this thread informative or interesting. Part of my intent with this thread and my previous "Where's the Power" thread is to have them serve as a good guideline for others who might run into these issues. Sort of a new guy troubleshooting guide.

 

[Junior Samples]

Actually good to know that folks find this thread informative or interesting.

More like comic relief:biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:

 

[bsdlinux]

I know, I know....get a 160* in there...

Tim

If I was closer I would trade you, I need to go warmer :biggrin:

 

[meanchicken]

More like comic relief:biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:

Ha!
Yup...I have a knack for getting laughed at over stupid human tricks....been doing it my whole life....I'm good at it!

 

[Junior Samples]

Hey ya havent blown it up yet have ya?!!!!

 

[meanchicken]

Hey ya havent blown it up yet have ya?!!!!

Don't jinx me, bro!
Don't jinx me!!!!!


Actually, thanks to all the help on this board and all the stuff I've fixed over these past few months, this GN is honestly running and driving like a champ compared to when I started.
....just gotta solve this last little thing and then it's upgrade time!!!:biggrin:

My 68 Camaro is getting jealous though.:frown:

 

[Underboost]

Don't jinx me, bro!
Don't jinx me!!!!!


Actually, thanks to all the help on this board and all the stuff I've fixed over these past few months, this GN is honestly running and driving like a champ compared to when I started.
....just gotta solve this last little thing and then it's upgrade time!!!:biggrin:

My 68 Camaro is getting jealous though.:frown:

Oh Yeah? Whats gonna be your first upgrade Tim? :smile:

 

[meanchicken]

Well...I should really also replace the timing gears first...but....

The cat and cat back exhaust are first on the upgrade list.

Cat is 20 years old....exhaust is an OEM set up with rotted out old school turbo mufflers and cheezy looking Monte Carlo tail pipe extensions. As you know, all the guys in the Southwestern section like to laugh at them....even my wife and kids teeze me about them now...

So I'll upgrade to a newer Hooker system and end up fixing some stuff too. Probably will do the exhaust elbow porting at the same time.

After that...Alky and new matching TT chip, RJC Power Plate, Dutt neck, cold air intake...I'll keep going until it's trans fixing time.

 

[Ttype83]

..I'll keep going until it's trans fixing time.

I didn't make it that far..blow up the trans, so I upgraded the TC, DP, exhaust and ported the elbow. Only have the valve springs left and the stretch IC left.

 

[meanchicken]

Well....stopped by Spoolfools place today to give him his MAF back.
I was still whining about the KR issue that I have not taken the time to dig into. I've been keeping the car out of KR while I drive it by avoiding WOT, but have not really gone back under the hood in several days while celebrating my kids birthdays these last 2 weekends.

So Spoolfool decides he wants to take a look to see if there is anything obvious going on.

As soon as I open the hood under the California sun...every friggin vacuum hose that I have not replaced yet all kinda stood up and started waiving, "Well howdy doo! Stupid Chicken hasn't replaced us yet and keeps snivelin' about how his car runs funny."

Honestly, I have looked at these hoses in my dimly lit garage dozens of times and could have sworn that I had gotten all the truly suspect ones out already...I was wrong. A little mid day sun makes rotten rubber stand out like a baboons rosey butt.

Spoolfool was looking at me like, "Wadda putz. Let me slap you." And I felt and looked like a kid who just got busted cheating on a test.:redface:

So any way...I hit Pep Boys on the way home and bought several feet of the right hose sizes. After Pep Boys, I had to act responsible and ignore a WRX challenging me and keep out of WOT.

I replaced everything but that molded 2 hose assembly on the EGR (does anyone sell those?). And all of the hoses I replaced are rotten and cracking. Even the one that goes down to the ball under the charcoal cannister.

When I was replacing the hoses on the vacuum block, I detached the vacuum block from the intake. As I lifted it off, oil came pouring out..enough to trackle all the way dowsn the side of the intake....I take it this is not normal....?

I also need to replace the three check ball fittings just for sanity sake.
Spoolfool schooled me on these getting sticky with age and creating vacuum leaks when they malfunction.

Took the GN for a test run after replacing the hoses...it's much better. The O2's are way up compared to before....not sure why. Running pretty rich so I'll be re=setting the TT chip to get the fuel I added back out.

Next on the to-do. Pull IC and clean it out and install a 160* stat to cool her down.....and replace the driver side motor mount....spoolfool is sure it's cracked by the amount of movement the engine has while running.

Tim

 

[scojack_2001]

Sounds like a good start. I had some help doing my vac lines on a Saturday in August in a Hooters parking lot. That was fun. The oil coming out of the vacuum block IS NOT normal. Oil is getting in there somehow. Have you replaced your PCV valve yet? do that and add a checkvalve as well. Just remember to ziptie everything. Also you can remove the factory PS breather in the valve cover and replace it with a little K&N. I think Kirbans sells the kit that has the cover for the hole on the inlet bell. Or you could just buy a billet on. Port match the compressor cover too, and use some RTV to seal the bell up. Works good.

And you need to clean the IC, really really really good. Kerosene works best, in my experience. Port that too while its out, and get some quality hoses and clamp. RPS sells some great stuff, although it isnt exactly the cheapest. Also since there is that much oil in the vac block, take the TB and plenum off and clean those as well. Its a good possibility theres some play in the shaft causing some vac leaks. You can get it ported to 62mm if you like. Might consider a PowerPlate as well. Theres alot of little things you can do to make things right.

The 160° stat is easy, but the S-hose might take a good bit of convincing to get off. Might have to replace that as well. Its a good thing to have a magnetic pick-up tool real close by at the time. Get a new water neck as well, its cheap insurance. Metco sells a new neck with a clamp for $30 I think, good stuff. Also check your upper hose and get new clamps, again cheap insurance. My clamps were original...

Drivers side motor mount is cake. Might want to get a tie down strap as well. Just dont use the bolt in the kit. I got my eyebolt from Graingers, it'll support 1,400lbs. and its 3/8" diameter. I can PM you the part number if you like.

All it takes is time and patience. If I were closer, I'd gladly give you a hand. Im about tired of the 25° days here in Delaware...

 

[Ttype83]

I replaced everything but that molded 2 hose assembly on the EGR (does anyone sell those?). And all of the hoses I replaced are rotten and cracking. Even the one that goes down to the ball under the charcoal cannister.


Tim

If you find those hoses post it up, I need them as well :biggrin:
Glad you are getting it do